Long Lost List Episode Observations

Data will be collected from this and other episode threads and added to this outline for inclusion in the Long Lost List, an upcoming Lost website encyclopedia of show trivia. Only fact based data that is observable in episodes and/or confirmed by VIPs is included in the LLL. Credit will be given to your username if we copy your original material.

Please honor copyrights and link / cite all references for outside sources. Thank you for your assistance.

General Episode and Character Info

Unsubtitled Translations

Flashback Cast

Red Shirts & Supporting Cast

Secrets

Character Connections

Visions, Hallucinations and Dreams

Character Info:
--> Symbolic tattoos, clothing or jewelry
--> Meaning of names
--> Birthdays / ages
--> Employment history

Philosophy & History References

Literature, Film & TV References

Art, Graphic Art and Comics

Songs of Lost

Religious References

Weird Props and Recurring Imagery

Parallel Plots & Recurring Themes
--> Broken Families
--> Character Parallels
--> Free Will vs. Fate
--> Reasons for Being on the Plane
--> Recurring Phrases
--> Other

Numbers References

Games

Accidents

Misc. Symbolism

List Continued on next post...

Outline continued:

Major Lost Mysteries:
--> Monster / Security System
--> Polar Bear
--> Hatch
--> Whispers
--> Others
--> Black Rock

Misc. Unsolved Mysteries

People Puzzles:
--> Sceve: the Mystery of Scott and Steve
--> Walt's Special Powers?
-->Clues to Locke's Mysterious Condition
-->Clues to the Death of Dr. Christian Shephard

Character Travels & Island Exploration

Maps & Landmarks

Lost Timeline

Geography of Lost (Places They've Been or Mentioned)

Booze

Drugs

Sex

Food

Weapons

Fights

Lost Bondage / Captivity

Sickness/Injury

Hygiene

Automobiles

Island Technology / Inventions

The Morgue: Body Count and Funeral Rites

OK, let's keep our eyes and ears open. I've heard a radio promo and it sounds like a doozy. I'm ready.

ive found that the hardest episodes to ring out are the Jack and Locke ones. just constant information being thrown, literally takes all of us to get any of it.

when i was doing season one, although i didn't get past #9 Solitary on here, at home i went high, and #12 ATBCHDI was the most dreaded transcription.

Last week's ep. was a good pace. But i feel it in my lost bones. this one is gonna dump (sand) all over us
:taz:

ME----> :pimp:

OMG OMG OMG


It's sooooo Goood

General Episode and Character Info - Locke used to smoke cigarettes.
- Cooper, "What do you want?" Locke, "Why?" Cooper, "Do you think your the first person to be conned....You needed a father figure. I needed a kidney..........Get over it....Don't come back....you're not wanted" Dialogue might be in wrong order.
- Jack says to Locke as he leaves the Hatch, "Your on your own"
- Desmond believes that he and Calvin are saving the world, by pushing the buttons every 108 minutes.
- Desmond tells them to look behind the book titled, The turn of the screw. (Torture?)
- The Orientation film was 3 of 6. (reminds me of 7 of 9 on ST) This station is #3 Swan.
- I caught a few of the names and script off the film. Marvin Candle, Initiative, 1970 Gerald & Karen ????, University of Michigan, B.F. Skinner, Free Thinkers, Utopian, Alvar Monso/Alva Honzo, Multi-purpose Social Science, electromagnetic fluctuations, De Groots....
- There was an INCINDENT on the island resulting in the protocol of having to insert the numbers every 108 minutes. When the alarm sounds, they have 4 minutes to enter the numbers. The narrator uses the term, "in a timely fashion"
- The shifts were 540 days.
- The #3 Swan was originally a lab.
- Working on Meteorites, Parapsychology, Zoo-ology..........
- Ana Lucia woke up underwater after the crash, swam to shore and has been alone since?
- It is an Electromagnetic station and the when Des walks past the wall his fillings hurt. lol
- Desmond has a picture with a lady, in front of the Sydney Opera House?
- Jack heard the numbers from Hurley, saw them on the Hatch and didn't blink an eye when Desmond said them. Denial much?
- Jack says to Desmond, "..on faith alone"


Flashback Cast - Helen has anger problems she has fought for ?? years. She tells Locke she has to "keep a cork in it", cuz when she gets hot and bothered......?
- Andy the gatekeeper has been replaced or is off shift.
- Anthony Cooper relocated to escape Locke?

Red Shirts & Supporting Cast - Calvin is the pusher of the button who 3 years ago, finds Desmond on the beach after his sailboat crashes (on his race around the world) and orientates him to Hatch life and button pushing. Calvin is killed leaving Desmond alone to man his post.


Character Connections - Anthony Cooper conned Locke out of his kidney by pretending to be his biological father. Sawyer was a conman.


Literature, Film & TV References - The Third Policeman and The Turn the Screw.


Weird Props and Recurring Imagery - Helen gives Locke the KEY to her apartment as a 6 month anniversary present. It cost her a buck.

Parallel Plots & Recurring Themes
--> Broken Families - Locke said he never knew who his parents were. His birth mother and Anthony Cooper (not his father) conned him out of his kidney. Locke has a fake broken family, but it feels real to him.
--> Character Parallels
--> Free Will vs. Fate
--> Reasons for Being on the Plane
--> Recurring Phrases - Desmond, "See in you in another life brother, yeah" twice to Jack.
- Locke said his mother told him he was "special"
- Sawyer says to Ana Lucia, "You all right Sister?" (Desmond/brotha)
- Cooper, "What do you want?" Locke, "Why?" Cooper, "Do you think your the first person to be conned....You needed a father figure. I needed a kidney..........Get over it....Don't come back....you're not wanted" Dialogue might be in wrong order.~~~~Jack says to Locke as he leaves the Hatch, "Your on your own"~~~~Helen tells Locke, "You don't have to be alone"~~~Locke says to Jack that he doesn't want to do it alone.
- Helen tells Locke that he is scared but must make a CHOICE between his father or her. She tells him it's a LEAP OF FAITH I think Locke says, "I don't know what to do"
- Locke says, "This isn't what was supposed to happen" "What am I supposed to do" (he yelled something similar to the hatch and to the travel agent)
- Jack talking to Desmond says, "..on faith alone"
--> Other - Sawyers nicknames: He called Mr. Eko, "shaft" and said he would get a "howdy doody"

Numbers References - 3 of 6 Orientation.
Station #3.
Desmond crashed on the island 3 years ago.
1970 is when Gerald and Karen??
540 day shifts in the hatch.
They have 4 minutes after the alarm goes, to enter the numbers and disarm the "end of the world" machine.
Helen buys Locke a 6 month anniversary present, which costs her a buck ($1.00). Desmond says in 15 minutes Jack will be very right or very wrong (opposites)
The numbers you see from the counter are: 98 - 97 - 84 - 50 - 49 - 48 - 47 - 25 - 24 - 6 - 5 - 3:59 - 3:58 - 3:57 - 2:15 - 2:14 - 1:41 - 1:40 -

Games - OT From season 1 cap of Mr. Paiks office, the double screen is rumored to be a stock ticker...... Stock Ticker is a game
- Jack says the button pushing, is a mind game.

Sickness/Injury - Locke attends a support group (Adult children of Abusive parents)?

The shifts are 540 days.Thats 108 x 5.Mean anything?

I doubt this means anything, but did anyone else catch the little tune that played at the beginning of the film strip? It's some of the music that we hear during some of the episodes. That little piano melody.

You also hear it in episode 2x01 after it pans up the hatch to show Locke and Jack's faces looking down at the beginning.

Ahh interesting! Did you guys find it weird that the film didn't tell you what would happen if you DIDN"T press the button? It really didn't go into all that much detail. I wonder if there are more 'orientation' type films down there in the hatch? That's the first thing I'd be looking for.

Not sure why someone is stating that Cooper was not Locke's biological father.
I'm pretty sure he was, if for no other reason than wanting his kidney particularly.
It's well known that the body has the lowest rate of rejection of transplanted organs when they are from a close family member and therefore have a shared DNA.

General Episode and Character Info
- Ana Lucia conned Sawyer, Jin and Mike into revealing their intentions, stealing Sawyers gun and going back to "the gang"
- Kate knocks Desmond on the back of the head with a rifle.
- Jack takes away the jar of ?? from Desmond in order to ransom some answers out of him.
- Jack said they were taking a "time out" Totally something a parent would say!!!!!
- Desmonds sailboat crashed into a reef on the island, Calvin came running out of the jungle yelling, "Hurry!, Hurry!, Come with me"
- Desmond says he and Calvin saved the world together for a while, and it was lovely.......The end. Shout out to The Doors?
- While helping Sayid, Hurley is saying it's finally returning to normalness, as Kate runs up to get Sayid and he says, "Oh Crap!"
- Jack mutters Desmonds name under his breath. Is he remembering?
- Jack says to Locke in jest??? "Last time I saw a computer that could save the world, it didn't look like that" What computer, Where???
- Orientation - Station 3 - Swan
- Station 3 of the Dharma Initiative.
- Gerald & Karen DeGroot
- 1986 productions.........end of film. Not sure of the 6, but definately 1980 something.
- Helen was angry for 20 years and says she "couldn't get over it". She says she couldn't do it alone. She needed to find help. She says that John helped her, and she can help him. She makes him promise he won't return to his fathers house, which he agrees to and later "breaks his promise".
- Kate says, "Did you find it?" Hurley replies, "Depends on what ou mean by, IT"
- Helen is telling Locke that AC doesn't care and she knows why he is scared to move forward. She makes him choose. He says it's not that simple, and she says it is. Locke yells, "I CANT" Helen says he can. Locke yells louder, "NO I CANT" "I don't know how". Helen is understanding and says it cuz he doesn't know what's going to happen. She says it's a Leap of Faith and tells him, "You don't have to be alone"
- Jin is going to "play dead" in order to get Mr. Eko to come back. Ana Lucia says sarcastically that the "sick prisoner" idea is lame.
- After stealing Sawyer's gun, Ana calls out, "Coming up" or "Get me out" I'm wondering if it's similar to "lift it up"
- Jack is questioning Desmonds story and says, "Some man shows you a film....push a button on FAITH alone"
- Desmond tells Jack that in about 15 minutes, "You are going to be very right or very wrong"
- Desmond says to Jack, "If by some MIRACLE you get the computer working...."
- Jack yells at Desmond, "You don't even know what your running from" The word running rings a bell for Desmond, and he remembers who Jack is.
- Jack says "IT DOESN'T MATTER" at least 3 times
- Jack tells Sayid not to push the button. He tells him it's not real. Lockes asks why he came back and ask him why he finds it so hard to believe. Jack spits back, "Why do you find it so easy", which Locke replies, "I never have"

Red Shirts & Supporting Cast - Francine is in Locke's Anger Management class, and she's complaining her mother stole $30 for booze. Locke says she feels too much.

Literature, Film & TV References - ECG Workshop book on the shelf


Weird Props and Recurring Imagery - Helen throws Locke's keys over Anthony Coopers gate, in order to get his attention to make a choice.


--> Recurring Phrases - Helen says, "Get over it, Freaks" goes with AC telling Locke to get over it.
- Desmond says, "We're all gonna die" and says the buttons stop the End of the World. He also says, "It's over"
- Desmond says "*******", when he's trying to fix the computer. Has this swear been used before?
- AC talk with Locke in the car; AC mentions moving (to get away from Locke?) and says, "Here you are" similar to "Here I am" said by ??
- Sawyer asks the men to "push me up" sounds like "lift it up" (Desmond to Jack in the stadium re: ankle)
- Locke says to Jack as he's leaving the Hatch, "Don't leave me here" which Jack coldly replies, "Your on your own" Goes with AC
- Locke says, "Why is it happening like this?" "What do you want?" "What am I supposed to do?"
- Locke says to Jack, "I CANT do it ALONE, I don't WANT to"
Helen is telling Locke that AC doesn't care and she knows why he is scared to move forward. She makes him choose. He says it's not that simple, and she says it is. Locke yells, "I CANT" Helen says he can. Locke yells louder, "NO I CANT" "I don't know how". Helen is understanding and says it cuz he doesn't know what's going to happen. She says it's a Leap of Faith and tells him, "You don't have to be alone"
- Jack is questioning Desmonds story and says, "Some man shows you a film....push a button on FAITH alone"
- Locke "I can't do it alone, I don't want to" "It's a leap of faith, Jack"
--> Other

Numbers References
- 1986(?) Productions credit at the end of Orientation film.
- Helen was angry for 20 years.
- Desmond tells Jack that in about 15 minutes, "You are going to be very right or very wrong"
- Jack enters the Hatch and tells Locke the last number is 42, not 32
- Jack presses the button with 2 seconds to go
- Locke says he will take the 1st shift.

Not sure why someone is stating that Cooper was not Locke's biological father.
I'm pretty sure he was, if for no other reason than wanting his kidney particularly.
It's well known that the body has the lowest rate of rejection of transplanted organs when they are from a close family member and therefore have a shared DNA.

1st impression from the 1st viewing. I just watched it again and your right, maybe. He doesn't actually say he is or isn't his father. Couldn't he have been a kidney match, and Locke's mom conned him too? He probably is his father, but something about the scene said he isn't????????????

Along the line of similarites it still works, especially when I realized that Ana Lucia conned the boys too.

Hey everyone! I don't have any observations off the top of my head (I was hooking up my new computer- YAY!- and didn't take notes while Lost was on this time) but I wanted to say, "Hello!" So many familiar handles in this thread...just wanted to say, "Hi".

*waves at flora* drop off any goodies you might come across


Orientation Video - http://timdorr.com/images/Lost/Dharma.Orientation.avi

Picture of Nancy and DeGroot compared to Boat Captain and lady on the boat http://humpys.net/images/theothers.jpg

Desmond and lady http://lost.cubit.net/pics/desmondPhoto.jpg

It is not the Sydney Opera House like I said earlier.

http://img386.imageshack.us/img386/8051/dharma0358gn.jpg

The Hanso Foundation, 1980. All Rights Reserved.


Does that freak anyone else out? This film was copyrighted!

Dr. Marvin Candle played by the real Marvin Candle?? http://www.wtnh.com/Global/story.asp?S=1882895&nav=0RdaNDgr

The Third Policeman written by Flann O`Brien

The Turn the Screw written by Henry James
http://www.online-literature.com/henry_james/turn_screw

The story starts conventionally enough with friends sharing ghost stories 'round the fire on Christmas Eve. One of the guests tells about a governess at a country house plagued by supernatural visitors. But in the hands of Henry James, the master of nuance, this little tale of terror is an exquisite gem of sexual and psychological ambiguity. Only the young governess can see the ghosts; only she suspects that the previous governess and her lover are controlling the two orphaned children (a girl and a boy) for some evil purpose. The household staff don't know what she's talking about, the children are evasive when questioned, and the master of the house (the children's uncle) is absent. Why does the young girl claim not to see a perfectly visible woman standing on the far side of the lake? Are the children being deceptive, or is the governess being paranoid? By leaving the questions unanswered, The Turn of Screw generates spine-tingling anxiety in its mesmerized readers.

Danielle has a boat wreck on her map. It could be Desmond's when he crashed on the reef. Is there a reef drawn in too?

Jack waited till the very last second to push the button. I posted 2 seconds WRONG

near ALVAR...ALVAR is an anagram for...LAVAR...which means "To wash" , in spanish...Alvar Hanso....Lavar Noah's...Wash Noah's...Purificaiton of human race....

B.F. Skinner - http://www.ship.edu/~cgboeree/skinner.html

The B.F. Skinner Foundation was established in 1987 to improve the understanding of human behavior through the science first proposed by B. F. Skinner.
"The major problems of the world today can be solved only if we improve our understanding of human behavior" About Behaviorism (1974)

The guy who locked his children in boxes and told them to push buttons to get treats.


ECG Workshop (book on shelf) - ECG is the acronym for the joint research program Effective Computational Geometry of Curves and Surfaces. This research program is sponsored by the European Commission, and is carried out by a consortium consisting of computer scientists from INRIA (Sophia-Antipolis, France), Eidgenössische Technische Hochschule (Zürich, Switzerland), Freie Universität (Berlin, Germany), Groningen University (Groningen, The Netherlands), Max Planck Institut für Informatik (Saarbrücken, Germany), and Tel Aviv University (Tel Aviv, Israel).

http://www-sop.inria.fr/prisme/ECG/workshop/ecg_workshop.html

Workshop on Robustness and Efficiency Issues in Implementing Arrangements of Curves and Surfaces
INRIA Sophia-Antipolis, December 18,19, 2002
Arrangements are space subdivisions induced by collections of geometric objects. They are ubiquitous in computational geometry and have applications in a variety of domains including robotics, GIS, computer vision, molecular modeling and more. The theory of arrangements (combinatorics and algorithmics) has been intensively studied for several decades. In recent years there is growing interest in the practice of arrangements, their implementation and application. The goal of the workshop is to bring together researchers working on applied aspects of arrangements or closely related topics to present the recent advancements in robust implementation of arrangements, to compare the qualities of various approaches, to discuss key problems and to identify promising future directions in this area.

http://www-sop.inria.fr/act_recherche/orga_en.shtml

Note: 1 more and we have all 6 Hatches filled

The scientific research of Inria Sophia Antipolis are grouped around 5 major themes :
Theme Bio : Biological systems
Theme Cog : Cognitive systems
Theme Com : Communicating systems
Theme Num : Numerical systems
Theme Sym : Symbolic systems

Dang it. I misread the book on the shelf, it's not ECG Workshop, it's Workout. Found this great post though.


DaVinci135 - When Locke was examining the book "The Turn of the Screw" from the bookshelf, I noticed another, clearly labeled book, sitting close to it. The book is titled "ECG Workout: Exercises in Arrhythmia Interpretation" and can be found on Amazon.com at:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...00832?v=glance

A screen capture of the book can be found here:

http://lost-media.com/modules/copper...ion-cap159.jpg

The book was published in 2001 which might help to establish a time frame for when the last visit to the hatch from outside sources occurred. Additionally, I find this book important for two primary reasons: 1) it helps to further solidify that this hatch (station #3 - the swan) is indeed the electromagnetic experiment and 2) that Desmond's excercise allows him to remain healthy and counteract the negative effects of the electromagnetic field. Electromagnetic fields disrupt the natural operation of the human heart and cause irregular heart beats and ultimately, arrhythmias. Google "arrhythmias" and "electromagnetic" or check out the following link for more information:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=123970 04&dopt=Abstract

Whether or not Desmond is aware of the negative effects of the field is unknown. The book may have been carried in by another hatch operator prior to Desmond's arrival. However, I believe Desmond said that he and Calvin had "pushed the button" for 3 years, until Calvin eventually died. That means that if Desmond didn't bring the book and Calvin hadn't carried it in during the past 3 years, it was on the shelf before Desmond arrived. Since the book was published in 2001 and we know that at least 3 years had elapsed since Desmond came upon the hatch, then we can assume that the year of the present events is at least 2004.


Cardielost Locke crying as he remembered Helen paralleled Jack crying when Desmond asked him about Sarah. I'm wondering if Helen died in the same accident that paralyzed Locke.(That would be a parallel with Kate and Tom.)

540 days divided by "5" = 108

This new info gives the game Mousetrap a whole new meaning.


http://www.thehansofoundation.org/activeproject.html

The Hanso Life-Extension Project

The Hanso Foundation Electromagnetic Research Initiative

The Hanso Quest for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence

The Hanso Mathematical Forecasting Initiative

The Hanso Cryogenics Development Imperative

The Hanso Juxtapositional Eugenics Development Institute

The Hanso Accelerated Remote Viewing Training Facility


Alvar Hanso - "From the dawn of our species, Man has been blessed with curiosity. Our most precious gift, without exception, is the desire to know more - to look beyond what is accepted as the truth and to imagine what is possible." - Alvar Hanso, Address to the U.N. Security Council, 1967


Mission Statement - The Hanso Foundation stands at the vanguard of social and scientific research for the advancement of the human race. For forty years, the foundation has offered grants to worthy experiments designed to further the evolution of the human race and provide technological solutions to the most pressing problems of our time.

The Hanso Foundation: a commitment to encouraging excellence in science and technology and furthering the cause of human development.

Here's my notes:

Rafters are captured and placed in a hole in the ground covered w/ a bamboo cage.
Locke is in a support group, (for people w/ parent or daddy isssues?)
Helen is the leader of the support group (but I don't think it's the same Helen as the phone Helen)
Kate comes out of the ducts into a weapons locker (how convenient)
When Kate hit Desmond one of them shot the computer (I didn't catch which one)
Locke is stalking his father. He sits outside his fathers house. His father comes out and tells hime to leave him alone, that he's been conned (just a quick speculation, but this statement made me wonder if he was the one that conned Sawyer's parents, haven't thought it through yet)
There is another entrance to the hatch
Desmond's boat crashed 3 years ago during his race around the world (another ship wreck).
He met Calvin and the two of them pushed the button together. They thought they were saving the world. Calvin died at some point and Desmond was left to push the button alone.
Locke and Jack watch the film "Orientation"
Sawyer is attacked w/ a knife, but I don't think he gets stabbed.
The Dharma Initiative
Orientation Film for Station 3 - The Swan
Designed for two partners to operate
In 1970 2 people Jerold and ? started the project w/ funding by another guy (didn't catch his name)
The team was supposed to man the station for 540 days
There was an "accident" on the island which is why they put this procedure in place.
Every 108 minutes you must enter the code and push the button
At 4 minutes the alarm will start to sound signalling the team to enter the code.
Designed for an alternating shift w/ two people
They were waiting for their replacements to arrive
Helen - At 6 months she gives Locke a gift, a key
She followed him to his Dad's house
She askes him to promiss not to go to the house anymore
The Captives - Ana was dumped in with the rafters
She said she swam to shore and has been on her own
Jack asks Desmond if he thinks this could just be a mind game, an experiment to see if he would keep pushing the button. Desmond responds "Every day"
It's an electromagnetic station (what could happen?)
Who are the women in the picture?
Locke went back to the house again
Helen asks him to make a "Leap of Faith" Locke later tells Jack to do the same thing
Sawyer calls Anna "Cup Cake"
Anna was a plant to get info from the rafters
Hurley found the pantry.

Sorry, not too many details. I only watched it once. There's more info to be picked out of the Orientation film, but I'm sure someone else will fill in that info. Hope I helped.

Screencap of the blackboard at the anger management support group:
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=737&pos=34

Note # 3 of 6 on the list: Rewire your Hot button
16 people in the group including the moderator, it takes place in a church (?)
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=737&pos=33

Deceptive injuries
Ana-Lucia uses an injury (bruise to the face, grabs at her side) to gain Sawyer, Michael, and Jin's trust. Strong parallel to kate and the bank robbery, but others have done this too.
1.09 Sayid shoots his own leg to create a cover story for Nadia's escape.
1.13 Shannon flashes Boone a bruise to convince him she needs saving.
1.22 Kate has Jason smack her so it looks like she’s not in on the bank robbery.

Calvin - Possibly a reference to John Calvin, Christian theologian, protestant reformation?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Calvin

If there are 6 stations, the others probably have different symbols, not a swan. This may explain why the shark logo doesn't appear to be an exact match.

Subjects Dharma Initiative wanted to study: Psychology, Parapsychology (shot of subjects blindfolded), zoology (shot of 2 polar bears), electromagnetism, meteorology

Not sure if any of these thoughts have any significance or not...

When Locke told Jack he wanted him to hit the execute button, Jack's response was, "It's just a button!" That made me think of what Walt said to Shannon on the first episode of season 2. I think it was something along the lines of 'Don't push the button'.

I also found it odd about Ana. She did meet Jack in the airport and was on the same flight and it's obvious that she knew the 'others' and is working with them. What significance is this? Could the 'others' with Ana actually be the survivors of the back of the plane? Could Mr. Eko (I believe that is what he is being called) be Rose's husband? (Please correct me if I am wrong on Rose's name. I'm talking about the woman who sat near Jack on the plane who talked about her husband being in the bathroom). If they are the survivors of the rear, I am guessing that if the two groups of survivors combine, there will be a total of 108 of them. Did I also hear the guy who pulled Ana out of the jail pit say something along the lines of, ' Who are these people?', 'What did you find out?' I thought I heard him say something but I haven't watched the episode again.

I also found it odd that they never showed where the other entrance to the hatch led to on the surface.

Is it Calvin or Kelvin that brought Desmond to the hatch?

Wow! This was a great episode and chock full of details for us to dig into.

I don't know if I'll be able to get around to much discussion here today, but I'll definitely be around tomorrow if not today.

Favorite line: "I think we are going to have to watch that again." - Locke

:rotflmao:

I love that line too. I think that one coupled with the whole "leap of faith" theme were a shout out to the fans.

ducky, We got tasty new bondage to add to your list :D

Here's my brief notes after viewing one, I haven't read the thread yet so some are probably already mentioned.

Island Timeline:[b/] Day 45, morning of the rafters are captured by Butt Crack Man aka Lord of the Flies, the ancient computer is shot, Kate fetches Sayid and Hurley to the hatch while Jack and Locke watch the Orientation film. Jack and Desmond discuss their previous crossing, Sayid fixes the computer and Jack presses the button to save the world just in the nick of time.

Repeated lines:
- "Don't tell me what to do." - Jack
- "What am I supposed to do?" - Locke

Lost sex: Locke got some with Helen, but likes to run away at night.

Parallel Themes: Con Artists. Locke's dad, "You think you're the first person who ever got conned?" :( For the first time I am starting to believe theorists who say that's not his real dad. Poor Locke.

Desmond's Hatch buddy: I heard "Calvin".
Orientation film narrator: Dr. Marvin Candle ?
Places: Filmed at University of Michigan, research originated there

[b]Social Science Research Center - I aboute cremed my pants. According to the film, it's all a giant sociology experiment! I love it! I don't know if I believe it, but I want to believe. (Did you know that I am a sociologist?)

Literature: The Turn of the Screw, notable that "Orientation" film was found behind this book.

Lit: The Third Policeman. See thread in Adrift section on TTP. Producers said this book has lots of significance.

Boxes:
- Sayid and Hurley carry a footlocker up the beach.
- Helen's gold gift box carried the key to her apt.

Other weapons: Was that a machete Butt Crack Man was shoving in the pitfall? Or a piece of honed aircraft?

Sawyer Nicknames:
- Ana Lucia = cupcake
- Butt Crack Man = Shaft

THINGS WE NEED:
- Need closeup of the blackboard writing in the group therapy session, any clues as to name of therapy group

- I love Katey Sagal, I suspect she's not the same "Helen" he was on the phone with in WALK. Oops. This thread is supposed to be fact/observation, not theorizing. Search for evidence.

- We can narrow the date the flashback based on Locke's comments, - compare to dates on Emily's hospital admission form. Need transcript.

- We can also narrow down dates on Jack's last flashback/ Sarah's accident based on Desmond's "3 years" comment - he probably met Jack 4 years ago. At Jack's rehearsal dinner IIRC, Sarah said they met 2 years ago, so the wedding was probably 2 years ago. Compare transcripts and check my math.

Kate's shotgun - please identify. kgmaus usually does gun id. Also need id on Desmond's gun.

- Jewelry: Need screencap of Helen's necklace, what was it?

Major Lost Themes: Faith vs. Science, need analysis written on this episode. Don't be shy! You can do it. Also how does this tie in with Fate vs. Free Will (i.e. Jack's decision to push the button).

Character parallels - not letting go
Locke and Jack? Locke and Sawyer, Locke was stalking the man that did him wrong.

Boxes- Was that a red toolbox Locke knocks off the computer table? Can't get into the screencaps because lostmedia is overloaded.

Bondage:
2.02
Jin
hands bound behind back with rope/bamboo, claims to have been blindfolded
Runs out of the jungle to the beach where Mike and Sawyer wash up
Jin says the others captured him, so far Ana-Lucia and mysterious island man are identified.
Sawyer and Mike untie him

Subcategory? Blindfolded
1.11
Charlie found hung in a tree blindfolded
2.03
Jin claims to have been blindfolded when he was captured
2.03
In the Orientation video 2 experimental subjects are blindfolded
a man strapped into some sort of apparatus
a woman pointing at a red ball (between a green and blue ball)

Captivity
2.03
Jin, Sawyer, and Michael
thrown into a deep pit with a bamboo gate/cover
dumped in by mysterious island man, Ana-Lucia, and 3 other people
Ana-Lucia gets dumped in too, to find out their story
mysterious island man pulls Ana-Lucia out

Did anyone else think that the bamboo-fake foilage covering on the "jail" pit looked like the hatch before it got uncovered?

Or is that just me?

Lost in Louisiana The first thing I thought of when I heard "Kelvin" was the Kelvin temperature scale:

Kelvin temperature scale, a temperature scale having an absolute zero below which temperatures do not exist. Absolute zero, or 0K, is the temperature at which molecular energy is a minimum, and it corresponds to a temperature of -273.15° on the Celsius temperature scale. The Kelvin degree is the same size as the Celsius degree; hence the two reference temperatures for Celsius, the freezing point of water (0°C), and the boiling point of water (100°C), correspond to 273.15K and 373.15K, respectively. When writing temperatures in the Kelvin scale, it is the convention to omit the degree symbol and merely use the letter K. The temperature scale is named after the British mathematician and physicist William Thomson Kelvin, who proposed it in 1848

then I looked up Kelvin, the physicist, and found this in his bio:

He introduced the Kelvin temperature scale, or absolute scale, of temperature. He also discovered the Thomson effect in thermoelectricity. The importance of the discoveries and improvements that he made in connection with the transmission of messages by submarine cables led to his establishment as a leading authority in this field. He invented the reflecting galvanometer and the siphon recorder, an instrument by which telegraphic messages are recorded in ink fed from a siphon.


SOOOO, is the cable that Sayid found on the beach a submarine cable that transmits messages? Is there a submarine just offshore of the island that is in communication with the Others????

Michaels comment in Exodus ? re: the size of the island, was for us to believe 6 different Hatch's are performing experiments.

The island is the 7th experiment?

Insignia of lab coat. Is not a Swan. http://img54.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pocketlogo1xu.gif

Insignia on Shark. Is not a Swan http://www.noelf.net/Lostsharklightenedcropped.jpg

dark piranha Anyone remember "The Fly" (the one with Jeff Goldblum)? In that movie, he played a scientist working on a matter transmitter device. He couldn't make all the different parts of the machine and didn't have that kind of know-how, but he instead had other companies make a part that does "X" (without telling them what it was for), and another company makes a part or device that does "Y", and in the end, he would put all these independent items together and make his matter transmitter.

I think that Alvar Hanso had some grand plan for something weapons-related and hired DeGroot and company to unwittingly create all of the disparate items (or concepts) he needed to make his weapon or plan work.
Mondoz *Cygnus is a constellation known as the Swan. I'm wondering if the other 5 stations will also be named after constellations.

Space Cadet. I've been posting in the Adrift thread.

Skinner wrote a book called Walden II, about a utopian society based on operant conditioning. Religious people criticized it as a dystopia
utopian -- or dystopian
chaplips74 I spent a couple of years in Nepal as a Peace Corps volunteer. Namaste is translated into English as,"The God in me bows to the God in you". This is what I was told anyhow.
Namaste is said at the end of Orientation video.
Images/Video to come? Hanso site http://www.thehansofoundation.org/images/ref_video.gif
Hanso smiley face http://www.thehansofoundation.org/images/ui_bg.jpg
Uforia 540 days. 180 times 5 or:

There are 777,600 minutes in 540 days

meaning that the button gets pushed exactly 7200 times in that period of time.

Could these new numbers somehow be related to an opposite number set?

Maybe something like 0, 6,7, 54, 72, 77 (total 216)
John Locke Im from Narvik in Norway....

Our City hall was featured in the filmstrip....

http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/484...nnarvik5mm.jpg (http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/4846/lostinnarvik5mm.jpg)


You can even see the City Crest in red on the lower left side of building.
The statue in front is a war memorial statue to tribute the toils of the civil population during the WWII German occupation, 1940-45. If your a Lost fan from this town... i guess that awesome...

6 experiments but 7 categories could be that the Social Science experiment is all 6 experiments, or the entire island?

Was that the Oceanic air logo on the bookshelf behind the Karen DeGroot?

What is this experiment and what is he holding? http://img386.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dharma0224fd.jpg

Jacks Dad Maybe there was really no incident, and pushing the button really is bad. Maybe that is part of what brings more "recruits" to the island. The island seems to have it's own electromagnetic preperties as the narator said, but are they strong enough to bring down a plane? Maybe part of the experimentation is to harness and intensify the electromagnetism so it can be used to draw in larger objects from farther away....like 1000miles away.
Witchy Chick I don't have much to add to this thread except to (sorta) refute the theory of The Hanso Foundation logo as a whacked out swastika. If you look at it from different angles (i.e. tilt your head in different directions), you can clearly see a "T", an "H", and an "F" all overlapping each other. T-H-F........The Hanso Foundation. Get it??

I have 3 different bmp's that clearly define this. If anyone has a website and would like to post them for me, send me a PM. Thanks!!!!


Witchy

H2Oahu I remember them mentioning something about being from or associated with the University of Michigan. Is that correct? It's funny because my aunt and uncle live on a lake in MI which 75% of the surrounding land is owned by U of M for a Biological research center. I'll have to read through the rest of this thread later tonight to see if this was already mentioned.
darkpiranha I think that one shot from the filmstrip where DeGroot is sitting at a table watching the ball of twisted metal floating in the air between two rods is significant. It shows that they are using an electromagnet of some kind to control metal and in this case, make it float in the air. Logic dictates that the next steps of this would be smaller pieces of metal and finer control.

The monster is a cloud of metallic dust controlled by a highly advanced electromagnet on another part of the island.
sier Found some links regarding remote control insects:

http://www.livescience.com/animalwor...y_control.html (http://www.livescience.com/animalworld/050407_fly_control.html)

http://www.scienceblog.com/cms/node/7484

http://www.yaledailynews.com/article.asp?AID=29206



Su La Terre I'm surprised that I haven't read this postulated here yet -- We were told that Alvar Hanso is a weapons manufacturing magnate who funds these "Dharma" research outposts and other scientific organizations around the world. What if the Hanso Foundation was using the Dharma Initiative as an unwitting front for the development of some kind of weapon? An isolated 'research station' would be a great place to conduct this sort of research away from prying eyes and what better cover-up than an organization whose expressed goal is 'world peace?'

Perhaps Hanso was using the Swan station for a far different purpose than it was originally intended. Some kind of mishap this way could explain the lockdown and the need for a quarantine, although the timer still seems a little off.


Skinner's daughter refutes claims she was a box baby http://books.guardian.co.uk/departments/healthmindandbody/story/0,6000,1168052,00.html
mikenmo23 Hope this doesnt sound too egocentric but does anyone other than me think that Locke's line at the end of the filmstrip, "we're gonna have to watch that again" is a nod to all of US, discussing the show and how many times we say, "hmmm, I'm gonna have to watch that again" ? That's the first thing I thought right after he said it....Then of course, at the end of last night epi I said to myself, "I'm gonna have to watch that again!"
mitpayWelcome, I'm Dr. Marvin Candle and this is the Orientation film for station 3 Dharma Initiative.
In a moment, you'll be given a simple set of instructions for how you and your partner will fulfill your responsibilities associated with the station. But first, a little history. The Dharma Initiative was created in 1970, and is the brainchild of Gerald and Karen Degroot, 2 doctoral candidates at the university of Michigan. Following in the footsteps of visionairies such as B.F. Skinner *** imagined a large scale communal research compund where scientists and free thinkers from around the globe could pursue research in Meteorolgy, Psychology, Para-Psychology, Zoology, electro-Magnetism and Utopian social *** reclusive Danish industrialist and muntions magnate Alvar Hanso, whose financial backing made their dream of a multi-purpose social science research facility a reality.
You and your partner are currently located at station 3, or the swan, and will be for the next 540 days. The station 3 was originally constructed as a laboratory where scientists could work to understand the unique electromagnetic fluctuations emanating from this sector of the island. Not long after the experiments began however, there was an incident, and since that time the following protocol has been observed. Every 108 minutes, the button must be pushed. From the moment the alarm sounds you will have 4 minutes to enter the code into the microcomputer processor *** induction into the program. When the alarm sounds, either you or your partner must input the code. It is highly recommended that you and your partner take alternating shifts, in this manner you will stay as fresh and alert *** utmost importance that when the alarm sounds the code be entered correctly and in a timey fashion and do not attempt to use the computer for anything ***
Congratulations until your replacements arrive, the future of the project is in your hands. On behalf of the Degroots, Alvar Hanso, and all of us at the Dharma Initiative Thank you, Namaste and Good Luck

540 days divided by "5" = 108

This new info gives the game Mousetrap a whole new meaning.

http://www.thehansofoundation.org/activeproject.html

The Hanso Life-Extension Project (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/lep.html)

The Hanso Foundation Electromagnetic Research Initiative (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/emri.html)

The Hanso Quest for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/qeti.html)

The Hanso Mathematical Forecasting Initiative (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/mfi.html)

The Hanso Cryogenics Development Imperative (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/cdi.html)

The Hanso Juxtapositional Eugenics Development Institute (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/jedi.html)

The Hanso Accelerated Remote Viewing Training Facility (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/arvtf.html)


Alvar Hanso - "From the dawn of our species, Man has been blessed with curiosity. Our most precious gift, without exception, is the desire to know more - to look beyond what is accepted as the truth and to imagine what is possible." - Alvar Hanso, Address to the U.N. Security Council, 1967

Mission Statement - The Hanso Foundation stands at the vanguard of social and scientific research for the advancement of the human race. For forty years, the foundation has offered grants to worthy experiments designed to further the evolution of the human race and provide technological solutions to the most pressing problems of our time.

The Hanso Foundation: a commitment to encouraging excellence in science and technology and furthering the cause of human development.

Why does Sawyer's name keep coming up in bold red? Sorry don't have much to add just yet.

Ana-Lucia is another who doesn't remember the crash. So far Kate is the only one who claims to remember everything.

Ana-Lucia says she was hit in the head and knocked unconscious during the plane crash and awoke underwater. She swam to shore. No mention of how many other survivors.

It appears the tail section landed in the ocean.

According to the orientation film, the island has in fact been discovered and people are aware of it's existence. (Relates to Michael's comment in Exodus about how could an island this big not be discovered.)

Paralells: Ana-Lucia, Kate (Born To Run), Sawyer (Confidence Man) and Anthony Cooper (Orientation) have all conned people on screen for personal gain.
Desmond and Danielle both shipwrecked on the island.

The orientation film showed polar bears.

The exit to the hatch has two doors that must be opened, it appears, one at a time, in order to get in and out of the hatch. Like a contamination chamber/airlock.

Sayid fixes the computer on faith that Locke will tell him why when he finishes.

did Ana strictly say she didn't remember the crash?

just because she sais she woke up in the water doesn't mean the whole tail was in the water OR that she wasn't alone...

just things to think about..

also, this goes with the theme of "letting go" for the season as a whole
first was Jack, then Michael, and now Locke

I'm beginning to think the group was a simple anger management class, rather than AA, Al-anon, or Adult Children of Alcoholics (ACOA)

i agree that "we're gonna have to watch that again" was the BEST line ever! haha

>^..^<

Well I believe that was the gist of what she was saying, to paraphrase (sorry):

They ask Ana what happened and how she survived and she says: the tail broke off, somebody's hard case hit me in the head, knocked me unconscious. I woke up underwater.

As I've mentioned on a few other threads, not sure if its been mentioned here already (since I'm late to the game... very late... this week, and wound up posting on the Adrift thread, heh): in relation to 5*108=540, IIRC, 5 is the number on Matthew Fox's tattoos, which are supposedly being built into Jack's character's story.

Another thing I've noticed, but also probably mentioned already:

At the beginning of the Dharma Orientation video, there is an intro piece of music on the film. The end of this is a fairly prominent piece of Lost's orchestral soundtrack, and I believe that would be the first time of the show that an orchestral theme has been heard within the lives of the characters (I don't count "You All Everybody").

The most prominent (that is, memorable) example of the piece of music I'm referring to would be in Exodus, Part 3 as the camera pans down the hatch, as well as in the "theme" of the Disc 3 menu of the DVD, but I know it's been played fairly often through the series.

Lidelof says that there are still plenty of Easter eggs to discover: “We hide black and white rocks throughout the show, he says. “Every time we have a black rock - boulders, backgammon pieces - there’s also a white one.” Also important is the number of days the castaways have been stranded each season: At the end of Season One, it’s forty days, possibly a reference to Noah’s Ark. By the end of the second season, it’ll be eighty-eight days, definitely a reference to the piano keyboard, where black rocks and white rocks live side by side.

http://marx.se/?p=531

WIF said:
540 days divided by "5" = 108

This new info gives the game Mousetrap a whole new meaning.

Explain please?

NEED: Someone to look up years of original publication on these books, and authors if we don't have them listed here.

The Hatch Library of Books:
Discussion of The Third Policeman, Flan O'Brien here (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=20679)

Dirty Work, Stuart Woods (techno thriller)

Turn of the Screw

The Rainbow Six, Tom Clancy, (group of scientists release disease to kill the world and wait out results in sealed environment in the jungle) - publication 1986?

ECG book?

On Themes: Fate vs. Free Will, Faith, etc.,

thyen points out parallel's to Pascal's Wager:
Pascal's Wager
The 108-minute clock device in the story reminds me of Pascal's wager. If you're not familiar with it, Pascal the mathematician (and Christian) summarized faith in God as such:

a) there either is or isn't God...our faith decides our response to that. (Think re: believing the end of the world scenario if you don't enter "the code.")

b) you can either live righteously before God or live hedonistically as if there is no God...again, we personally decide that. (We either can enter the code or let the timer run out...it's our choice again.)

c) if you choose to live righteously and there is no God, you've lost a little (delights of the world) but not too much. If you live hedonistically and there is not God, you've gained a little. (If you do/don't enter the code and there isn't a world-ending device, then you've lost/gained a little.)

d) if you choose to live righteously and there is a God, you've gained a lot (salvation, heaven). If you live hedonistically and there is a Gd, you've lost a lot (hell). (If you do/don't enter the code and there is a world-ending device, then you've gained/lost a lot.)

It's an exact parallel, and a really fun application of Pascal's Wager in the show. Kudos to the writers for coming up with the idea...

Summary of B.F. Skinner experiments and similarity to countdown clock / button pushing here (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=21559).

Link to the Orientation Film:

http://img223.imageshack.us/my.php?image=videostream9bd.swf

At the end of Season One, it’s forty days, possibly a reference to Noah’s Ark. By the end of the second season, it’ll be eighty-eight days, definitely a reference to the piano keyboard, where black rocks and white rocks live side by side.---------------------------------


But it WAS 44 days in the first season. The first two episodes of this season were still the same night as the day of the last show of last season. When Desmond asked Locke how long he had been on the island he said, "44 days". I know everyone keeps rounding off at 40 for the Biblical reference and all, but when the raft set sail, Arzt blew up, Danielle stole Aaron, Walt got kidnapped, the hatch got blown up, Locke and Kate went down the hatch and were confronted by Desmond- it was day 44.

More discussion on Skinner, Milgram, learned helplessness and other social - psych theories [url=http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=21328]here.

Crud. Now we are going to need yet another new category for Soci-Psych Theories (in addition to Philosophy).

It's been long in coming though, I've been talking about this since way back in ComMan with the Kohlberg's Moral Development Theory threads.

Parallel themes / Sickness & Health: posted by blondefilmgirl

At the beginning of Season 1 (not the pilot, but a few eps in), we see that Locke has gained use of his legs after being paralyzed from the waist down.

At the beginning of Season 2, Sarah, Jack's wife, regains the use of her legs after being paralyzed from the waist down (seemingly).

Transcript copies to add to our Games Section:
Locke: I'm removing the driest pieces to minimize our risk transporting it. You ever play operation?

Jack: Sure. Don't touch the sides.

Locke: I always got nailed on the funny bone. Bzzzt!

Jack: You like to play games, John?

Locke: Absolutely.

******************************
Locke: Backgammon is the oldest game in the world. Archaeologists found sets when they excavated the ruins of Ancient Mesopotamia. Five thousand years old. That's older than Jesus Christ.

Walt: Did they have dice and stuff?

Locke: Mmm. But theirs weren't made of plastic. Their dice were made of bones.

Walt: Cool.

Locke: Two players. Two sides. One is light; one is dark.


Locke: Walt ... Do you want to know a secret?

***********************

Kid: What's that?

Locke: A game. It's my favorite game, actually. I used to play it with my brother. It's called Mouse Trap.

Kid: How do you play?

Locke: Well, you start with all these parts off the board. And then, one by one, you build the trap - shoe, bucket, tub - piece by piece it all comes together. And then you wait 'til your opponent lands here on the old cheese wheel. And then if you set it up just right, you spring the trap.

**********************

Parallel themes / Sickness & Health: posted by blondefilmgirl

At the beginning of Season 1 (not the pilot, but a few eps in), we see that Locke has gained use of his legs after being paralyzed from the waist down.

At the beginning of Season 2, Sarah, Jack's wife, regains the use of her legs after being paralyzed from the waist down (seemingly).

I mentioned that last week, in the adrift LLL post.
http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?p=518093#post518093

Under parallels, Locke, Sarah, and Michael all lost the ability to walk for a period of time and regained it. Michael's was not ever mentioned as paralysis, like Locke and Sarah were, but all three of them have lost the use of their legs and regained it.

I mentioned that last week, in the adrift LLL post.
http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?p=518093#post518093

Under parallels, Locke, Sarah, and Michael all lost the ability to walk for a period of time and regained it. Michael's was not ever mentioned as paralysis, like Locke and Sarah were, but all three of them have lost the use of their legs and regained it.


Does anyone know- was Sarah ever in a wheelchair? I mean, even in part of her recovery? I know she had feeling in her toes and everything, but maybe her legs were weak and she had to use a wheelchair for a time until she got stronger? Because then we can place three people from the show in wheelchairs.


I'm stretching...I know it.

WIF said:


Explain please?

If pressing the button every 108 minutes is a social science experiment, it seems the whole island is a big Mousetrap. Rats in a maze.

Did anyone else think that the bamboo-fake foilage covering on the "jail" pit looked like the hatch before it got uncovered?

Or is that just me?

I see that too.

Kid: What's that?

Locke: A game. It's my favorite game, actually. I used to play it with my brother. It's called Mouse Trap.

Kid: How do you play?

Locke: Well, you start with all these parts off the board. And then, one by one, you build the trap - shoe, bucket, tub - piece by piece it all comes together. And then you wait 'til your opponent lands here on the old cheese wheel. And then if you set it up just right, you spring the trap.

Have we analyzed the mention of a cheese wheel???? I've seen wheels mentioned on a lot of sites and theories.

Well I believe that was the gist of what she was saying, to paraphrase (sorry):

They ask Ana what happened and how she survived and she says: the tail broke off, somebody's hard case hit me in the head, knocked me unconscious. I woke up underwater.

Is that what she said? "hard case" I couldn't understand her.

Information on historical de Groots here on this thread (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=21632)

Info on Turn of the Screw:
http://www.sparknotes.com/lit/screw/

******
Supposedly Javi confirmed on the LB (10/7) that the name is Kelvin, not Calvin.

William Thomson (Lord Kelvin) makes more sense anyway, since he studied electromagnetism.

This is my first post - a lurker no more!

If you take the number in the alphabet that the letters in the name Alvar Hanso correspond to, it's 1-12-20-1-17 & 8-1-14-19-15

Add them up and it equals 108!

Geodisic Dome, EPCOT's Spaceship earth (ABC-Disney connection?)
EPCOT = Experimental Prototype Community Of Tomorrow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epcot

Interesting that geodisic domes come up with utopia/experimentation themes. Biosphere as well.

Hi Piece! Thanks for the info. Welcome to the board. Hope you'll come back by. We're always glad to have anyone that helps out on the observation threads.

This is my first post - a lurker no more!

If you take the number in the alphabet that the letters in the name Alvar Hanso correspond to, it's 1-12-20-1-17 & 8-1-14-19-15

Add them up and it equals 108!


We want you on the N.U.M.B.E.R.S. thread. A new one just started, you should take that gem there.

Kevin = Kelvin ??

Turtle Moon (the book by the film) http://www.amazon.ca/exec/obidos/ASIN/0425161285/702-2578316-6628813


Bess2728 Random thought - Susan's career took her from NYC to Amsterdam to Italy to Australia (at a minimum). Desmond was in a race around the world. We have Shannon being a globe trotter - US - France - Australia. Sayid was a country hopper as well.

Hurley on a trip?

Todell Oooh, Bess! Good point. Remember Desmond's line about Jack being chased by the devil? There were a number of folks who thought that meant Desmond himself was the devil. But what if he was just running from "the devil" as well?

Bess2728 I do remember that. Desmond's running and the devil bit reminded me of the Grimm fairytale where the ferryman must row passengers across a river - he must do it until he convinces another to take the oar, and then he's free. Desmond got someone else to take his proverbial oar - Brian did as well (Michael with Walt). - Hey, I managed to tie the two runnings together!

We want you on the N.U.M.B.E.R.S. thread. A new one just started, you should take that gem there.


Bess2728

Thanks for the tip, and the encouragement - I'll add that right now.
:biggrin:

Accidents: Desmond's boat crashed into the reef 3 years ago (island time = appx. October 2001).

I did a search for 'legs' and didn't find this mentioned
Sam Toomey's wife lost her (left) leg

Obviously Desmond has a female friend/GF somewhere...

http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image8eq1.jpg

Religious Refs / Themes: Information on Pascal's Wager (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?p=531494#post531494) here.

Cross Ref with themes free will vs. fate and faith.

Cars/car accidents:

Helen rear-ends Locke's red beetle in front of Cooper's house.

Her plate is California 3ND(or an O?)F495
Silver car, perhaps someone else recognizes the make and model?
(no screencap of her car on Lostmedia)

The timer flip-clock. Black and white.
The white seconds flaps only start flipping after the 4 minute alarm countdown has started. At 4 minutes a beeping alarm comes on, at under one minute a louder, different alarm comes on.

I don't think this has been mentioned yet on the thread.
Items Desmond grabs before he runs away from the hatch:
He goes to the pantry and gets something from the shelf to his left - head high. I'll try to go back and look at Adrift screencaps to figure out what this could be.
He then turns to opposite side and gets something from this part of the pantry. This time chest high on the shelf (this would be the right side of the pantry coming into the pantry).
This appears to be some kind of shiny tubular package approximately 12 inches long. (crackers or coffee?)
Desmond then runs to the bedroom and grabs his injection needle/gun and 2 handfuls (not all) of the steroid/serum? which contains the CR48151623-42 labels on them that you could see at the beginning of Season 2 Episode 1.
He then goes to his bed and grabs a lop-earred stuffed bunny from his bed, reaching over what appears to be a bible with a cross on the cover and The Third Policeman softbound book. He then goes back one more time for something (possibly the bible, possibly the other book). And then Desmond's out the door.
All of this he stuffs in some kind of bookbag.
I will try to go back and do research on items that could be possible in the pantry.

I was wondering where the Third Policeman showed up. I missed that. Thanks! If anyone has a screencap that would be helpful, I'm not finding one I can use.

There's no screencap of the book and the bunny on Lost Media. I did however find one of Desmond grabbing the first item from the pantry. Click here for that. (http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=737&pos=316)
I can't tell what these two items are that he gets from the pantry. I can't find a good screencap of this part of the pantry.

Yea, it's awful dark. Thanks for trying. Guess it will have to be a reference without picture entry. :)

We might can get better footage next week as it appears in the preview that
Hurley might be in the pantry again

True, that will probably be the ticket!

Repeated line-

Helen tells Locke sometimes she wants to tell people in the class to just get over it.

Cooper told Locke to get over it.

Here's a good cap of the bookshelf. Notice the Turn of the Screw, ECG Workout, and what appears to be a magazine to the left of the ECG book which is either dated June 2003 or June 2007 - Volume 4. LostApril found this in another thread. Here's the cap. (http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimagepopup&pid=47100&fullsize=1)

That is a great cap, thanks...any ideas on that "Stuart" one too? To the left of Turn.

The book to the left of The Turn of the Screw is Dirty Work by Stuart Woods.
The following is a summary of this book copied from www.stuartwoods.com.
I do not see anything relevant or wierd compared to Lost.
EXCEPT the publish date in hardback version. April 1, 2003
Anyway here you go:
Dirty Work

Stone Barrington hits the streets of Manhattan in search of a dangerous woman-and the motivations behind the murder of a very rich husband-in this sexy new thriller in the New York Times bestselling series.

Back in New York City after the London adventure of The Short Forever, cop-turned-lawyer Stone Barrington is approached by a colleague at the firm of Woodman & Weld who needs help with a celebrity divorce case. Elena Marks, a department store heiress, must have proof of her layabout husband's infidelity before she can begin divorce proceedings. But when the undercover work Stone sets up turns dirty - and catastrophic - leaving the errant husband dead and the mystery woman gone-without-a-trace, Stone must clear his own good name and find a killer hiding among the glitterati of New York's high society.

Carpenter, the beautiful British intelligence agent introduced in The Short Forever, arrives in New York to begin an investigation of her own, one she refuses to discuss with Stone. When he suspects that her case is strangely connected to the dead husband's, Stone knows that he and Dino, his former NYPD partner, are about to face the most bizarre and challenging assignment of their very colorful careers.

Stuart Woods is the author of twenty-five novels including The Short Forever, a Stone Barrington novel, and the recent Holly Barker thriller Orchid Beach. Woods lives in Maine, Florida, and New York City.

Thanks, we have a list of short reading items they plug in there and not "feature" like Turn of the Screw or Third Policeman etc. Thank you.

The magazine on the bookshelf beside Turn of the Screw with a white and green spine is an Oprah Magazine. Issue June 2003 - Volume 4. The issue is entitled MAN!

This is my first post - a lurker no more!

If you take the number in the alphabet that the letters in the name Alvar Hanso correspond to, it's 1-12-20-1-17 & 8-1-14-19-15

Add them up and it equals 108!

that has to be mentioned in the NUMBERS thread :)

That's true, but to PieceofArzt it was new, so I thanked him for the information regardless...it doesn't matter if it's posted in the NUMBERS thread or anywhere else does it?

My notes - sorry for length and probable redundancy w/other posts, but felt it best to just copy the whole thing. (FB = flashback)
#203 Orientation (FB – Locke) - 5 October 2005
- At least 5 unknown people on beach: a large black man, smaller gray-haired man, and 3 women. One woman is blonde, another looks Oriental. Third could be Ana Lucia (from Jack FB in “Exodus”).
- FB: Locke is in therapy group; has been for a month.
- FB: Locke’s mother found him “a couple years ago,” and told him he was special.
- Woman in therapy group is Helen. She likes bald guys. This apparently is the same Helen he spoke to in the “Walkabout” FB.
- Kate hits Desmond in back from behind with butt of rifle. Desmond’s gun goes off, hitting and damaging the computer. Desmond: “We’re all gonna die!”
- Clock counts down, 98:00 -> 97:00. The seconds apparently count down only during final “warning” phase.
- Desmond recognizes Jack: “Do I know you?”
- FB: Locke sleeps with Helen.
- FB: Locke visits father’s neighborhood. Father gets into Locke’s car, taking Locke by surprise. Father apparently has moved, and Locke has been watching the wrong house.
- FB: Locke wants to know, “Why??” Father says, “There is no ‘why?’” and discloses bitter reality: “You think you’re the first person that ever got conned?” (Note that virtually every one of the main survivors has been conned in some way in the past!) “You needed a father figure, and I needed a kidney. Get over it. And John – don’t come back. You’re not wanted.”
- Kate: “There’s got to be a front door in this place.” Desmond: “Down the corridor to your left. Be persistent – the wheel sticks.”
- Desmond: “It was 3 years ago. I was in a solo race around the world. My boat crashed into the reef, and then Kelvin came. He comes running out of the jungle, ‘Hurry, hurry, come with me!’ He brings me down here. First thing he does, ‘cause it’s beepin’ already, he types in the code, pushes the button, and it stops. ‘What was all that about?’ I say. ‘Just savin’ the world,’ he says. So I started pushin’ the button, too. And we saved the world together for a while, and that was lovely. And then Kelvin died. And now here I am all alone. The End.”
- Film is on the top shelf of the bookshelf, behind the book, “Turn of the Screw.” Why does Desmond know this, and why is it hidden?
- Film canister is labeled “ORIENTATION” with a Dharma logo.
- Sawyer questions Jin in locked pit, about who the other people are. Only English word Jin comes up with is “Others.”
- Black man tosses Ana Lucia into pit.
- Jack, to Locke: “You sure seem calm for someone who believes the world is going to end in the next 45 minutes.” Locke calmly replies, “He’ll fix it.”
- Jack: “The last time I saw the computer that was going to save the world, it didn’t look like that.”
- Locke, to Jack after Jack claims that Desmond’s story is “impossible”: “Is the reason you’re so upset because he said he recognized you? Because that would be impossible.”
- Film: THE DHARMA INITIATIVE 3 OF 6 ORIENTATION ORIENTATION – STATION 3 – THE SWAN Transcript:
Welcome. I’m Dr. Marvin Candle, and this is the orientation film for Station 3… <break>…initiative. In a moment, you’ll be given a typical set of instructions for how you and your partner will fulfill the responsibilities associated with the station.
But first, a little history. The Dharma Initiative was created in 1970, and is the brainchild of Gerald and Karen LeGroot, two doctoral candidates at the University of Michigan. Following in the footsteps of visionaries such as B. F. Skinner, …<break> [another voice, sounds like “Matt”]… envisioned a large-scale communal research compound, where scientists and free thinkers from around the globe could pursue research in meteorology, psychology, parapsychology, zoology [here the film shows two polar bears in combat], electromagnetism, and utopian social cruci…<break>…Danish industrialist and munitions magnate Alvar Hanso, who’s financial backing made their dream of a multi-purpose social science research facility a reality.
You and your partner are currently located in Station 3, or, the Swan, and will be for the next 540 [108x5] days. Now, Station 3 was originally constructed as a laboratory, where scientists could work to understand the unique electromagnetic fluctuations emanating from this sector of the island.
Not long after the experiments began, however, there was – an incident. And since that time, the following protocol has been observed: Every 108 minutes, the button must be pushed. From the moment the alarm sounds, you will have four minutes to enter the code into the microcomputer processor. …<break>…introduction into the program. When the alarm sounds, either you or your partner must input the code. It is highly recommended that you and your partner take alternating shifts. In this manner, you will stay as fresh and alert…<break>…of utmost importance that when the alarm sounds, the code be entered correctly and in a timely fashion. Now, do not attempt to use the computer…<break>…for anything.
Congratulations. Until your replacements arrive, the future of the project is in your hands. On behalf of the LeGroots, Alver Hanso, and all of us at the Dharma Initiative, thank you, namaste, and good luck.


- Dr. Candle’s left arm hangs motionless throughout the film.
- Last segment of music in the introduction is similar to track music heard in other episodes.
- Just after the mention of B. F. Skinner, it sounds as if someone has substituted another name (Matt?) for the LeGroots, i.e., that someone else is claiming credit for the vision of the large-scale research compound.
- “…electromagnetic fluctuations emanating from this sector of the island. [emphasis mine.] Implies that the island is the main, or perhaps only, site involved in the Dharma Initiative.
- Reference to “3 of 6” and “Station 3” suggests there may be at least five additional research stations on or near the island. One could be offshore (remember the cable).
- Alvar Hanso resembles Leslie Nielson (Some say CSM from “The X Files”)
- “Namaste” is a greeting of eastern origin, normally accompanied by a specific gesture involving placing palms of hands together in front of heart and bowing. Dr. Candle uses only his right hand. What’s wrong with his left arm?
- Jack’s refusal to re-watch the film seems odd. Whether he believes the contents or not, it would seem at least to be a potential source of information on where they are and how/why they ended up there.
- FB: Helen gives Locke a key to her place on their 6-month anniversary.
- Michael and Sawyer determine that Ana Lucia is a survivor from the tail section of the plane.
- Ana Lucia claims that “they” found her yesterday, and that she doesn’t know who “they” are. (If true, “they” are not survivors from the crash, and Ana Lucia may be the only survivor from the tail section.)
- Sawyer refers to the black man as “Shaft.”
- Jack thinks the whole thing (pushing the button, etc.) is a “mind game.” He asks Desmond if he ever considered that possibility. Desmond: “Every Single Day!!”
- Desmond: “For all our sakes, I hope it’s not real. But the film says this is an electromagnetic station. And I don’t know about you, brother, but every time I walk past that concrete wall out there, my fillings hurt.”
- Religious reference: Desmond makes the sign of the cross just before throwing the switch (which trips the breaker).
- Book near Desmond’s vaccine stash: “The Third Policeman” by Flann O’brien. [Book is described as a “brilliant comic novel about the nature of time, death, and existence. Hmmmm…]
- Jack sees a photo which appears to show Desmond with an unknown woman. There are high-rise buildings in the background.
- Clock reads 47:00 when Desmond leaves.
- FB: Locke returns to father’s house after promising Helen he would not. Helen forces him to choose between her and his past.
- Clock reads 25:00 when Kate returns with Sayid and Hurley. While looking for the breaker box, Hurly discovers the pantry.
- Sawyer refers to Ana Lucia as “Sweetheart” and “Cupcake.”
- Ana Lucia grabs gun from Sawyer, yells “Coming up!” and is pulled from pit. Looks like she was planted there. Black man says, “What happened? Who are they?”
- Jack confronts Desmond in jungle. Desmond gives Jack the code, then recalls their meeting while running in the stadium in LA. Desmond asks what happened to the girl, Jack replies “I married her!!!” in a scene eerily similar to Kate’s admission to Jack regarding the toy plane (in season 1).
- Desmond’s parting words to Jack – again: “See you in another life, yeah?”
- Locke enters the last number wrong (32 instead of 42). Hurley, concerned about the numbers, tries to stop Locke until he sees the error, then says go ahead. But Jack arrives and corrects Locke on the last number. Locke changes it. Jack hits “execute” with one second left on the counter.
- Locke describes hitting the button as a leap of faith. But the real leap of faith, at least for Jack, would seem to be NOT hitting the button and letting the clock run down to zero.

Hey everyone! I don't have any observations off the top of my head (I was hooking up my new computer- YAY!- and didn't take notes while Lost was on this time) but I wanted to say, "Hello!" So many familiar handles in this thread...just wanted to say, "Hi".

Same here, Flora. It's good to see familiar names with all the new folks around.

HEY Y'ALL. EVERYBODY!!!

Hi guys, we'll be setting up the LLL gathering thread for Everybody Hates Hurley soon if not all ready. Thanks for all your help!

Bondage Subcategory? Blindfolded
1.11
Charlie found hung in a tree blindfolded
2.03
Jin claims to have been blindfolded when he was captured
2.03
In the Orientation video 2 experimental subjects are blindfolded
a man strapped into some sort of apparatus
a woman pointing at a red ball (between a green and blue ball)


Found another one if you guys are interested in this list.
1.18 Hurley blindfolds his mom with a red bandana to surprise her with a new house.

:lol: It's so SnM ! Creme, I know we need to keep it clean on the LLL but it would be funny if we drifted in a clean way (if that's possible) to the SnM thing, I love the blindfolds and handcuffs and tied up stuff. It's a great addition! Thanks Ducky!

:blshing1:

I hear ya, does make you blush. But awesome observations. I am not aware of anyone else mentioning all the "bound" connections.

just in case you want to cross reference, my tallys for this episode are now posted in the first AND last post of the thread "master list orientation"
sooooooooooooo psyched for tonight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks, NP. For convenience, could you post a direct link to your list here?

I hope you are feeling better.

Do we have listed that there is a yellow geiger counter on the bookshelves? Desmond takes it off when he is looking for the jar with the stuff he used to try and fix the computer.

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=737&pos=235 The picture on the wall, is that Uluru (Ayres Rock) ? Probably not the trees or is it cactus don't look right.

Ayer's rock, rocks. I just read some stuff about it recently. It's very mystical.

What about the funky box on the table with the pointy top?

There is a tape on the table and on the shelf, can anyone read what they say?

There's also a piece of paper on the floor by Jack that might have something interesting on it?

Did we already notice the globe by the chair?