OK, it just randomly occured to me, we are to assume he went into the hatch at some point prior to our Lostaways crashing, but not too long ago as he was with Jack in the stadium, rough guess, any time between 1-8 years ago?

He had to get into his bunker, couldn't have used a rope to climb down if there was no ladder when he arrived, how would he close the hatch and cover it up? An accomplice?

If the ladder was there when he went down originally, where did it go when it broke off? A ladder that long would be almost impossible to move out of the narrow opening at the bottom, surely.

There COULD be another entry (in fact I'm guessing that's certain), but if there isn't wouldn't that mean he is trapped in there? In fact, IF there was no other way out, he might see Jack/Locke/Kate as a way of getting out, as their rope is still dangling there.

But would he want to go out? He seemed to be operating something on the computer, obviously a routine he has gone through for a while. Which begs the question, would he let the hatch-gang leave, knowing that a) they know he's there, and b) anyone could climb down at any time?

So many questions! What a great premiere.

Many questions, there definately is!

I agree that there MUST be a second or possibly even more entrances to the hatch.

I think there is someone else with Desmond. There must be..

But where would they get their food? Would they have like a 10-year supply? Highly doubtful ..

Let's not forget that rope/wire thing in the ocean. That has to be anchored down to something. Maybe another part of the hatch??

OK, crazy thought, but maybe...

Ethan was in there with Desmond, doing whatever they were doing, taking their shots to stop getting infected. One day, Ethan is outside, maybe he had to fix something, but he gets infected. He starts going nutjob, then guess what, a bunch of folk crash land, and Ethan in all his new found crazy decides to stalk the pregnant girl. He knows his way around the island, knows the secrets.

It possibly explains a few things, like where he came from originally, why he was mentally unhinged.

Just throwin' out some theories, boy did I miss this show in the summer

Did you see the egg on oceanicflight815.com? There is a supposedly confidential draft and it implies there are 2 Jacks. Something about Jack running in terror only to turn and face HIS OWN face. If that's true, then maybe there is two Desmonds. Maybe that's the Man of Faith Man of Science. Faith is the one Jack met in the stadium - told Jack he needed to believe in Miracles. Man of Science would be the guy underground !!!??? That guy has been there since the 70's - you can tell by the stereo system and records.

I don't think they're on an island either.

Right after the explosion, when Desmond was looking through what looked like a periscope, it seemed to me that he was looking at several different places (perhaps different hatches or entrance/exits?) before he focused in on "The Hatch" where our Lostaways were. So my theory is that there are multiple ways in and out.

Yea ive been saying for a long time that there are other entrances into the hatch.....that was made clear to me by the way the hatch is made....it has no way of opening it from the outside...so....theres another entrance somewhere, probably several.

"The Hatch" we know from season one has to be a back door, long since covered up. So there must be a front door, someplace else on the island.

Yeah, I agree that someone else has to be down there. And why would Desmond have a bunkbed with no one to bunk with? Practically speaking. Plus, the guy in the beginning had dirty blond hair, like Sawyer. Desmond, as I remember, had curlyish brown hair. Inconsistency. The writers couldnt have overlooked that.
Plus, another odd thing.The guy in the hatch seemed to be going through a morning routine, but outside the hatch it was 3 hours till sunset. Hmm...
I am very confused.

He and Ethan could have been together. They know about the crash and Ethan goes out to see if there are any kids. He sees Claire and decides to bide his time waiting for her to deliver. He thinks she is in labor and kidnaps her. She gets away...Ethan trails her back and gets shot.

Desmond may be in the hatch not knowing any of this..still waiting for Ethan to come back.

It seems there would have to be a larger, main entrance in order to get the furniture, exercise bike, washer/dryer and other assorted large items into the main room of the hatch. Perhaps the entrance that Kate used was/is a backdoor escape or a maintenance entrance. It clearly hasn't been used for quite a while

Yeah, I agree that someone else has to be down there. And why would Desmond have a bunkbed with no one to bunk with? Practically speaking. Plus, the guy in the beginning had dirty blond hair, like Sawyer. Desmond, as I remember, had curlyish brown hair. Inconsistency. The writers couldnt have overlooked that.
Plus, another odd thing.The guy in the hatch seemed to be going through a morning routine, but outside the hatch it was 3 hours till sunset. Hmm...
I am very confused.

Because the monster comes out at night! :) I don't know maybe he's scheduled to bust out the monster.

I think it might be more along the lines of a first shift, second shift type scenerio like in the Navy or something like that. He was waking up to take his shift at whatever, and the other person would go to bed in the other bunk. ?????

What if Clare was actually kept in the hatch while she was being held by Ethan? Would explain where she was the entire time...

It looked though like our hatch had ladder missing due to it being pulled down into the hatch like the people their did not want whatever was outside in there with them right? If they were suppose to seal the people in wouldn't you "pull the ladder up" from the top?

What's killing me is " ARE THOSE KATE'S SHOES? IF SO WHY IS SHE OUT OF THEM?"
and the biggie " Is Desmond's use of BROTHER more significant then we think?"

I am not all that convinced anymore that Ethan was after the baby so much as he was after CLAIRE herself.

All i'm thinking right now is PLZ DONT KILL DESMOND LIKE THEY KILLED ETHAN!!! i want answers this time!!!

I haven't seen anyone mention this, so I'm going to throw out a theory that I've had for a long time which is supported perfectly by what we know.

It makes sense that there is a "front door" since the inhabitants inside obviously must have come and gone over the years to renew supplies (and upgrade their appliances). But how do they get in and out without infecting the island (or being infected by what's on the surface, whichever the case may be)? The sealed hatch(es) must remain closed at all times or the quarantine would be broken!

And how do they come and go undetected? Land a helicopter? No. Dock a ship? No.

And what about the interior? It's an underground cavern. Water forms caverns. The cavern floor is right at sea level, since the ground at the bottom of the hatch entryway was filled with water.

You see where I'm going with this?

I believe that the "front door" is a connecting chamber containing a large pool that leads directly into the ocean. The perfect place to dock a submersible. The inhabitants can come and go undetected without infecting (or being infected by) the island's surface.

A question about the quarantine: Who is being protected from some pathogen -- the people in the outside world or the people inside the hatch? The word "quarantine" was written on the inside of the hatch, where it would be visible only to the people within. If the people in the outside world were being protected from something in the hatch, you'd expect the word "quarantine" to appear on the hatch's top side. It's almost as if the outside world is the source of infection, and the space inside the hatch is a sanctuary of sorts.

Didn't Ethan come from the water in the episode where he killed Steve (or Scott)? This would help the theory that there is an underwater passage that allowed him to access the beach through the water.

Most importantly, why are Desmond's guns locked up in a safe? That safe was locked! Has he been trained to expect intruders?

OK, it just randomly occured to me, we are to assume he went into the hatch at some point prior to our Lostaways crashing, but not too long ago as he was with Jack in the stadium, rough guess, any time between 1-8 years ago?

He had to get into his bunker, couldn't have used a rope to climb down if there was no ladder when he arrived, how would he close the hatch and cover it up? An accomplice?

If the ladder was there when he went down originally, where did it go when it broke off? A ladder that long would be almost impossible to move out of the narrow opening at the bottom, surely.

There COULD be another entry (in fact I'm guessing that's certain), but if there isn't wouldn't that mean he is trapped in there? In fact, IF there was no other way out, he might see Jack/Locke/Kate as a way of getting out, as their rope is still dangling there.

But would he want to go out? He seemed to be operating something on the computer, obviously a routine he has gone through for a while. Which begs the question, would he let the hatch-gang leave, knowing that a) they know he's there, and b) anyone could climb down at any time?

So many questions! What a great premiere.



I dont think it coulda been that long because that would put Jack in mid 40s at least.

I haven't seen anyone mention this, so I'm going to throw out a theory that I've had for a long time which is supported perfectly by what we know.

It makes sense that there is a "front door" since the inhabitants inside obviously must have come and gone over the years to renew supplies (and upgrade their appliances). But how do they get in and out without infecting the island (or being infected by what's on the surface, whichever the case may be)? The sealed hatch(es) must remain closed at all times or the quarantine would be broken!

And how do they come and go undetected? Land a helicopter? No. Dock a ship? No.

And what about the interior? It's an underground cavern. Water forms caverns. The cavern floor is right at sea level, since the ground at the bottom of the hatch entryway was filled with water.

You see where I'm going with this?

I believe that the "front door" is a connecting chamber containing a large pool that leads directly into the ocean. The perfect place to dock a submersible. The inhabitants can come and go undetected without infecting (or being infected by) the island's surface.

I agree with this. I've said before that there's a "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea" quality
to the show. So people infected (with what?) are dumped on the island where they are
monitored (for some reason likely other than simply to prevent their escape). A submarine
(but, really, anything - even a ship - as this doesn't hinge on a cave) comes and goes with
supplies on occasion.

The only problem with this theory is that the underground chambers do not appear to be
hermetically sealed. It's probably impossible to keep an airborne pathogen out of the
hatch because there isn't what appears to be an airlock. One would expect an airlock
and probably jumpsuits at the bottom if that's the case.

I've thought for a while now that something in the sea is involved with what's happening on the island. The cable that Sayid finds, Joanna's drowning and the song "La Mer" have all suggested that there's something more than water out there.

I haven't seen anyone mention this, so I'm going to throw out a theory that I've had for a long time which is supported perfectly by what we know.

It makes sense that there is a "front door" since the inhabitants inside obviously must have come and gone over the years to renew supplies (and upgrade their appliances). But how do they get in and out without infecting the island (or being infected by what's on the surface, whichever the case may be)? The sealed hatch(es) must remain closed at all times or the quarantine would be broken!

And how do they come and go undetected? Land a helicopter? No. Dock a ship? No.

And what about the interior? It's an underground cavern. Water forms caverns. The cavern floor is right at sea level, since the ground at the bottom of the hatch entryway was filled with water.

You see where I'm going with this?

I believe that the "front door" is a connecting chamber containing a large pool that leads directly into the ocean. The perfect place to dock a submersible. The inhabitants can come and go undetected without infecting (or being infected by) the island's surface.

Jumpandyell,
I have also had the subbase/submarine theory, but with the cable running into the ocean from ontop of the island, you would think if they were hiding things they would run the power cable or communication cable via the cavern entrance?
Just a thought,
Scuzzle

It looked though like our hatch had ladder missing due to it being pulled down into the hatch like the people their did not want whatever was outside in there with them right? If they were suppose to seal the people in wouldn't you "pull the ladder up" from the top?

What's killing me is " ARE THOSE KATE'S SHOES? IF SO WHY IS SHE OUT OF THEM?"
and the biggie " Is Desmond's use of BROTHER more significant then we think?"

I am not all that convinced anymore that Ethan was after the baby so much as he was after CLAIRE herself.

Think about it this way, with the bottom of the ladder missing, any intruder would have to "jump" the final few feet and with the water down there, would land with a kersplash, thus alerting the occupants of the hatch that someone had entered. If the ladder reached to the bottom, someone could stealthily enter.

Totally agree with the Ethan wanted Clarie theory. Charlie said so, in exactly those words. Which means Charlie might have also met Desmond, if Desmond and Ethan are in fact, the "they" that Charlie referred to. It will be interesting to watch Charlie's reaction upon meeting Desmond, to see if there is any recognition between the two of them. If I am right, and Desmond and Ethan were the "they", Desmond thinks Charlie is dead.

Hmm... I like the idea of having to go through a pool of water, travel under the island, and up to the surface of the water in order to get under the hatch. I wonder if a submersible is required? Could you scuba your way there? Perhaps by following the cable that leads into the ocean???

Yea ive been saying for a long time that there are other entrances into the hatch.....that was made clear to me by the way the hatch is made....it has no way of opening it from the outside...so....theres another entrance somewhere, probably several.

Well, we know there's an entrance where that THING tried to drag Locke down underground, right?

Interesting that Locke and Boon stumbled onto the hatch when they were tracking Ethan. He found two trails. Another interesting tid bit... the Others on the raft included a pair of identical twins.

Though my personal beleife? I think Locke and Kate stumbled onto Dick Cheyney's undisclosed location.

few things a) desmond is just a younger dick cheney.
b) I agree with the above that the hatch complex is very well built. The beach cable appears to have been tossed there. It seems more logical to belong to the french lady (where is she anyways?) than to the hatch.

c) There may be no jumpsuits / airlock by the hatch becuase it was never an enterence/exit... maybe it was only an emergency exit? The inhabitants only would leave if they had to evacuate the island. They removed the ladder long ago because a) it rusted and they never replaced it b) needed supplies elsewhere.

d) I like the sub base idea. You could scuba out, I am sure it isnt too deep and meet with a sub later. This goes well with the death of scott/steve.

e) the 2 trails thing I never thought of before and it strikes me like a load of bricks. That is very well thought out! It still leaves the questions a) how did he get in b) how did he get down. But thoes could easily be explained. I am liking that, I think the two were together, maybe thats how Charlie was strung up and jack was beaten up all without claire escaping.

f) I agree, it looks like at least 2 people were there a) pingpong paddle b) bunkbeds c) more guns than 1 person can use.

g) I cant help but feel as if the gov't/corporation who they work for has long since forgotten about them. I cant imagine that they would not be upgradded in ~20 years.

h) Has anyone estabilished a timeline of the whole story? I think that would be very helpful in figuring out what is going on

i) anyone else thing that the creative team browse the message boards looking for ideas? I bet they do and think its brilliant on their part!

If you find a timeline out there, please either post the link or private message me.

In the mean time I am off to check out screen captures: http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&cat=40

Most importantly, why are Desmond's guns locked up in a safe? That safe was locked! Has he been trained to expect intruders?

It reminds me of what the police and the military often do, which is that they keep their weapons locked up in a gun room. That way, they can control access to them.



And what about the interior? It's an underground cavern. Water forms caverns. The cavern floor is right at sea level, since the ground at the bottom of the hatch entryway was filled with water.


I wouldn't necessarily assume that. When Jack is walking around at the bottom of the hatch, water is constantly seen dripping from the ceiling. I think the water at the bottom of the hatch is just a puddle formed by dripping water. It is also possible that the hatch leaks, and that could have rusted away part of the ladder.

Finally, what did everyone think of the large steel pipes in the hatch. They look like steam pipes. I noticed at one point that there was some type of pressure guage or pressure relief valve attached to one of the pipes, with a wire attached to it.

Back to the Ethan tie-in to all of the hatch stuff. I recall that Claire was having "dreams" that someone was injecting her or her baby. Likely clue and possibly related to whatever Desmond was injecting into himself.

The pipes could have been just about anything. I would guess they were not steam simply because steam piped usually are heavily insulated and make the space around them very hot.

Regardless of what is in them I think we can draw the conclusion that a pipe that size caries a liquid (most likely), and is capable of supporting a large system/structure. Of course thats no surprise to us.

As a side note it seemed odd to have piped between the hatch and the living space. This leads me to think that either a) they were there for a reason (and since the camera looked that way i suspect they play some role) or b) this hatch is like the backdoor to a resturant. It gets you in, but you dont get the scenic route. I still think its a rarely used back door/escape hatch... my 2 cents.

What if Clare was actually kept in the hatch while she was being held by Ethan? Would explain where she was the entire time...

Good idea..but how did she get out?



So is Claire 'special'? (I'm begining to think the whole bunch of them are 'special' in one way or another.:undecide:

I have wondered why Ethan's first words to Charlie in 'Homecoming' wasn't something along the lines of "Why aren't you dead?" If it was Desi who did the stringing up...then it might make more sense...

Does any of this have anything to do with that cable..the one where one end was in the sea and the other buried underground? Did it go to another part of the underground system?

Let's not forget that rope/wire thing in the ocean. That has to be anchored down to something. Maybe another part of the hatch??

I may be wrong, which is very likely, but last year when I was learning science, we were learning about electricty and how it travels,:drowsy: , I was listening ,(for once,)and they mentioned that they would lay wires across the bottem of the ocean to help electricity travel. Does that make any sense?:cnfused1:

Hope you got some ideas from this.