So folks now we finally know how Jack got his tatoo and we can speculate how it exactly ties into the mythology.

1) When they lifted up Jack's sleeve was it just the chinese characters that were there? What about the number 5 and the rest of the design?

2) Is the tattoo tied into the mythology simply because it commented and predicted he would be a leader and stand amongst those he does not belong with.

3) Will we see that woman again? did she meet Jack by coincidence,? what exactly is her gift?

4) We know what the tattoo says, what does it mean?

1) yeah it was just the characters

2)I guess so, and everyone wanted to know what it meant even though apparently the real life meaning is different

3) She seemed to have some sort of perceptive ability not unlike desmonds future thingy but more of a soul gazing ability

4)I thought it meant that he was a leader, a great man, but hes lonely frightened and angry...or rather it means jack.

well...personally i had hoped she was gonna "mark" juliet. the whole episode would've been worth it if she had shown up at the very end. we definately havent seen the last of her since

bai ling has already said she's done 3 episodes

i guess we already knew what the 5 meant, since he told the story to kate at the beginning of the series. so they didnt really need to show him getting it.

Hey everyone don't read this thread until you've watched the episode tonight or you risk being spoiled!

So folks now we finally know how Jack got his tatoo and we can speculate how it exactly ties into the mythology.

1) When they lifted up Jack's sleeve was it just the chinese characters that were there? What about the number 5 and the rest of the design?

That's what I want to know...

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.

Which is why Isabel quoted it. . .Jack's among the Others, but he's not one of them.



But Jack says: "That's what it says. That's not what it means."

I think that means that Jack prefers to believe that what Achara WANTED to say with it was what she SAID he was: a great, lonely leader.

Thoughts on this, folks?

A lot of people think it would be cool to get chinese characters tattooed on them, and sometimes they get messed with. The tattoo artist will be laughing as they show off their new tattoo to their friends, but it really says "idiot" or "child molester" or something. I was wondering if that happened to Jack. "that's what it says, but not what it means" so did it really say "great man" and all that, or did it say "he walks among us but he is not one of us"?

Now, I just want to clear this up for my sake, but I just want to understand this completely.

Jack got the tattoo, pretty much against "bai lings" wishes. Was this because she was not supposed to mark anyone out of her culture? And how did those other guys find out he even had the tattoo? Seems to me that he has a sleeve covering it.

The tattoo seems to get a response out of anyone who reads it and understands it....Getting his butt kicked seemed to be a rather harsh response....don't you think? Couldn't a simple "leave and never come back" have sufficed?

Thoughts?

Yes I do wonder if Achara changed the message on the tattoo because of some the consequences of putting the message that she told Jack - that he was a great lonely leader. She might have been making fun of him, but perhaps she was protecting him, perhaps if she marked him as a great leader Jack would be in grave danger.

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.

No, it can't be that simple. They knew Jack wasn't one of them -- it's really obvious. There's something more about that tattoo, and not just what it says. I don't know what, but I'm guessing that "That's now what it means" means that it's more important than just the words or even any latent meaning you could put to them.

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.

Which is why Isabel quoted it. . .Jack's among the Others, but he's not one of them.



But Jack says: "That's what it says. That's not what it means."

I think that means that Jack prefers to believe that what Achara WANTED to say with it was what she SAID he was: a great, lonely leader.

Thoughts on this, folks?

Well, I completely agree. Literally, Isabel was right, but Jack knows the tattoos' real meaning..........that he is a great, lonely leader. Face it, it's lonely at the top. Jack is expected to lead in every way possible because he's a doctor, even though he isn't necessarily emotionally suited for it at all times (remember Claire had to lead the memorial service in season 1 because Jack couldn't handle it.......)

I really hope that Claire is Jack's sister - then he won't be so lonely anymore

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.

Which is why Isabel quoted it. . .Jack's among the Others, but he's not one of them.
Wondering if we're looking at this quote wrong...

Is it possible that:

He walks among us (us being the Losties), but is not one of us (meaning Jack would be an Other... ETA -from a different faction perhaps.... a leader... not who he seems...

"He walks among us, but is not one of us." - Ironic? Because he is one of them..maybe he is JACOB ( not being sarcastic )

I think beating up Jack was more to prove a point to Achara than anything with Jack. Though I'm sure they were offended by him being an American and getting the tatoo.

I think beating up Jack was more to prove a point to Achara than anything with Jack. Though I'm sure they were offended by him being an American and getting the tatoo.

The thing that got me thinking it meant more then that was their reaction of pure hatred and anger, her fear of putting it on him (it seemed more then a "it's against my religion" type excuse) and THEN the weird reaction the "sherif" (sorry her name slips my mind right now) gave him. She acted as if he really didn't know what it meant, like it was a joke someone played on him. Even to the point of telling him at the end, to see if he knew that's what it really said....am I making sense? :p

So Jack gets another two flashbacks this season, which will culminate with the completion of his tattoo?

Wondering if we're looking at this quote wrong...

Is it possible that:

He walks among us (us being the Losties), but is not one of us (meaning Jack would be an Other... ETA -from a different faction perhaps.... a leader... not who he seems...

Achara referred to Jack specifically as a "great man," which is what Ben said of HIM/HE in Season 2.

Well, I completely agree. Literally, Isabel was right, but Jack knows the tattoos' real meaning..........that he is a great, lonely leader. Face it, it's lonely at the top. Jack is expected to lead in every way possible because he's a doctor, even though he isn't necessarily emotionally suited for it at all times (remember Claire had to lead the memorial service in season 1 because Jack couldn't handle it.......)

I really hope that Claire is Jack's sister - then he won't be so lonely anymore

Didn't we already know that from season 2?

The thing that got me thinking it meant more then that was their reaction of pure hatred and anger, her fear of putting it on him (it seemed more then a "it's against my religion" type excuse) and THEN the weird reaction the "sherif" (sorry her name slips my mind right now) gave him. She acted as if he really didn't know what it meant, like it was a joke someone played on him. Even to the point of telling him at the end, to see if he knew that's what it really said....am I making sense? :p


I think he was duped also. I guess Jack was just saying that he knew what it really should say, because she told him, even though it doesn't really read that way.

I think he was duped also. I guess Jack was just saying that he knew what it really should say, because she told him, even though it doesn't really read that way.

I think it does read that way -- the tattoos seem to be complicated and have subtext that might be lost in translation to an outsider, and I think that's what Isabel was getting at. She didn't give him credit for actually getting close enough to the inside of the Thai culture to be told what the tattoo really meant. She didn't give him enough credit, and he kind of had the last word and surprised her at the end.

What was the deal with all the guys attacking Jack on the beach? I got the impression that it was like a retaliatory strike against just another Western Imperialist, Jack, out to steal the indigenous mojo/magic of the Thailand people.

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.

Which is why Isabel quoted it. . .Jack's among the Others, but he's not one of them.



But Jack says: "That's what it says. That's not what it means."

I think that means that Jack prefers to believe that what Achara WANTED to say with it was what she SAID he was: a great, lonely leader.

Thoughts on this, folks?

I think you are right. Jack would maybe say it means that he is a great leader seperated (for better or worse) from those he leads by his nature.

I don't understand why the tattoo she did was in Chinese and she's Thai and they are in Thailand. It doesn't make much sense.

(I understand that Matthew Fox already had the tattoo and they fit the story around it)

"that's what it says, but not what it means" so did it really say "great man" and all that, or did it say "he walks among us but he is not one of us"?


It all depends on how you look at it. If Jack is a "great man" as she says, then by definition, he wouldn't be "one of us" in that he stands above others. It's a semantical puzzle; a Confucian fortune cookie. You can take it at face value, or you can read deeper.

I've always heard that tattoos are supposed to have meaning for the person wearing it. In this case, the meaning is very clear to Jack. To others--not so much.

Well according to someone from the Thai culture, the tattoo itself (Matthew Fox's tattoo) actually says Eagle soaring the high sky So my question is did the writer's make up this other meaning here, these other words to fit the show and the storyline because to me the actual meaning would still be along the same lines. Eagles are special, they fly above (which would indicate a leader). Among us but not one of us, Eagles would be of that a sort...a majestic bird above all others but not belonging. If I'm making any sense here? If someone knows what I mean I'm sure you'll put it in better words than I.

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

Hmm.. I posted in the West Coast thread but guess nothings going on there. Anyways I initially said that the "cage, jack, & cindy" scene reminded me of the book I Am Legend, where the main character Robert (who is apparently the last person on earth due to vampirism germ) is captured by a special 'evolving' race of vampires. He is in a cage and the vampires are all outside of his cell before his execution, all of them in awe of him because he was special instead of vice versa. They feared him. He was a rare being, he was legend. Anyways, hard to explain without delving into the background of the book, but it was like the exact scene in the book.

And then the ending of the episode when we found out his tattoo says "He walks among us, but he is not one of us". Which is like the book. Robert can walk among the vampires during the day, while they are all hiding/sleeping/incapacitated and kill them. Not sure where I'm going with this, but it just tied into the book. We all knew Jack was special, now just how special...

I think Achara's initial evaluation of Jack was correct: Jack is a great, lonely leader. Whether that made it into the tattoo is unknown. I also think that Isabel's interpretation of the text is correct: Jack is in fact walking amongst a group of people, although he isn't one of them. Clearly, the fact that Achara tattooed Jack was an issue for the locals (including her brother). Once her brother lifted Jack's shirt and read the text he went bonkers. Whether it was the message or the act is anyone's guess. IMO, Achara's gift is very exclusive, and Jack didn't fit the profile.

I'm going to step in and say that I agree with those who suggest that Jack could in fact be Jacob. The Jack in the present doesn't realize it, but the Jack in an alternate reality (set in motion by Desmond's turning of the failsafe key) does. Jack is in fact Jacob, the great, lonely leader who as an outsider comes to lead the Others. That will be the character bomb revealed later this season.

Okay, I have no idea what Jack's tattoo actually reads, but the scene in this episode where the "Sheriff" actually reads the tattoo...

It's a poor reading in Chinese (Cantonese) and she's actually saying "He walks among us, but is not one of us."

There's no mention of eagles or what not. This is weird to me, because if someone can read Chinese, they usually translate it word for word, not interpret it to mean something else. Unless, she's one of those scholarly types.

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."

I immediately thought it was a biblical thing - like speaking of some greater being who lives among men but is a God.

I'm going to step in and say that I agree with those who suggest that Jack could in fact be Jacob. The Jack in the present doesn't realize it, but the Jack in an alternate reality (set in motion by Desmond's turning of the failsafe key) does. Jack is in fact Jacob, the great, lonely leader who as an outsider comes to lead the Others. That will be the character bomb revealed later this season.

Brilliant! I totally agree with you. I think this is where they're going with Jack's storyline. It's clear he is a leader since even Ben follows him.

well...personally i had hoped she was gonna "mark" juliet. the whole episode would've been worth it if she had shown up at the very end. we definately havent seen the last of her since

i guess we already knew what the 5 meant, since he told the story to kate at the beginning of the series. so they didnt really need to show him getting it.

Oh yes the counting to 5, for some reason I thought that wasn't the meaning but I guess it could be. and yes, just the way this FB was structured it seems like Achara will make another appearance since they left her story basically untold.

So Jack gets another two flashbacks this season, which will culminate with the completion of his tattoo?

Lol, it's the master plan you know! :biggrin:

Achara referred to Jack specifically as a "great man," which is what Ben said of HIM/HE in Season 2.

This is an interesting connection I wonder if in fact it will prove to be the cause, otherwise why stress that Jack is a leader at this moment in time. Who else is he going to lead? Only thing is if Jack is Him, why are they treating him so badly, even the sheriff is laughing at him.

The thing that got me thinking it meant more then that was their reaction of pure hatred and anger, her fear of putting it on him (it seemed more then a "it's against my religion" type excuse) and THEN the weird reaction the "sherif" (sorry her name slips my mind right now) gave him. She acted as if he really didn't know what it meant, like it was a joke someone played on him. Even to the point of telling him at the end, to see if he knew that's what it really said....am I making sense? :p

I wonder how the sheriff knows chinese, is there some sort of connection we will eventually learn about.

I think it does read that way -- the tattoos seem to be complicated and have subtext that might be lost in translation to an outsider, and I think that's what Isabel was getting at. She didn't give him credit for actually getting close enough to the inside of the Thai culture to be told what the tattoo really meant. She didn't give him enough credit, and he kind of had the last word and surprised her at the end.

This leads me to wonder whether the others knew Jack was in thailand, why would she underestimate his knowledge of thai culture if he spent a month there and had an intimate relationship with a local.

What was the deal with all the guys attacking Jack on the beach? I got the impression that it was like a retaliatory strike against just another Western Imperialist, Jack, out to steal the indigenous mojo/magic of the Thailand people.

This was my first impression as well, though they didn't seem to care that he lived on the beach for a month and was dating one the guys sisters. If they were protective of the magic of the island so to speak, why let Jack hang around the Achara at all, since she is special. They only freaked out when she gave him a tattoo of chinese characters. That doesn't completely fit in with getting rid of a foreigner. There just seems as if there's more to it.

I don't understand why the tattoo she did was in Chinese and she's Thai and they are in Thailand. It doesn't make much sense.

(I understand that Matthew Fox already had the tattoo and they fit the story around it)

I'm not sure is it common practice for people in thailand to give tattoss of chinese characters. Is Achara supposed to be Thai, or is she of Chinese descent?

I'm going to step in and say that I agree with those who suggest that Jack could in fact be Jacob. The Jack in the present doesn't realize it, but the Jack in an alternate reality (set in motion by Desmond's turning of the failsafe key) does. Jack is in fact Jacob, the great, lonely leader who as an outsider comes to lead the Others. That will be the character bomb revealed later this season.

Yes, I was just discussing this theory tonight with my wife. We came to the conclusion that Jack is going to be integrated into the Others community, and will assume some role of leadership. What that role will be we didn't really talk about, but I like this idea of Jack being Jacob...

This makes me think that Jack is different in the sense that Walt is different. Achara can see who people really are? She seemed frightened looking at who Jack was. I think the leader lines are misleading. There's something special, or different, (seemingly bad) about Jack that we don't yet know. He walks among us, but he is not one of us. It cannot just be that he's not Thai or whatever. It just makes me want to think that there's something almost supernatural about Jack. That's just my opinion.

This makes me think that Jack is different in the sense that Walt is different. Achara can see who people really are? She seemed frightened looking at who Jack was. I think the leader lines are misleading. There's something special, or different, (seemingly bad) about Jack that we don't yet know. He walks among us, but he is not one of us. It cannot just be that he's not Thai or whatever. It just makes me want to think that there's something almost supernatural about Jack. That's just my opinion.

It's possible Achara's evaluation of Jack indicated something disturbing about his character traits, which could SOMEDAY manifest itself in a negative way. Jack in the past and present is basically a good guy, but in the future, he is destined to lead in a way that could appear to be somewhat unsavory (forecasting a role with the Others?).

Yes, he walks among them, but he is not one of them. He is a great man, who walks among them, but isn't like them in the sense that he's different, a leader.

Is it just me, or when they showed Jack getting beaten up by Achara's brother and crew, did he not seem to have only the characters, and now he has a much bigger tattoo?

Also - the coincidence between Juliet getting "marked" and Jack getting "marked" and then both being rejected by communities ... a little too obvious if you ask me, and fellow Lost devotees know there's usually more than what's on the surface as far as parallels go...

"He walks among us, but is not one of us."Which is why Achara's brother and his thugs beat him. . .he wasn't one of them.Which is why Isabel quoted it. . .Jack's among the Others, but he's not one of them.But Jack says: "That's what it says. That's not what it means."I think that means that Jack prefers to believe that what Achara WANTED to say with it was what she SAID he was: a great, lonely leader.Thoughts on this, folks?

I agree. I also think the "5" that is on his arm stands for "the five seconds of fear": from Jack and Kate's original conversation.
And, as of this ep, it is green.
I also think that he and Juliet are in this club now, for 'marked physicians'. I also think Juliet's mark looks like a cannibus leaf, in stick people art.
100%
I don't understand why the tattoo she did was in Chinese and she's Thai and they are in Thailand. It doesn't make much sense.

(I understand that Matthew Fox already had the tattoo and they fit the story around it)

There are alot of Chinese, as well as just about every other nationality of S.E. Asian in Phuket. It is a touristy spot, and a lot of hopefull business venturers end up there. There are alot of island nations in that little area, so there's alot of melting of cultures. Most Asians speak and write more than one language. The child 'hawker' on the beach had a shirt on with 'Ohm' in sanskrit, and a dharma insignia shape on is as well.

The other thing that's strange about Achara, if she didn't want jack to know anything, she could have just said that she's a tattoo artist, she didn't have to reveal anything about seeing into people. And if Jack wanted a tattoo, she could have just given him a heart or flower or dragon or even fake chinese characters. She never had to actually tell him the truth or give him the tattoo. jack wouldn't know the difference. Also, how did those guys know Jack had the tattoo, did she tell them afterwards, why would they suspect anything?

Jack may have gotten the other tattoos upon his return to L.A. (just before leaving for Australia), because he wanted to "drown out" Achara's markings by making them look like just part of a bigger work of art.

But she had "marked" him, and "marked" is different than "art." Given LOST's themes, I'd say that when he was "marked," he'd sealed his destiny, and there was nothing he could do about that. It's kind of the same "revelation" Desmond got from his visit to the past/the old woman. Actually, in time, I suspect we're gonna be able to draw a lot of parallels between these two men--who, IMHO, are at the core of the overall LOST story!

I posted this in the kite thread about how I think they gave a nod to the actual meaning of Matthew Fox's (not Jack's) tattoo.

About the kite scene (the OP wasn't sure if it was a bird or a moth):
It looked like a bird, to me.

I think that the kite scene was a nod to Matthew Fox's actual tattoos. The characters supposedly translate to "eagle soars high in the sky" (paraphrasing).

So it was a way of acknowledging the actual meaning of the actor's tattoos, since in the epi, the translation was (paraphrasing) "he walks among us, but is not one of us". And Jack actually said "that's what they say, but that's not what they mean".

A little LOST inside joke.;) And perhaps yet another hint that everything is not what it seems, and perhaps even deception (we're not seeing what's really happening).

So maybe the symbolism of the scene was that Achara would go on to mark Jack with the tattoo, leading to him actually becoming a leader (and soaring, being free, like the kite they flew).

Just a thought.....Achara has a "gift" which allows her to see who people are. Well maybe she saw Jack's future and by marking him, the Others would have a visual way of knowing he has been "warned". She mentioned "her people". Why assume she meant culturally? After "Not in Portland" we know that certain people were sought after in the outside world...aka..Juliet.
OR...The Others are already after Achara because of her gift of clairvoyance. She doesn't want her markings on an American b/c she is in Thailand hiding from them.

Just a thought.....Achara has a "gift" which allows her to see who people are. Well maybe she saw Jack's future and by marking him, the Others would have a visual way of knowing he has been "warned". She mentioned "her people". Why assume she meant culturally? After "Not in Portland" we know that certain people were sought after in the outside world...aka..Juliet.
OR...The Others are already after Achara because of her gift of clairvoyance. She doesn't want her markings on an American b/c she is in Thailand hiding from them.

I like this idea, it fits in with Lost's tendencies to catch us off guard, we are led to vaguely believe that Achara is hesitant for some sort of cultural reason related to Thailand, but maybe it does have something to do with the others. Just as Sawyer wanted to get rid of Karl because he thought the boy was a target for the others, maybe the people on the island now thought that Jack was also a target of sorts and that is why they wanted him to leave the island.

I posted this in the kite thread about how I think they gave a nod to the actual meaning of Matthew Fox's (not Jack's) tattoo.

About the kite scene (the OP wasn't sure if it was a bird or a moth):


So maybe the symbolism of the scene was that Achara would go on to mark Jack with the tattoo, leading to him actually becoming a leader (and soaring, being free, like the kite they flew).

That's interesting Tabby, we'll have to get a better look at that kite. That scene really stuck out for me and came across as a forced way for the two of them to meet, but having the kite represent the actual meaning of MF tattoo is interesting.

Jack may have gotten the other tattoos upon his return to L.A. (just before leaving for Australia), because he wanted to "drown out" Achara's markings by making them look like just part of a bigger work of art.

Maybe, but then jack could have had the tatto surgically removed or just covered up the whole sections, instead of leaving the characters visible. hmmm

But she had "marked" him, and "marked" is different than "art." Given LOST's themes, I'd say that when he was "marked," he'd sealed his destiny, and there was nothing he could do about that. It's kind of the same "revelation" Desmond got from his visit to the past/the old woman. Actually, in time, I suspect we're gonna be able to draw a lot of parallels between these two men--who, IMHO, are at the core of the overall LOST story!

So would things have been different if Jack didn't get the tattoo?

Ok, maybe I missed something, but Jack got his tattoo in Thailand, right? But when the lady was reading the tattoo when Jack was in the cage, she mentioned that it was written in Chinese. Ummm..... I thought they spoke thai in Thailand. Why would it be in Chinese? Like I said, maybe I missed something. If I did, please explain!

You're right! I didn't make that connection during the show. But you're absolutely right.

For what it's worth, the actress who played her, Bai Ling, is Chinese so maybe she was supposed to be a Chinese woman living in Thailand or something like that?

Yes, I noticed that too. I'm sure it wasn't an oversight. The only thing I can think of is the fact that chinese characters are very common in tattooing.

She also was tattooing in some form of traditional manner, not using a modern day electric tattoo gun.

In Thailand, as well as other places like Taiwan, Chinese characters and words are very common in their language.

I was in Thailand last summer visiting a girl I dated (oddly enough it was in Phuket) and no one their spoke Chinese.
Thai and English was all I heard.
Bai Ling is Chinese... I don't know

yeh that is a good catch but you can get a Chinese tatto in Wisconsin so why not Thailand. Besides the "Though he walks among us..." qoute might be some sort of ancient Chinese standard so she tattooed Jack accordingly. Still, that is quite observant.

while some chinese characters may be similar with those of Thai, from what I know, there are different dialects of chinese that are completely different than that of other dialects, meaning that even though the letters are the same they would mean completely different things. Would this be similar to teaching a chinese person english in mainland china for 5 years and then dropping them off in Compton, CA? They wouldn't know what the heck people were saying. Bust a cap? get your swerve on? Slang like that.

That was irritating me during the show, too. That HAD to be intentional, for some reason or another. They specifically mentioned that he was in Phucket, and clearly said "Chinese". I doubt that nobody would notice that in production. It would be like going to Spain and getting a tattoo in Italian. There has to be more to the story.

That was irritating me during the show, too. That HAD to be intentional, for some reason or another. They specifically mentioned that he was in klucket, and clearly said "Chinese". I doubt that nobody would notice that in production. It would be like going to Spain and getting a tattoo in Italian. There has to be more to the story.

Klucket???

You mean Phuket right?

It's possible Achara's evaluation of Jack indicated something disturbing about his character traits, which could SOMEDAY manifest itself in a negative way. Jack in the past and present is basically a good guy, but in the future, he is destined to lead in a way that could appear to be somewhat unsavory (forecasting a role with the Others?).

Yea I agree with you on this one. I think her reaction was quite odd. It's like those silly scenes where a character goes to a fortune teller, and then the fortune teller freaks out and refuses to tell the character what she sees because it's something really dark or negative?

I got that impression when she was "seeing" him. Like she didn't want to look, and that is why she didn't want to know anything about him, his past etc etc. She was drawn to him, but was afraid of him as well.

I think she knew more then she was saying.

Chinese script is made up of characters that represent a complete word. It is used for most of the languages of China (Mandarain, Cantonese, Wu, etc) as well as Japanese.
If one recognizes the pictogram for "eagle" for example, one would understand the concept in any language, Cantonese, Thai or English.

In some cultures, when a person gets a tattoo, the person takes on the characteristics and traits of the image. A tattoo of a tiger gives the person strength, power, and prowess. A tattoo of a crane gives the person grace and elegance. The power comes from the person giving the tattoo and the person getting it ... and there are consequences.

Once Jack got his, everyone around him was "aware." This is why the coke-kid turned and ran away and why the thugs came after him.

Jack has “merged” with his tattoo. He has become the person that is with the group but is not part of the group. He is the lonely leader with leadership thrust on him.

Did Jack get the five and other designs tattooed to diguise the Chinese writing???

I say this because of what Isabelle (shudder:fear3:) said about it, something along the lines of "The 5 and stuff are cute, but the Chinese is what I'm interested in..."

If so, has Jack had to hide his tattoo from other people?
And what about the one on his forearm? Probably not as important but...

All the tattoos belong to Matthew Fox, so I am sure they'll come up with an explanation at some point, but it would probably be weird to incorporate the 5 tattoo in with the asian writing considering the circumstance.

Yes I'm sure it might have something to do with The Story He Told Kate...but did Isabelle know he was trying to hide the Chinese??

But Thailand isn't in China (or Japan). So how is the thai language one of the languages of China? Sorry, I'm still confused.

Wait, what do you mean trying to hide it? The 5 part of the tattoo is above the one he got in Thailand, right? It didn't look like a cover up to me, just an additional tattoo. If he was trying to hide it with a new tattoo, you wouldn't even see the old one, they go right over top of the old tattoo, not above it.

Did Jack get the five and other designs tattooed to diguise the Chinese writing???

I say this because of what Isabelle (shudder:fear3:) said about it, something along the lines of "The 5 and stuff are cute, but the Chinese is what I'm interested in..."

If so, has Jack had to hide his tattoo from other people?
And what about the one on his forearm? Probably not as important but...

Isabel mentioned the stars with the five, when she said that line. "The five and the stars are cute...*continues*" So I take it that the stars will be done the same time as the 5 and triangle.

I wonder if we will see another FB where we see why he gets these done...I was really surprised he didn't get them all done in that one, as it was his tattoo FB.

Did Jack get the five and other designs tattooed to diguise the Chinese writing???

I say this because of what Isabelle (shudder:fear3:) said about it, something along the lines of "The 5 and stuff are cute, but the Chinese is what I'm interested in..."

If so, has Jack had to hide his tattoo from other people?
And what about the one on his forearm? Probably not as important but...

Well, one thing we've learned about the Others in this ep (courtesy of Karl) is that they don't have cable TV, and clearly Isabel hasn't seen Party of 5. ;)

I heard "stars" as well -- is it too much of a stretch to think that the reason the five and the stars were deemed "cute" was that they were some sort of play on "Five Star General" (since the Thai Tat pronounced him a leader)?

I always kind of thought that the five had something to do with how he copes with things and his counting to five, something to remind him of how to deal with things when the time comes maybe, but the stars...well I didn't even notice them there untill half way through the second season. :hide: But I'm not really sure what to think of those...maybe he just thought they looked good. They do. lol.

I didnt see anyone else post about this so I thought I would. In the beginning of the episode the "Sheriff" lady (I forget her name) said that the "Chinese" was Ironic. Jack, however, was in Phuket which is in thailand. So why would he have gotten a chinsese tatoo in Thailand? Is this just ignorance of TPTB or am I missing something?

chinese speakers are pretty prevalent in phuket, were many chinese immigrants settled, so i don't think it's that odd.

Thank you I didnt know the culture of phuket

During the Chinese diaspora many immigrants settled all over SE Asia, but as is usually the case with immigrants they are concentrated in urban areas. Phuket is not very urban. I couldn't find any info easily about the ethnic makeup of Phuket provence, so I don't know for sure how many Chinese are there.... anyways this argument isn't really necesary because "Achera" is not a Chinese name.

I think this is just a case of cultural flattening..... But maybe the writers do have a secret explaination fhat we'll learn later on?? could be...

it's also interesting to note that Jack's tatoo does not really say "he walks among us but he is not one of us" but actually says something like "the bird flies"

I did notice 5 guys beat him up. He certainly looked like he could have been seeing stars (and birds) when he was laying on the beach! ;)