In previous episodes we have questioned who Jacob was. Nows we know he is equivalent to God in this groups eyes.

So once again...Who is Jacob?

In "Maternity Leave" a list was talked about. Once Ben's surgery was started and Tom went out to kill Sawyer, he mentioned that Jack wasn't even on Jacob's list. I think he must be the one Ben answers to and perhaps the guy with the patch that Locke's group saw during the episode that Mr. Eko died in.

I think the message flashed up during the brainwashing video was a reference to the Biblical Jacob - of course, it is a parallel to the Lost Jacob. Wasn't it something like "God loves you as he loves Jacob?

Biblical Jacob changed his name to Israel, being the father of the twelve tribes. And Israel is the Holy Land. Again, I think this is all obvious parallel to Lost.

Jacob I have loved, Essau I hated

Jacob tricked Essau out of his birthright as Isaac's oldest son.

But I don't know how that would fit into Lost...I still think it has to do with the chosen people.

Yep, Jacob and Esau. Did Jacob kill Esau or was it the other way around? The younger of these twins killed the older in order to gain his father's love and inheritance. Obviously, that backfired.

Jacob I have loved, Essau I hated

Romans 9:13.

I think it would be so kool and shocking if Paulo was Jacob!!!! even tho hes a little young to be ordering around Ben lol.

Neither twin killed the other. Esau vowed to kill Jacob in revenge but was appeased by the gifts Jacob gave him (there's a long story there). The brothers buried their father together.

Yep, Jacob and Esau. Did Jacob kill Esau or was it the other way around? The younger of these twins killed the older in order to gain his father's love and inheritance. Obviously, that backfired.


Sounds like he's a "Bad Twin"!

Neither twin killed the other. Esau vowed to kill Jacob in revenge but was appeased by the gifts Jacob gave him (there's a long story there). The brothers buried their father together.

Thank you! It'sbeen a long time since Sunday School for me! I think I will look up that story again. See what I can see. Thanks so much.

Thank you! It'sbeen a long time since Sunday School for me! I think I will look up that story again. See what I can see. Thanks so much.

:) Been a long time for me too! I remember the story because of my childhood (no, I didn't have a bad twin, lol).

Sounds like he's a "Bad Twin"!

lol Amen!

So, I donno if anyone else noticed this but in the 6th episode as "picket" goes out to kill sawyer he says "ben just put his life in one of the hands of them, plus, shepard (jack) wasn't even on JACOB's List!!!!" this shows that there is something bigger controlling the others, I think. And that ben has power to step in and add things in to the will of whoever jacob is.
THEN! in the 7th episode, in the room where alex's boyfriend is being tortured, the phrase "God loves you as he loved jacob" appears on the screen. Insane, but another easter egg!

So, I donno if anyone else noticed this but in the 6th episode as "picket" goes out to kill sawyer he says "ben just put his life in one of the hands of them, plus, shepard (jack) wasn't even on JACOB's List!!!!" this shows that there is something bigger controlling the others, I think. And that ben has power to step in and add things in to the will of whoever jacob is.
THEN! in the 7th episode, in the room where alex's boyfriend is being tortured, the phrase "God loves you as he loved jacob" appears on the screen. Insane, but another easter egg!
YES! i caught that too and am very puzzled as to who jacob is... mabey he is the real leader??

Brilliant catch. I couldn't remember where I had heard the Jacob reference before. With all the biblical references on this show, can you see any connection to the story of Jacob in the bible? I looked it up quick. Jacob was a twin (the good twin) and although 2nd born inherited the birth right of his father Isaac, instead of his brother Esau (the bad twin) after a long exile. During the exile, he fell in love with a woman, RACHEL, and married her and her two sisters. He had 12 children. The last child was born to Rachel and was named BENJAMIN. Rachel died in labor with Benjamin.
So, is Jacob Ben's father?

Brilliant catch. I couldn't remember where I had heard the Jacob reference before. With all the biblical references on this show, can you see any connection to the story of Jacob in the bible? I looked it up quick. Jacob was a twin (the good twin) and although 2nd born inherited the birth right of his father Isaac, instead of his brother Esau (the bad twin) after a long exile. During the exile, he fell in love with a woman, RACHEL, and married her and her two sisters. He had 12 children. The last child was born to Rachel and was named BENJAMIN. Rachel died in labor with Benjamin.
So, is Jacob Ben's father?

And is it coincidence that Juliette's sister's name is Rachel? Obviously Ben's not her son, but another connection....

...Jacob was a twin (the good twin) and although 2nd born inherited the birth right of his father Isaac, instead of his brother Esau (the bad twin) after a long exile. During the exile, he fell in love with a woman, RACHEL, and married her and her two sisters. He had 12 children. The last child was born to Rachel and was named BENJAMIN. Rachel died in labor with Benjamin.
So, is Jacob Ben's father?

Good observation, I however am going to disagree with you by calling Jacob the good twin and Esau the bad twin. They both weren't that great. Jacob wasn't that great because he tricked his brother into giving up Esau's birthright, and on top of that, Jacob tricked his blind, dying father into giving the blessing.
Neither was Esau that great, either, because he was initially out to seek vengeance by killing his brother for what he had done.

While I notice you perhaps are trying to link that with "The Bad Twin," I just wanted to point out that Jacob was not so moral as Church might portray him to be, instead he was a trickster. The only reason he was recognized was not becaused of what he did, but because he was chosen by God.

while reading this thread it occurred to me that one of the hints here is the brother and twin connection again, maybe what we need to be asking is who is Jacob's brother, as much as, who is jacob...just a thought :)

To continue our Sunday School lesson . . . Jacob's wife Leah's sister is Rachel, and after being unable to conceive, she finally gave birth to two sons, Joseph and Benjamin, and died while delivering a breech birth.

Creeeepy

All the Biblical stuff is plenty to chew on, not to mention Jacob's Ladder folklore (Naveen recommended Jacob's Ladder movie as a possible clue).

But I think "God loves you as he loves Jacob"+"He wasn't even on Jacob's list" seems to indicate a living, messiah-type figure. Some of the darker ones in recent memory have been David Koresh, Jim Jones, etc. Perhaps the Others are a religious cult, in addition to whatever else they may be.

Still thinking over that Hindu/Viking/pop music/wordless funeral. Except for that, the Others' day-to-day customs have been white-bread-American "normal" to the point of being ridiculous (book club, muffins, cheeseburgers, etc.).

Jacob I have loved, Essau I hated

Yeah anytime you see God and the name Jacob is should be eluding to the bible. Even if Jacob is a real person on the island..there is biblical parallel to the above scripture.

Jacob was the chosen one---Esau was not. This choice was made even before they were born..before either did good or bad-- it was just Gods sovereign choice. Jacob was special--that fits in with the show I think.

I suspect it may well be Jacob's prophetic/dream interpretive powers that may be most relevant here. They have or have recently had a Jacob, perhaps a Walt-like person they have utilized. Could they not be grooming (or trying to groom) Karl to be the next one? Only problem is, he's a little rebellious.

I think Jacob is the man that wanted Juliet to come work for him!

I think they were brainwashing Karl because Alex's "father" did not approve of their relationship. Whether it was regular "fatherly" love or that they have a plan for Alex that Karl was interfering with by his relation ship with Alex....I cannot say.

anyone think that jacob was the man that approached julls at the morgue? all we catch is his last name?
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sorry this is new to me again... does anyone think jacob is the man that approahed juliette at work and offered her a job?

okay...since no one else will state the obvious, I will. The biblical Leah had 2 sons Benjamin(Ben) and Jacob(yet to be determined). So based on this, I think its safe to say Jacob will be Bens brother, perhaps a twin?

Yeah anytime you see God and the name Jacob is should be eluding to the bible. Even if Jacob is a real person on the island..there is biblical parallel to the above scripture.

Jacob was the chosen one---Esau was not. This choice was made even before they were born..before either did good or bad-- it was just Gods sovereign choice. Jacob was special--that fits in with the show I think.

I second this. There's also a parallel in that Jacob "did what he had to do" to get his father's blessing and the Others seem to have the same "means justify the ends" mentality about doing "good". I don't think that Jacob is necessarily anything more than a metaphor here. I don't think that Jacob's List is literal either but a "chosen people" reference. I could be wrong though.

okay...since no one else will state the obvious, I will. The biblical Leah had 2 sons Benjamin(Ben) and Jacob(yet to be determined). So based on this, I think its safe to say Jacob will be Bens brother, perhaps a twin?

You might want to check up on your Biblical research before you say that no one is stating the obvious. Leah had 6 kids: Rueben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Issachar and Zebulun (and a daughter Dinah). Rachel had Joseph, which was Jacob's favorite, and then died giving birth to Benjamin. Jacob's other kids were from servants. Check Gen 29:31

anyone think that jacob was the man that approached julls at the morgue? all we catch is his last name?
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sorry this is new to me again... does anyone think jacob is the man that approahed juliette at work and offered her a job?

I like that theory :)

Jacob, together with Esau, was born to Isaac and Rebekah. During Rebekah's pregnancy, "the children struggled together within her" (Genesis 25:22). According to Rashi, whenever Rebeccah passed a house of study, Jacob would struggle to get out; whenever she passed a temple of idolatry, Esau would struggle to get out. Esau was the firstborn. His brother Jacob was born immediately afterwards, and was grasping Esau's heel. His name, Ya'akov , derives from the Hebrew root or "heel." Rebekah prophetically intuited Esau's murderous intentions, and commanded Jacob to flee to the house of her brother, Laban.

Jacob loved Rachel more than anything in the world, and Leah felt hated. God opened Leah's womb and she gave birth to four sons in succession: Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah. Rachel, however, was barren, and gave Jacob her handmaid Bilhah in marriage so she could raise children through her. Bilhah gave birth to Dan and Naphtali. Seeing that she had left off childbearing temporarily, Leah then gave her handmaid Zilpah to Jacob in marriage so she could raise more children through her. Zilpah gave birth to Gad and Asher. (According to some , Bilhah and Zilpah were younger daughters of Laban). Afterwards, Leah became fertile again and gave birth to Issachar, Zebulun, and Dinah. At this point, God remembered Rachel, who gave birth to Joseph. Various interpretations of biblical passages suggest that Jacob's favoritism of Rachel over Leah passed over to their children; some commentators feel that this plays an important role in the later attempt on Joseph's life by his half-brothers. As Jacob and his entourage neared the border of Canaan, Rachel went into labor and died as she gave birth to her second—and Jacob's twelfth—son, Benjamin.


Benjamin:
Benjamin (standard transliteration Benyamin, Tiberian vocalization Benyamîn) is a Hebrew Bible figure. The name literally translates to "son of right," generally taken to mean "son of my right hand," but in some rabbinical traditions is "son of the right side [of the body]" or "son of the south," the youngest son of Jacob and Rachel (Genesis 35:18). The "right" direction had the connotation of strength or desirability. In the Samaritan Pentateuch,(Binyamim), which may indicate a neutralization of nasal-final endings, or may imply a different analysis, as, "son of days", implying the son of Jacob's old age (as he is described in Genesis 44:20).
His birth took place on the road between Bethel and Ephrath, which is identified with Bethlehem (Genesis 35:19). His mother Rachael died in childbirth, and with her last breath named him Ben-oni ("son of my pain"), an ill-omened name which was changed by his father into Binyamin. His posterity were the tribe of Benjamin, sometimes translated "Benjamites" (Genesis 49:27; Deuteronomy 33:12; Joshua 18:21).
The tribe of Benjamin at the Exodus was the smallest aside from Manasseh, which was split off from Joseph (Numbers 1:34-1:37; Psalms 68:27). During the march its place was along with Manasseh and Ephraim on the west of the tabernacle. At the entrance into Canaan it counted 45,600 warriors. It has been inferred by some from the words of Jacob (Genesis 49:27) that the figure of a wolf was on the tribal standard: "Benjamin is a wolf that raveneth; in the morning he shall devour the prey, at evening he shall divide the spoil."
This tribe is mentioned in Epistle to the Romans 11:1 and Philippians 3:5.
The inheritance of this tribe lay immediately to the south of that of Ephraim, and was about 26 miles in length and 12 in breadth. Its eastern boundary was the Jordan. Dan intervened between it and the Philistines. Its chief towns are named in Josh. 18:21-28.
The history of the tribe contains a sad record of a desolating civil war in which they were engaged with the other eleven tribes; they were almost exterminated (Judg. 20:20, 21; 21:10).
The first king of the Jews was Saul, a Benjamite. A close alliance was formed between this tribe and that of Judah in the time of David (2 Sam. 19:16, 17), which continued after his death (1 Kings 11:13; 12:20). After the Exile these two tribes formed the great body of the Jewish nation (Ezra 1:5; 10:9), and to this day the other ten are referred to as the lost tribes of Israel. The tribe of Benjamin was famous for its archers (1 Sam. 20:20, 36; 2 Sam. 1:22; 1 Chr. 8:40; 12:2) and slingers (Judges 20:16).

So Rachael gives birth to Joseph and Benjamin in the bible. We have a Ben ( No joseph yet ) I don't like the theory Im about to give but since there is tons of talk about time being off on the island and the xray of a 26 year old woman having the womb of a 70 years old - Again, I hate saying that the island will make people speed up there age-but what if Rachael, Juliets sister is in fact Bens mother. So Juliets history with ben would be she is his aunt. Anyway. i think is ridiculous as I type it but figured id put it out. A theory I do not mind so much but probably wouldn't work would be that maybe Jacob is Rachaels child and isn't a man at all but just a boy and since he was conceived through a "miracle" they view him as some messiah type. Any thoughts?

we keep asking who is jacob. What if Jacob isn't a person, but an entity of some sorts, like a group of people, maybe JACOB is an acronym for something. I realize that in the brainwashing video, it makes reference to Jacob, but this may be just a coincidence that the writers threw in there to confuse us. I'm not convinced that Jacob is a person. Any thoughts on this?

Kinda like "D.H.A.R.M.A.", huh? I like that theory.

but then what is JACOBS list??

I think Jacob is the guy with the eye patch that Locke and the others saw in the observation post. That guy was suuuper creepy and seemed none too suprised that other people are on the island. In fact the way he shut the camara off it almost seemed like he had intended to breifly reveal himself to them once they figured out how to opperate the observation post's systems.

Jacob could be Jacob Vanderfield from the lost experience. I believe he is a boad member of HF

i see your point about jacob and esau and i thought about it as i was writing this because that portion of the story always bothered me. jacob is certainly not a "good" person by today's standards, but by biblical standards he was, and as the story is traditionally told, he is the good or favored of the twins and esau is the more selfish, rowdy or less favored twin. what's important about why the lost producers may have chosen this name for what the person who appears to be the patriarch of the others is not whether the real person that jacob was is really good in every way, but rather the major themes that his character has traditionally been associated with. the old habit of identifying one twin as good and one as bad and how that can spark a life long rivalry between the twins, takes it roots in this bible story.

Jacob tricked his blind, dying father into giving the blessing.
Jacob was not so moral as Church might portray him to be, instead he was a trickster.
So if Jacob IS the leader of the Others, who do you think he is deceiving? At first glance you would think the trick is being played on the Losties (with all the mystery and freakiness of the Island) - but what if he is really playing a game with Ben, Juliet, and the rest of the Others? :39:

Essentially I guess the question is, "What is the trick and who is Jacob playing it on?"

The eye patch guy is called Mikhail Bakunin played by Andrew Divoff. Its a shame that Patchy isn't Jacob or even Easu.

From what Danny said to Jason about ''Shephard not being on Jacob's list.'' Which meant Jacob is still on the island {or alive anyway} & he is the leader of the Others {the mastermind behind all of this; the reason why there were a war & why the Others captured the Losties & the kids, why they needed Aaron & Walt, etc}.


Jacob's son Benjamin is second in command, who follows orders from his father.

The Others are very religious, so they might be following a cult of some kind, maybe Jacob's cult, who knows?
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Jacob could be Ethan, after all Ben told him to make a list from the main group and Danny said Jack wasn't even on Jacob's list.

Jacob could be Ethan, after all Ben told him to make a list from the main group and Danny said Jack wasn't even on Jacob's list.


Ethan never made his list, becaus he became obsesed about Claire and so brought her back and hung Charlie

I wonder if JACOB could be another military acronym, like DHARMA... Specifically, a military computer program...

I wonder if JACOB could be another military acronym, like DHARMA... Specifically, a military computer program...

I agree with this, I think JACOB isn't a person, it's a SOMETHING