Locke constantly talks about what was "supposed" to happen. He always takes everything in stride. He knocked out Sayid when they tried to triangulate the signal of Rousseau, seeming to know that it was a bad idea. He told Boone when it was going to rain. So, is it fair to assume that Locke is experiencing something similar to Desmond?

Possibly he was so shaken by finding the Pearl because he had not found it in any of his past time loops, so for once, he didn't know what to do?

That's right--he's always predicting the rain!!

Finding the Pearl station has nothing to do with those two occurrences, though. It happened after both of them. I didn't think about Locke knocking out Sayid... I think that's just Locke being, well, Locke. However, when it started raining on Desmond after he told Charlie that it was going to start raining, my mind immediately went to Locke telling Boone that it was going to start raining .. and then it did. I think it's a fair guess that Locke, when his paralysis was cured through the island's healing powers, received a little of the same thing Desmond did, just maybe not to the degree that Desmond did.

I'm starting to think about how the island seems to help people with flaws they had pre-island. For Locke and Rose, their transformation was obvious. But for others, we have seen people struggling to change: Juliette (from meek to leader), Kate (from running fugitive to good-girlfriend team player), Sawyer (from sleazy conman to hero), etc. So perhaps Desmond was all about not being able to fight his own destiny and make his own fate and this is what he is struggling with? That would make it a uniquely Desmondy thing...

If locke and desmond both predicted it would START raining because they had some sort of time travel, what does that say about walt who basically predicted it would STOP raining?

If locke and desmond both predicted it would START raining because they had some sort of time travel, what does that say about walt who basically predicted it would STOP raining?

We have seen loads of examples of this, Locke knew where to find Charlies Guitar in The Moth, Goodwin knew where to find Bernard, Rose knew Bernard was alive, Hurley knew Libby etc etc

I thought about locke a lot as well during Des' "flash" (back? forward? sideways?). The rain thing, was a big hint to us, I think.

another thing in the island universe that shows flashes of the past is smokey. Maybe smokey is related, and Locke (and Eko) have been given weaker versions of the time travel that Des' experienced.

Come to think of it, many on the island have had flashes from their past since landing. Maybe it happens to everyone and it's all related, but there are degrees of intensity - run of the mill horse in the woods, smokey-vision, and purple sky?

The scene with Desmond waking up on the floor immediately reminded me of John waking up on the beach, on their backs, dazed. What's more interesting is that they both then proceeded to predict the rain, and John knew exactly where to leave Jack and Kate to go off with Boone to "discover" the hatch, by dropping his flashlight. John couldn't save Boone, he was destined to die.


Anyway, if that isn't too confuddled, and you can follow what I am getting at, does anyone have any more evidence to Locke having gone through the same type of thing, but the terminus of his 'loop' was waking on the beach? Any counter evidence?

The scene with Desmond waking up on the floor immediately reminded me of John waking up on the beach, on their backs, dazed. What's more interesting is that they both then proceeded to predict the rain, and John knew exactly where to leave Jack and Kate to go off with Boone to "discover" the hatch, by dropping his flashlight. John couldn't save Boone, he was destined to die.


Anyway, if that isn't too confuddled, and you can follow what I am getting at, does anyone have any more evidence to Locke having gone through the same type of thing, but the terminus of his 'loop' was waking on the beach? Any counter evidence?

Interesting theory, klalkis.

Doesn't Jack wake up on his back, too?

It would make sense, since Des told both men, "See you in another life, Brother."

I was just thinking about this.

Locke is a precog too, 'cause he's been through all this before too. I think he came back in time to the island, similarly to how Desmond went back in time.

Remember when they were in the Hatch in Orientation and Locke shouted "This isn't what was supposed to happen!" So what WAS supposed to happen, Mr. Genius? :D How would you know what was supposed to happen?

As klalkis points out above, John knew how to predict the rain, where the Hatch was, he conveniently makes a cradle for Claire when it just so happens to be her birthday (at a time when otherwise his character seemed to care about nothing other than the Hatch, why this sudden departure to build the cradle?), he seemed to know how to find the boar too. Maybe he can't pick up a trail to save his life, he just knows where everyone's going to be. Was "Daybreak" the clue right under our noses?

John Locke doesn't want to get off the island, because he knows that if he does, his legs will get broken. Chew on that one for a bit :D

Also interesting is that Charlie has been saved now by Desmond, Locke (who helped him get off drugs) and Jack.

Anybody else save Charlie's life in this show?

Based on the support in the few quick replies, I think my idea is being well recieved (Not saying I'm right, just that there is actual support for the idea).

now: Jack. Wakes up on his back in the Jungle, but have we had any instance of him knowing more than he could have, or any other things that would suggest this?

It is possible Jack just repressed it better, and then Ben needed to "change his perspective" so that he could see what choices had to be made, who had to live or die, etc...

i bet you john looped back during the crash and stopped whatever happened to him to paralize him. so when he looped back to the island he could walk!

I think the Locke idea is plausible, but I don't know about Jack. I can't think of any instances where he knew anything extraordinary. Plus, they had just been thrown out of an airplane, it's definitely possible that he'd land on his back - there doesn't need to be time travel involved. I think the Locke idea is interesting and something to maybe consider, but Jack? I think that's looking a bit much into things.

No I dont think it happend with Locke because of a few things why did he allow BOONE to DIE and why did he teach Mike how to shoot a gun when he knew that he would KILL ANNA and LIBBY. Also why didnt he just go around to the entrace to the Hatch door if he knew what would happen and what was there

Also interesting is that Charlie has been saved now by Desmond, Locke (who helped him get off drugs) and Jack.

Anybody else save Charlie's life in this show?


Save the awkward recovering heroin addict one hit wonder rock star, save the world.:)

I think the Locke idea is plausible, but I don't know about Jack. I can't think of any instances where he knew anything extraordinary. Plus, they had just been thrown out of an airplane, it's definitely possible that he'd land on his back - there doesn't need to be time travel involved. I think the Locke idea is interesting and something to maybe consider, but Jack? I think that's looking a bit much into things.

Didn't Jack use the little bottle of alcohol to sterilize his wound that Kate sewed up?

On the plane, just before the crash, he asked the stewardess (Cindy) to give him more alcohol, which she does and he puts it in his coat.

Jack also found the caves with the fresh water and convinces many people to go there.

Jack has the idea to go look for the transciever in the front of the plane.

Jack switches packs with Kate so he is the one carrying the dynamite away from the Black Rock.

Jack doesn't really seem all that surprised to see Kate and Sawyer in the afterglow in Sawyer's cage.

He is also very adamant that Kate NOT come back for him at the end of last week.

There's probably more.

Well, it seems this episode has opened up a whole new can of worms, hasn't it?

I don't think Locke is experiencing anything similar to Desmond. When he talks about what is "supposed" to happen, this comes from something contradicting his faith.

Didn't Jack use the little bottle of alcohol to sterilize his wound that Kate sewed up?

On the plane, just before the crash, he asked the stewardess (Cindy) to give him more alcohol, which she does and he puts it in his coat.

Jack also found the caves with the fresh water and convinces many people to go there.

Jack has the idea to go look for the transciever in the front of the plane.

Jack switches packs with Kate so he is the one carrying the dynamite away from the Black Rock.

Jack doesn't really seem all that surprised to see Kate and Sawyer in the afterglow in Sawyer's cage.

He is also very adamant that Kate NOT come back for him at the end of last week.

There's probably more.

Hmm, methinks you're trying too hard to make it fit. None of those seem like precognition - rather, they're just common sense decisions on Jack's behalf.

Locke constantly talks about what was "supposed" to happen. He always takes everything in stride. He knocked out Sayid when they tried to triangulate the signal of Rousseau, seeming to know that it was a bad idea. He told Boone when it was going to rain. So, is it fair to assume that Locke is experiencing something similar to Desmond?


Either that or he is taking everything in stride because he literally could not before the crash. Locke seems to be a man who is living each moment like it could be his last, obviously because he has previously had pretty much everything taken away from him. Now he has it back and is not making the mistake of taking it for granted.

I agree that the events listed are a bit of a stretch to assign precog notions to Jack, but we have seen some hints of "time independent vision" from Jack (His dad walking around the island). Also hurley, eko, kate, and maybe others I am forgetting. The "men of faith" are able to embrace the unknown and gain some bits of precog from the phenomena, where the "men of science" suppress it.

at least that's my working theory :)

I was just thinking about this.

Locke is a precog too, 'cause he's been through all this before too. I think he came back in time to the island, similarly to how Desmond went back in time.

Remember when they were in the Hatch in Orientation and Locke shouted "This isn't what was supposed to happen!" So what WAS supposed to happen, Mr. Genius? :D How would you know what was supposed to happen?

As klalkis points out above, John knew how to predict the rain, where the Hatch was, he conveniently makes a cradle for Claire when it just so happens to be her birthday (at a time when otherwise his character seemed to care about nothing other than the Hatch, why this sudden departure to build the cradle?), he seemed to know how to find the boar too. Maybe he can't pick up a trail to save his life, he just knows where everyone's going to be. Was "Daybreak" the clue right under our noses?



John Locke doesn't want to get off the island, because he knows that if he does, his legs will get broken. Chew on that one for a bit :D
LOL. Good post. Interesting thoughts to ponder. I DO remember Locke saying "this isn't what was supposed to happen!" How WOULD he know??

No I dont think it happend with Locke because of a few things why did he allow BOONE to DIE and why did he teach Mike how to shoot a gun when he knew that he would KILL ANNA and LIBBY. Also why didnt he just go around to the entrace to the Hatch door if he knew what would happen and what was there

maybe boone was supposed to die when he first went after the drowning woman, but jack saved him... so then the universe course corrected when he went in the plane. Locke may have been trying to save him but he was powerless to stop Boone from climbing in the plane cause of his legs. he can't see the definitive future, only things that will happen, and he can only try to stop them from happening under the circumstances he sees, but it'll find another way to happen.

maybe boone was supposed to die when he first went after the drowning woman, but jack saved him... so then the universe course corrected when he went in the plane. Locke may have been trying to save him but he was powerless to stop Boone from climbing in the plane cause of his legs. he can't see the definitive future, only things that will happen, and he can only try to stop them from happening under the circumstances he sees, but it'll find another way to happen.

IF he is reliving his life then why would he give his "Dad" his kidney for a second time and why on Earth would he get on a PLANE that he knew that would crash

On the possibility of Jack being a pre-cog, one motivation for having his character become such a thing is that it would provide an explanation for why he has such a hard time with faith. 'Cause he already knows he's going nowhere. One example not previously mentioned was when Jack insisted that Kate stay behind in "The Hunting Party", yet she followed anyway and got herself bagged.

One also has to keep in mind that just because you go back in time (if you could), doesn't necessarily mean you retain the memories of what "will" happen, because essentially they haven't happened yet. It would make sense that they show up in fragments, because in some twisted way they still exist as a potential possibility for one of a million different futures. You might be prone to having "flashes" of that one specific future out of billions of possible futures, if for no other reason than the fact that you overcame insurmountable odds (as we all do daily) to experience that one specific future that belonged to you.

maybe boone was supposed to die when he first went after the drowning woman, but jack saved him... so then the universe course corrected when he went in the plane. Locke may have been trying to save him but he was powerless to stop Boone from climbing in the plane cause of his legs...

Locke was still in "mystic" territory with Boone - "The sacrifice that the Island demanded." (I got the feeling that he let Boone go so the Island would give him his legs back.)

If the universe course corrected for anyone, it was Eko. First the implosion of the hatch, then the polar bear swats him around, finally good ole Smokey decides to take direct action. Yikes. Dude was destiny doomed incarnate.

IF he is reliving his life then why would he give his "Dad" his kidney for a second time and why on Earth would he get on a PLANE that he knew that would crash

Because they just get flashes of previous loops, like deja vu, or intuition, people ignore that all the time if it doesn't suit their purpose.

If there is group of people and I have to pick out the one who might have pre-cognitive abilities...

:drowsy:

...I would pick the one who won the lottery.