And raised by another? He'd be Penny's brother? It would be kind of interesting, and fit with the theme of conspiratorial Big Daddies. Maybe his mother participated in the same "design" as Locke's. Probably this has been hashed over, but I couldn't find anything.

Also, I wonder if somehow Desmond is interfering with things by repeatedly saving Charlie, and they want to trick him into thinking that it's fruitless, that he doesn't have free will, so that he'll stop trying to save Charlie (who in turn keeps saving Claire and protecting Aaron)?

Good questions. If you believe the old lady is really "the island" she is trying to manipulate Desmond into believing that the universe course corrects and fate is unchangeable. But that may merely be the island's agenda (remember Locke saying "the island" killed Eko). This may be one sacrifice the island is demanding that it's not going to get.

As for the idea of Charlie being Widmore's secret love child, it's been raised in several excellent fanfics. The idea being that Widmore had an affair with Meghan Pace and they agreed to keep it secret and Meghan and her husband would raise the child as her own. That would not only make Charlie Penny's brother but also another heir to the Widmore fortune. I don't know that there's anything to support it yet, but it's an interesting idea that would put Charlie right at the center of the story. Pretty cool for those of us who believed he was at the center of things all along.

Charlies dad is a butcher, we saw this in fire + water.

Charlies dad is a butcher, we saw this in fire + water.

No, we know that. That's the dad that raised him, but he may not have been his biological dad. Kate thought her father was Austin and it turned out to be Wayne. Maybe Charlie's mom had an affair with Widmore and her husband never knew. I know it's a stretch but that's how the theory goes.

It could be Charlie is half-brother to Penny. But, if that is the case, will they still go with the possibility of Claire being Jack's half-sister?

It could be Charlie is half-brother to Penny. But, if that is the case, will they still go with the possibility of Claire being Jack's half-sister?

Sure, why not? :rolleyes: It may be a bit soap operish but I don't think one story line excludes the other.

Soapish yes, but it would be rather beautiful if Desmond discovered that the guy he had been saving was Penny's half-brother. I mean the Jack/Claire thing is far-fetched enough - so why not just go bananas with these Lostee connections.

BTW I've written a fanfic myself about Charlie and Penny being possible siblings. Click on my sig link and look at a story called 'Father Knows Best' if you're interested.

This is an extremely well thought out possibility! The fact that these parents could all possibly be part of a group like the Dharma Inititive or something....or even ex dharma people.

Think about how some of these parents have power.....

Sun's dad.
Jack's dad was wealthy before he lost his license.
Penny's Dad


These three could easily have something to do with what is happening on the island. I have suspected a relation between Sun and the people in the orientation video....I know I know, there are more then 3 korean people on this earth, but with all the connections it wouldn't surprise me.

Soapish yes, but it would be rather beautiful if Desmond discovered that the guy he had been saving was Penny's half-brother. I mean the Jack/Claire thing is far-fetched enough - so why not just go bananas with these Lostee connections.

BTW I've written a fanfic myself about Charlie and Penny being possible siblings. Click on my sig link and look at a story called 'Father Knows Best' if you're interested.

Maybe Desmond already knows that Charlie is Penny's half brother? With all that's going on with him, maybe he learned on one of his trips forwards backwards or sideways.

I love fanfic, will check out yours!

Charlie and Penny have slightly more of a family resemblance than Jack and Claire. If there are any long-lost siblings I think I would prefer them to be Charlie and Penny.

Although Charlie could possibly be related to the Widmores, there hasn't been any possible evidence of it, at least not in this thread. Where did the idea come from? At least there is a little evidence to suggest that Jack and Claire are half-siblings. As far as Charlie goes though, I haven't heard anything at all to suggest this. Am I missing something, or is this some kind of wishful thinking?:confused:

There really isn't any evidence, just speculation on the repeat name of Charles/Charlie, the common Brit origin, the fact that Charlie was playing outside Widmore industries in Des' flashback, and the mystery that still surrounds Charlie's dad. It's wild (and fun) speculation that would give Charlie a cool link to Desmond and the mythology.

A couple of us speculated that Charlie IS Charles Widmore (in a time loop scenario). And I wondered if that might be why Charlie called Des a coward, on the beach.

If Charlie is Widmore's son, that might explain why Charlie called Des a coward in FBYE. Maybe off-Island, Widmore ranted to Charlie about Des being unsuitable for marrying Penny (or more likely, Charlie heard about it from Penny). And maybe Charlie was somewhat disowned (being a musician and all that, and then later, a junkie), so maybe Charlie never met Des in person, until the busking scene.

Now that would be kinda cool. :cool:

And it would be ironic...being that Claire walked up to Des on the beach, and asked "who is she?" about the Despenny. And a few moments, later, Charlie walked up with Aaron, jealous about Des. He might not even know that Des is Penny's B/F.

Although Charlie could possibly be related to the Widmores, there hasn't been any possible evidence of it, at least not in this thread. Where did the idea come from? At least there is a little evidence to suggest that Jack and Claire are half-siblings. As far as Charlie goes though, I haven't heard anything at all to suggest this. Am I missing something, or is this some kind of wishful thinking?:confused:

No evidence -- just what pj said. I just like it because it deepens the mythology, and gives Charlie a solid link to the island. Until now we haven't seen much of a historical reason for Charlie to have been hand-picked. It also gives his story more centrality and substance (and gives us some reassurance that he'll stick around). I think that the island was built (or adapted) by Widmore and Mr. Paik, and this gives Charlie a more resonant connection to the power souce. It also brings Penny into the fold a bit more, and she's such a great character.

Pacejunkie, or anyone else who may know this, a random unrelated question: do you know the sequence or progression of Charlie's finger tape words? I know it went from FATE to LATE, but then I can't remember. I can't seem to figure out a good way to search for the answer. Thanks.

I've always found very strange that they would give a character like Widmore the same first name as one of the original losties. He may not be Widmore's son (it'd be cool if he was Penny's half-brother :D) but he may have been named after Widmore... maybe he did something nice for the Pace family and they decided to name their son after him.

Pacejunkie, or anyone else who may know this, a random unrelated question: do you know the sequence or progression of Charlie's finger tape words? I know it went from FATE to LATE, but then I can't remember. I can't seem to figure out a good way to search for the answer. Thanks. It stayed LATE. After that it was the 'tape trail' in ATCHDI. Only the E was left on Charlie's finger when they found him hanging.

Oh okay, thanks. I didn't even think about the first names :) and names are important on this show obviously. I do hope that Charlie is somewhat central to what's going on in the mythology; I like the character, and a connection with Penny would be interesting. I'll keep an eye out for clues;)

wow this is so interesting...I've never heard this theory before!
I was under the impression that the psychic was Charlie's dad.
Now I know he was a butcher when Charlie was young but then
when he left he may have become a psychic and remarried.
What points me to this is that they have the same accent.the house
Charlie grew up in has the same wallpaper as the psychics house.
http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?album=902&pos=8
http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?album=66&pos=3
http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?album=66&pos=1
http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?album=902&pos=7
you just have to double click on it to enlarge the image.

NO I do not think that Charile is Widmores son because why would MR. Widmore let his son play/sing on the street outside of HIS building, Charlies Mum said that she has to save for the Piano that he got when he was young. Isnt Charlies last name PACE why would he have a different last name than WIDMORE. Just because its Charles Widmore and Charlie Pace doesnt mean anything

I like the overall theory - there definitely is a theme of being raised by non-biological parents and there must be some connection because the creators/writers have mentioned several times that all names mean something on this show. I suspect that in the end, we will discover that many of our parental figures will have a common bond with one of the major companies: dharma/widmore/hanso.

I couldn't help but think of two things about the way Mr. Widmore reacted to Desmond, he was so ugly and angry that it hinted at fear - like Desmond marrying Penny directly reflected on his insecurities...so what are they...it didn't soley seem like money to me - it seemed much more like a character flaw...or is there just more of their story to learn and there is some incident that colors his hatred of Desmond.

If it turned out to be true that Charlie and Mr. Widmore are somehow related/connected, I don't understand why some folks are getting so angry in their disagreement of this possibility - it is not at all uncommon for a wealthy man to get a "poor" woman pregnant and then ignore/disclaim the affair and leave all the obligations of the offspring to the mother - happens every day in all monetary walks of life for that matter. It is also possible that Mr. Widmore doesn't know Charlie is his son (if he is) either because Charlies Mom didn't tell him for some reason or perhaps via the dharma initiative and their fertility goals something secret was done.

We also don't know what Charlie's mom's background is, maybe she is a Widmore - perhaps the sister of Penny's dad who did marry for love instead of money and she was cut out of the family or maybe it is an "inventing the abbots" kind of a thing...and she just wanted her Charlie to be a successful as Mr. Widmore so she gave him his name...either way, I do think we were meant to start connecting Charlie and Mr. Widmore - I think whether Desmond, Charlie or Mr. Widmore realize it yet, there is a reason they were all there at the same time.

I agree. I don't see anything wrong with theorizing in this direction and I don't get why some people are so adamantly against it. If Charlie's butcher dad was a terrible person, it would be a good thing for Charlie to find out the man wasn't his father. It would be the reverse of Kate's story, where she idolized the man she thought was her father and then found out it was Wayne. Maybe Charlie discovers the truth as an adult and then goes off to London to find his real dad. (Althought Widmore's not a great guy either unfortunately).

I like the theory, even though there's not too much evidence. I never really liked the Claire being Jack's half-sister thing anyway because what would the point be, really? Just to show another connection on the island? At least Charlie being Widmore's son would help push the Desmond/ Penny storyline forward a bit or at least add another dimension to it.

Well, you know if Widmore IS one of the people behind the Dharma project and the flight 815 crash then it wouldn't surprise me if he had organised for Charlie to end up on the island. Considering Widmores standards I am sure that if he discovered he had a washed up heroin-addicted bassist for a son he would want rid of him the same way that he wanted rid of Desmond.

If Charlie is his son, of course...

A couple of us speculated that Charlie IS Charles Widmore (in a time loop scenario). And I wondered if that might be why Charlie called Des a coward, on the beach.

If Charlie is Widmore's son, that might explain why Charlie called Des a coward in FBYE. Maybe off-Island, Widmore ranted to Charlie about Des being unsuitable for marrying Penny (or more likely, Charlie heard about it from Penny). And maybe Charlie was somewhat disowned (being a musician and all that, and then later, a junkie), so maybe Charlie never met Des in person, until the busking scene.

Now that would be kinda cool. :cool:

And it would be ironic...being that Claire walked up to Des on the beach, and asked "who is she?" about the Despenny. And a few moments, later, Charlie walked up with Aaron, jealous about Des. He might not even know that Des is Penny's B/F.


Good Thinking. I no longer think time loop though. As much as it makes sense though and not.