Why did you vote for who you did?

How can I vote?! Based on how things are AT THIS POINT:

The losties think it's Jack. (I'm REAL suspicious that they're wrong, now.)

The one best suited for leadership ATP is Sayid. (Ex-soldier/torturer as War Leader.)

The one who may actually be pulling the strings is Hurley. (We saw this in action tonight; they call it "power behind the throne" for a REASON.)

Kate, James, and Jin are excellent lieutenants. Locke's a "temporary" turncoat.

So voting in this poll, with the entire storyline in flux, just ain't something I can do.

I voted for Jack, because everyone appointed him the role early on, and no one has ever really challenged him for the title and won. Locke could have taken over when Jack was a captive of the Others (in fact, he seemed to for a little while), but it doesn't look like he ever really wanted to lead them. He's too busy with his own personal agenda, which gets others killed. That's not really a sign of a good leader.

Sayid would probably get my vote after Jack. Although since Shannon died he hasn't really been in the right frame of mind. Not that I blame him, of course.

My money is always on Jack.

I vote for Hurley - he seems to know everyone - he knows more about what is going on and he seems to get along with everyone better than most -

He is a likable Leader and he doesn't micro manage therefore it seems as though others are in charge rather than him -

He gets games going and food spread around - without him there would be no fun at all!

What, no Vincent?

I voted Sayid because I think hes most suited for the job. He's logical, and he listens. Kate's a good sidekick, like someone said. Sayid is a good sidekick too, but he can lead when he wants to.

Definitely Jack. He genuinely cares about everyone on the island and tries to do the best he can for all of them. Everyone else has their own little agendas, I feel like, but Jack's has always been to do whatever he can to help everyone out. He's not perfect, but no one is, and he is definitely selfless and means well.

And besides TPTB named him Shephard for a reason. Being the leader is his role on the show.

I always vote for Sun, regardless of the survey. ;)

What, no Vincent?

Dang! Sorry. I forgot to add his name to the list. I also left out Rose and Bernard, but I left them out on purpose, since I really didn't think anyone would seriously vote for them...

Just so you know, Vincent is my favorite character. Just look at my avatar pic...

I voted for Hurley because no matter who is the " leader" at the time Hurley is the one getting things done.

I'm a little undecided right now. :shrug:
I think it's between Jack and Sayid.

Jack was ready to abandon the group, but I think will re-commit himself to the cause now that he was left behind.
Sayid has always been loyal to the cause, trustworthy, always on the move, alert and focused.
While Hugo has some newfound assertiveness, I really don't see him as a leader in the face of serious adversity, but he's stepped it up and has a new sense of self-confidence that I find refreshing.

Hurley, since the start. Who initiated the census and figured out Ethan was a fraud?
Who's always had his finger on the pulse of the camp?
Who did the Others take, knowing our Losties would trust him?

Hurley may not be seen as the leader, but he is one and should be it.

Hurley for PRESIDENT!!!

Hurley, since the start. Who initiated the census and figured out Ethan was a fraud?
Who's always had his finger on the pulse of the camp?
Who did the Others take, knowing our Losties would trust him?

Hurley may not be seen as the leader, but he is one and should be it.

Hurley for PRESIDENT!!!

He makes it his business to know what's going on; he "appoints" Sawyer the new leader; he gets people to do things; he notices Desmond's new ability; he assesses that Claire has a lot of influence.

When you think about it, Hurley is the link between the A team and the B team. He has influence everywhere. A leader gets things done their way; they don't have to be out in front to do it.

I voted for Jack only because he has been leader since the begining. The REAL question is who would you LIKE to be the leader?There should be another poll. I would vote for Sayid hands down.

I thought it would be funny if i voted for claire.

My vote stays with Jack until I see another side of him. He still is a great leader. Looks out (cares) for everyone on the island. Sacrifices himself for the safety of others, even when they are selfish, insincere, uncaring, (like Sawyer was) and untrusting (like Ben) people. He puts others before himself.

That's why he's my favorite character. Love his caring, compassionate, strong, and warmhearted nature. :)

You left out Desmond too. Not sure if he wants to be leader, but he can fix things and he's hunting boar now. That and his superpower and he'd make a cool leader if he wanted to be.

I voted for Sayid. He's not always successful with his strategies but he's the most sensible choice for leader. I remember back in season one when he was the first one to calm everyone when the food ran out and to organize groups for different jobs. He was also the one that started the big signal fire and kept it going. I don't think Jack has proven himself to be a great leader, despite his honest desire to make everyone feel safe.

The problem is, leaders are chosen by the people. It's not really a question of who's qualified, it's a question of who the people want to follow. Right or wrong, they clearly want to follow Jack.

Jack's the leader whether he likes it (or acts like it) or not. He was somehow appointed from the beginning and that title will be very difficult for him to lose despite all he's been through. People have always and will continue to turn to Jack with their problems.

I think only Jack, Kate and Sayid are sensible enough to be be leaders. The rest of the losties are pretty much loose cannons.

It's between Sayid and Hurly, but I actually voted for Hurly, cause he looks out for the well being of everyone. Even Sawyer, he really tries to make things better for the camp individually and as a whole. And he does it in a subtle way. Deeannek said above, he get's things done, and he has a heart of gold. he may not have the official title as leader, but he is leading in his own way. But Sayid definitely has the most common sense out of the rest of them, I trust him I know if I were on the Island i would want him as the leader. I love Jack, but he's a little jaded right now to make decisions for the group. heck he hasn't even been there, not entirely his fault, but still i think you can see my point.

I voted for Sun, sort of as a joke, but then I thought about it and I have some crackpot explanation...

Jack no longer fits that role to me when he abandoned everyone for his shot to get off the island. He takes off too easily on these crazy junkets that the island's only doctor should not participate in. He's got too much pride to be a great leader, when it comes down to it.

In the beginning I was going for Sayid, with his practical organization skills (organizing groups in season 1) and military experience, but he too has lost it. He's made some terrible decisions lately and is frankly too violent and makes a much better general than civilian officer.

Locke... He's on his own trip. He's the island shaman.

Kate. She does much better on her own, she has a great role for the group (and has the group interest in mind), but it is not leader.

A good leader will stay by the camp, deligate the dangerous jobs to the military and search parties (Kate, Sayid, etc.), make good decisions, be diplomatic, keep the group's interests ahead of their own, keep everyone fed and alive and working towards their real goal of getting off the island. They don't need a cowboy, they need a WOMAN!

Sun has shown great diplomacy (not telling Jin about Sawyer, diffusing the Michael/Jin fight), she is well-liked, she is cool-headed (how about that boat-escape). The lying problem is usually related to something very practical, and sometimes that will be needed in her new role.

SUN FOR LEADER!!

I voted for Jack because the question was who I think the real leader IS.That's been Jack's role ever since he grudgingly accepted it in season 1. And the other survivors see him as their leader, and I think once he comes back he'll be pushed into that role again.
That doesn't answer any questions as to whether Jack is the best possible leader, or whether his time with the others might have damaged any objectivity or leadership quaities.
Also, it doesn't answer the question whether Sayid, Hurley or anybody else might be more appropriate as a leader. The status quo to me is that Jack is their leader, and it bears waiting to see whether his time with the others will chance that perception of his fellow survivors.

Jack, Jack, Jack and Jack again. I'm getting a bit suspicious about Sayid - I think we might learn a few things about him in the near future that will lead us to question where his loyalties lie.

It's between Sayid and Hurly, but I actually voted for Hurly, cause he looks out for the well being of everyone. Even Sawyer, he really tries to make things better for the camp individually and as a whole. And he does it in a subtle way. Deeannek said above, he get's things done, and he has a heart of gold. he may not have the official title as leader, but he is leading in his own way. But Sayid definitely has the most common sense out of the rest of them, I trust him I know if I were on the Island i would want him as the leader. I love Jack, but he's a little jaded right now to make decisions for the group. heck he hasn't even been there, not entirely his fault, but still i think you can see my point.

I voted for Hurley, too, and for the same reasons as you mention. I am beginning to have serious doubts about Jack's overall motives, what with bringing Juliet back to camp, and how he conveniently was unconscious from the gas until Kate finds him...

I had to vote Jack. There are no two ways about it. Mostly everyone looks up to him and looks to him for help. They rely on him. If it was up to me, I would choose Sayid. I trust him and think he makes a great leader.

I voted for Jack, but I think I misread the question. I interpreted it as asking who the other losties would view as the leader. That would be Jack. For the question of who is really leading the survivors, that is Hurley. Jack leads the A-Team, they get things done. However, for the majority of the surivivors, they haven't gone out on dangerous missions. Hurley is their leader. He makes sure everyone is provided for, he organizes tasks, keeps people from going rogue, makes a point of getting to know person, is the entertainment director, keeps communication flowing between losties, and most important, he is a liaison between the majority of the survivors and the A-Team. He is the real leader for most of the losties.

I voted for Jack, but I think I misread the question. I interpreted it as asking who the other losties would view as the leader. That would be Jack. For the question of who is really leading the survivors, that is Hurley. Jack leads the A-Team, they get things done. However, for the majority of the surivivors, they haven't gone out on dangerous missions. Hurley is their leader. He makes sure everyone is provided for, he organizes tasks, keeps people from going rogue, makes a point of getting to know person, is the entertainment director, keeps communication flowing between losties, and most important, he is a liaison between the majority of the survivors and the A-Team. He is the real leader for most of the losties.

This is a great answer! Excellent!

It reminds me of how many of the Native American tribes worked. In a lot of the tribal systems there was no real formal heirarchy of leadership. Rather, certain people were looked to for counsel and help and leadership for different things, depending on what was called for. For instance, if a war party was needed then there were specific leaders who were good at conducting war, and they would be the ones whose leadership would prevail during the war party. At other times there would be the need for someone to choose where to site a new camp to insure that there was fresh water, grazing pasture, firewood at hand, and other things. Those people would be leaders for the camp setup. There were all sorts of different instances when different individual leaders would come forth to influence the course of events and to direct others, depending on the circumstances. The members of the tribe listened to these different people not out of any duty but because these folks had proven themselves as capable in leadership in whatever role they might happen to be called to do.

Whites who would encounter many of these tribes had no real concept of this. Any official delegation from Washington would usually try to find someone in a tribe who could speak for his entire people, but this just was completely ridiculous in most cases, since many of these tribes had nobody who could fill that role. What usually ended up happening was that the tribe would send someone out to talk to the Whites who was good at talking, because that was how they worked: whoever was good at some particular thing was who you'd call on to do it. But the Whites mistakenly thought this person was the Big Chief of the tribe. So the Whites would come away from such a meeting thinking they had made agreements with someone who represented the entire tribe, when in reality what really took place was the fellow who had talked to the Whites would return to the tribal council and report on what had taken place, whereupon there would be a general discussion about what to make of it all. During this discussion others would naturally have more say in things, because they were good at figuring things out during council sessions. Many times the next day the person speaking for the tribe would meet with the Whites again, and would report that all the stuff the Whites had thought were agreed upon and carved in stone had been rejected by the tribe. This created a lot of misunderstandings, and led to many treaties being drawn up that were nonsensical to the Natives.

An example of this division of leadership would be the Nez Perce War. When the Nez Perce went to war they were led by their war chiefs, among whom were Looking Glass, Ollikot, and Toohoolhoolzote. Joseph was not a war chief - he was a "Peace Chief", which means that he was good at looking after the people, making sure the camp was set up in a good spot, that the sick, elderly, women and children were all taken care of, and generally looking after the well being of the camp. When the last battle with the US Army took place in Montana, all of the War Chiefs were killed. When the Army arrived at the Nez Perce camp where all the non-warriors had been staying during the battle, they looked for someone who they could blame for the whole uprising, and since Joseph was the only leader left who hadn't been wiped out, he got to take the blame for the whole thing, even though he'd been against the uprising at the start. He was sent off to spend the rest of his life away from his people in Oklahoma as a result of this misunderstanding.

So, from what you were saying, Molly, I think I would equate Jack and Locke with the War Chiefs, and Hurley with Chief Joseph. Whaddaya think? Good comparison? It would also be cool because the Survivors are sort of a tribe, yes?

This is a great answer! Excellent!

It reminds me of how many of the Native American tribes worked. In a lot of the tribal systems there was no real formal heirarchy of leadership. Rather, certain people were looked to for counsel and help and leadership for different things, depending on what was called for. For instance, if a war party was needed then there were specific leaders who were good at conducting war, and they would be the ones whose leadership would prevail during the war party. At other times there would be the need for someone to choose where to site a new camp to insure that there was fresh water, grazing pasture, firewood at hand, and other things. Those people would be leaders for the camp setup. There were all sorts of different instances when different individual leaders would come forth to influence the course of events and to direct others, depending on the circumstances. The members of the tribe listened to these different people not out of any duty but because these folks had proven themselves as capable in leadership in whatever role they might happen to be called to do.

Whites who would encounter many of these tribes had no real concept of this. Any official delegation from Washington would usually try to find someone in a tribe who could speak for his entire people, but this just was completely ridiculous in most cases, since many of these tribes had nobody who could fill that role. What usually ended up happening was that the tribe would send someone out to talk to the Whites who was good at talking, because that was how they worked: whoever was good at some particular thing was who you'd call on to do it. But the Whites mistakenly thought this person was the Big Chief of the tribe. So the Whites would come away from such a meeting thinking they had made agreements with someone who represented the entire tribe, when in reality what really took place was the fellow who had talked to the Whites would return to the tribal council and report on what had taken place, whereupon there would be a general discussion about what to make of it all. During this discussion others would naturally have more say in things, because they were good at figuring things out during council sessions. Many times the next day the person speaking for the tribe would meet with the Whites again, and would report that all the stuff the Whites had thought were agreed upon and carved in stone had been rejected by the tribe. This created a lot of misunderstandings, and led to many treaties being drawn up that were nonsensical to the Natives.

An example of this division of leadership would be the Nez Perce War. When the Nez Perce went to war they were led by their war chiefs, among whom were Looking Glass, Ollikot, and Toohoolhoolzote. Joseph was not a war chief - he was a "Peace Chief", which means that he was good at looking after the people, making sure the camp was set up in a good spot, that the sick, elderly, women and children were all taken care of, and generally looking after the well being of the camp. When the last battle with the US Army took place in Montana, all of the War Chiefs were killed. When the Army arrived at the Nez Perce camp where all the non-warriors had been staying during the battle, they looked for someone who they could blame for the whole uprising, and since Joseph was the only leader left who hadn't been wiped out, he got to take the blame for the whole thing, even though he'd been against the uprising at the start. He was sent off to spend the rest of his life away from his people in Oklahoma as a result of this misunderstanding.

So, from what you were saying, Molly, I think I would equate Jack and Locke with the War Chiefs, and Hurley with Chief Joseph. Whaddaya think? Good comparison? It would also be cool because the Survivors are sort of a tribe, yes?

I think this is an excellent comparison. I think Hurly represents the group.

hurley! he runs the camp. knows everyone and what everyone needs. which for most of the losties seems to be all that required. it seems, if the others would leave them all alone they would be happy to return the favor. lately even sawyer seems happy just sitting on the beach with a good book. i wonder if they even care half the time what kate, jack, sayid, and locke are up to.

If I was a Lostie, I would follow Hurley any day. He has a level head and seems to get things done while also keeping everyone's spirits up. I don't know who Jack is at this point. Locke has gone bye bye (to me both physically and mentally) and Sawyer does not have the abilities.

He is a leader, but it is not open and blatant. It's not like he is standing on a rock going "I'm the greatest person on this island and all you sniveling Losties would die without me!" To me, he's cool as a cucumber, dude.

If I was a Lostie, I would follow Hurley any day. He has a level head and seems to get things done while also keeping everyone's spirits up. I don't know who Jack is at this point. Locke has gone bye bye (to me both physically and mentally) and Sawyer does not have the abilities.

He is a leader, but it is not open and blatant. It's not like he is standing on a rock going "I'm the greatest person on this island and all you sniveling Losties would die without me!" To me, he's cool as a cucumber, dude.

Right on! Hurley rules! Here are some points to consider in favor of Hurley being the real leader:

* Every time that the Losties have needed a boost in morale, Hurley came through and lifted everyone's spirits.

* Why did the Others specifically request that Michael return with Hurley along with Jack, Kate and Sawyer? Because they wanted to send Hurley back with a message for the Losties. And so why Hurley? Why not Sayid or Charlie or Locke? Because even the Others recognized that Hurley would be the one person that EVERYONE would listen to and believe. How did they know this? Probably through Ben (my theory is that Ben used the time during Lockdown while Locke was pinned under the door to communicate stuff back to the Others via the computer).

* Hurley knows how to be a leader of a tribe by caring for the welfare of other people. And I feel like the Losties are a tribe at this point - as far as a sociological/anthropological reference.

* Hurley broke the spell by firing up the van and taking it for a ride. He's changing the reality of the group, and his energy is contagious as we can see in how it's influenced Charlie, Sawyer and Jin, among others.

All of these things mark him as a leader. I agree that Jack was perhaps at one time the leader in the early days, but what has he done of any real substance for the Losties in the entire Season Three? And now look at him - he probably faked being unconscious until Kate showed up, he's all chummy with some of the Others, and he's bringing Juliet back to camp with him. These things really make me question his integrity. If he was REALLY the leader of the Losties, he would not have insisted on being allowed to return to civilization, but would have insisted on returning to the camp to make sure they were taken care of.

I don't want to offend anyone who voted for Jack as the real leader, because it really is just a fun poll anyway, but I do think that a strong case can be made for Hurley being the person who really antes up when things need to be done. I definitely support Hurley as the real leader of the Losties. But that's just my humble two cents' worth of opinion...

I voted for Jin because I think he makes a better public speaker than Jack.
I get chills every time he says, "우리가 함께 살l, 우리는 혼자 죽기 위하여 가고 있다."

I think the answer to this question depends on what we're looking for in a leader.

The comparison to tribal leaders for different functions was an accurate one, in my opinion - because although Hurley is a great behind-the-scenes leader who knows the people well (the leader who can keep his people happy), if we're talking about the individual who was left at the time Hurley tried to up Sawyer into the position of leader (all other "leaders" weren't in town at the time) who could protect the group the best, or go to "war" if need be, well, that indeed was Sawyer.

I didn't vote in the poll simply because I didn't think I could pick one leader, as we don't really know what our "leader" has to do just yet.

This is a great answer! Excellent!

It reminds me of how many of the Native American tribes worked. In a lot of the tribal systems there was no real formal heirarchy of leadership. Rather, certain people were looked to for counsel and help and leadership for different things, depending on what was called for. ...........The members of the tribe listened to these different people not out of any duty but because these folks had proven themselves as capable in leadership in whatever role they might happen to be called to do.

................................. the uprising I am going to agree with a lot of this. I think different leaders are looked to for different things. I suspect many of the Lostees look at Jack as the leader but they also defer to other people depending on the situation Hurley does come across as a leader for many of the beach town activities. He also lead Sawyer into doing what needed to be done making him a behind the scenes co-leader with Sawyer. So who is in charge changes with the situation even though Jack usually carries the title. Sun or Claire could easily lead me around :biggrin: but I think in regard to the intent of this leadership question there is no firm answer.


Off topic? Saukkomies I like the Nez Pierce comparison but would not have chosen the word uprising. The Nez Pierce involved were trying to abide by the treaty they had signed giving them ownership of their traditional lands when the US government started the war by trying to force them to a reservation based on a new treaty the US had signed with a different group of indians (also Nez Pierce?). Gets to your point about the US not understanding tribal structure I guess.

Jack. Always was and always will be.

This is a great answer! Excellent!

It reminds me of how many of the Native American tribes worked. In a lot of the tribal systems there was no real formal heirarchy of leadership. Rather, certain people were looked to for counsel and help and leadership for different things, depending on what was called for. For instance, if a war party was needed then there were specific leaders who were good at conducting war, and they would be the ones whose leadership would prevail during the war party. At other times there would be the need for someone to choose where to site a new camp to insure that there was fresh water, grazing pasture, firewood at hand, and other things. Those people would be leaders for the camp setup. There were all sorts of different instances when different individual leaders would come forth to influence the course of events and to direct others, depending on the circumstances. The members of the tribe listened to these different people not out of any duty but because these folks had proven themselves as capable in leadership in whatever role they might happen to be called to do.

Whites who would encounter many of these tribes had no real concept of this. Any official delegation from Washington would usually try to find someone in a tribe who could speak for his entire people, but this just was completely ridiculous in most cases, since many of these tribes had nobody who could fill that role. What usually ended up happening was that the tribe would send someone out to talk to the Whites who was good at talking, because that was how they worked: whoever was good at some particular thing was who you'd call on to do it. But the Whites mistakenly thought this person was the Big Chief of the tribe. So the Whites would come away from such a meeting thinking they had made agreements with someone who represented the entire tribe, when in reality what really took place was the fellow who had talked to the Whites would return to the tribal council and report on what had taken place, whereupon there would be a general discussion about what to make of it all. During this discussion others would naturally have more say in things, because they were good at figuring things out during council sessions. Many times the next day the person speaking for the tribe would meet with the Whites again, and would report that all the stuff the Whites had thought were agreed upon and carved in stone had been rejected by the tribe. This created a lot of misunderstandings, and led to many treaties being drawn up that were nonsensical to the Natives.

An example of this division of leadership would be the Nez Perce War. When the Nez Perce went to war they were led by their war chiefs, among whom were Looking Glass, Ollikot, and Toohoolhoolzote. Joseph was not a war chief - he was a "Peace Chief", which means that he was good at looking after the people, making sure the camp was set up in a good spot, that the sick, elderly, women and children were all taken care of, and generally looking after the well being of the camp. When the last battle with the US Army took place in Montana, all of the War Chiefs were killed. When the Army arrived at the Nez Perce camp where all the non-warriors had been staying during the battle, they looked for someone who they could blame for the whole uprising, and since Joseph was the only leader left who hadn't been wiped out, he got to take the blame for the whole thing, even though he'd been against the uprising at the start. He was sent off to spend the rest of his life away from his people in Oklahoma as a result of this misunderstanding.

So, from what you were saying, Molly, I think I would equate Jack and Locke with the War Chiefs, and Hurley with Chief Joseph. Whaddaya think? Good comparison? It would also be cool because the Survivors are sort of a tribe, yes?

From what I remember of Chief Joseph, he said "My heart is sick with sadness, I will fight no more". He said that so a few of his people could survive the Trail of Tears.

Great comparison. The problem with the A-Team is that they are are strong-willed people with different agendas and different opinions on how things should get done. Jack made a deal with the others, Locke seems to have made a deal with the Others, who knows what is going to happen with Sayid and kate; all the while, Hurley is the one making sure everyone else is taken care of back at camp.

I really enjoyed reading your post!

Off topic? Saukkomies I like the Nez Pierce comparison but would not have chosen the word uprising. The Nez Pierce involved were trying to abide by the treaty they had signed giving them ownership of their traditional lands when the US government started the war by trying to force them to a reservation based on a new treaty the US had signed with a different group of indians (also Nez Pierce?). Gets to your point about the US not understanding tribal structure I guess.

Yes, I completely agree with you Fogey. "Uprising" is not a good word for it, and I suppose the reason I used it was out of a sense of trying to gauge my audience, but I should know better than to underestimate Lost fans... :) Yes, the whole thing with the two treaties was a nasty business. The Nez Perce had ever since Lewis & Clark been on good terms with Whites. Most of them lived in the Wallowa Valley in eastern Oregon. But in the early 1800s a Catholic mission opened in the village of Lapwai, Idaho, and so there was a much smaller band of Nez Perce who lived around the mission and were Catholic. The US Government made a treaty with the Nez Perce in 1855, which set up a reservation that included both of these groups - the Catholics in Idaho and the majority of the Nez Perce in Oregon, who still practiced their tribal religion. In the 1860s gold was discovered in the Wallowa Valley, and the US Government called for a new treaty. The new treaty was to include only the area surrounding the Catholic mission in Idaho - which would mean that those Nez Perce who lived there already would suddenly be given huge amounts of political and economic power over the other non-Christian Nez Perce who would have to move and try to settle down in whatever land they could find on the much smaller reservation. The Government decided to have a "tribal vote" as a referendum to ratify this new treaty, but they didn't tell the Nez Perce living in Oregon about it. Instead, the only people who knew when the vote was to take place were the Nez Perce who were living next to the mission in Idaho - in other words, the people who would benefit the most form the treaty were the only ones who were informed about the vote to ratify it. So the day of the vote came, and voila! it passed almost unanimously! Surprise surprise. So then the US Govt came and told all the Nez Perce in Oregon that they were going to have to move off their land, and they were getting NO recompense for it.

So yeah, that was the basis of the Nez Perce "uprising". It was a bit more complicated than that, but that pretty much sums up the reason that most of the tribe decided to try to leave the US and immigrate to Canada, where they felt they would get better treatment under a government run by Queen Victoria...

As an aside, I've had the fortune to have met one of Joseph's great grand-daughters once. He is still very much respected in his tribe.

I vote for Hurley - he seems to know everyone - he knows more about what is going on and he seems to get along with everyone better than most -

He is a likable Leader and he doesn't micro manage therefore it seems as though others are in charge rather than him -

He gets games going and food spread around - without him there would be no fun at all!

Saukkomies, I liked your comments, too.

I voted for Hurley too - because frankly, the beach camp doesn't seem to have missed Jack at all, and Sawyer's just been sitting on his duff pouting. I'm not really sure what Jack has *done* for the group in a concrete way since the first season. (I don't say this to "bash" the character, but I simply haven't seen that much day-to-day leadership.)

Also, leadership in a circumstance like that can't occur in abstentia. It seems to me that since Hurley has come back (beginning of S3), he's in effect been the informal "leader" of the group - not by asserting himself, but simply by "being there" for people.

I agree - he does seem to be acting as a "king-maker" - but IMO it's he himself who is really the "matrix" holding the group together, and not just for the "fun" factor, but because he genuinely seems to know the people in the beach camp and cares about them.

Further, it seems to me that an aggressive or warlike leader would be completely unhelpful for the Losties at this point. Look at Jack's misbegotten notion to "go to war" against The Others. Even when individuals go into the jungle and show strong negative emotions/hatreds etc. it seems to attract the "Id monster" like flies to horse dung. (Re: Juliette and Kate's adventure in "Left Behind.")

Hurley OTOH seems to be able to move freely, and safely through the jungle - and he is not the type of person to advocate going to war, because he is fundamentally not prideful and aggressive. IOW, he's "at peace" with The Island - and surviving on The Island is what (IMO) the Losties have set before them as the task at hand - not "getting rescued" or kicking The Others' rear ends.

Now, Powers That Be, how about a nice woman for him? ; )

It's totally hard to tell who the 'real' leader is. Many characters have been thrown into a situation where they do play leader for a bit. Sayid, Jack, Locke, Kate, Sawyer, and sort of Hurley all possess leadership qualities. However, they use them in a different way and to a different extent.

Jack-assertive, trie to do everything for everyone
Sayid-is always right. knows the right way out
Locke- creepy, but can still make important decisions for a group of people
Kate- knows what she wants and needs. Like Locke, she can make decisions. She often goes the wrong way about them however.
Sawyer-often uses his abilities for himself, but when it comes down to the nitty gritty he'll do what he can to save something or someone
Hurley- may not be a true leader, but he knows how to get people relaxed and happy

Jack is the leader, and for many reasons.

Leaders generally inspire others and create a sense of strength and a feeling of "can-do," whether perceived or real. Jack has made inspirational speeches, both "Live together, Die Alone," and also when he returned to the caves after the Black Rock, and also when he was leaving for the Black Rock. He creates a sense of safety for the Losties. It doesn't matter if he can secure that safety or not. The Losties believe it. They trust him. Jack has consistently proven that he will risk his life for them, and that also inspires others to be loyal to him.

Contrary to what some may say, Jack does listen and does try to help. He's certainly not socially graceful, but his genuine intent is always there, and when he screws up, he tries to fix it.

Physically, Jack is imposing, and although that doesn't sound important, people tend to look for "big and strong" in their leaders. Jack will use brute strength, guns, and wits to protect and defend his people. He did it with Ethan when he pummeled him into the mud and with the Others in general. He took on Mr. Smokie when it wanted to pull Locke into the ground. He went after Claire, he saved Charlie, he dove into the water to save a drowning woman, and he nearly killed himself trying to save Boone. These things have been witnessed, absorbed, and processed by the Losties. It doesn't go unnoticed.

Jack is a leader through and through. Locke saw it immediately. So did Kate, Boone, Hurley, and Charlie. The fact that Jack doesn't covet the title makes him all the more worthy of it, imho. He is certainly not perfect. He is flawed, and he makes mistakes, but Jack is the man the Losties want as their leader.

As for the other Losties:

Hurley is a great man, but he is not a leader. He is a great Secretary of State. He is the voice of reason in a very calm and truthful way. Hurley can cut through all the BS and get to the heart of the matter that helps make someone else feel better (or worse if necessary) than before. Hurley has matured in three months, but he is also a man who admittedly needs to be lead by someone. The fact that he sought out Sawyer and didn't assume the title himself attests to this as well.

Sayid: He is not leader material either. Just because he has a military background doesn't mean that he can lead. Yes, he's good in a fight, but he has proven to be a man that follows his own agenda. He tends to go off on his own alot on one-man missions, and I haven't really seen him inspire anyone. Don't get me wrong, I would want Sayid at my side in a battle in a heartbeat, but the regular mundane, day-to-day things would bore a man like Sayid. A leader must be all-encompassing, not just the fighting, strategic side of things.

Locke: No. I don't think I even need to explain why.

Sawyer: No.

Kate: She is definitely respected and extremely capable. but I don't see her as a leader. She is very impulsive and always on the run.

I going to have to go with Jack.I mean look at the options left.All the others just seem,well,lost.People seem to follow what he says although he does get it wrong from time 2 time.Making the deal with Ben in the long run was proberly the best choice if he can come back with help,until lock cocked it up.lets hope he didn't blow it up but just sunk it out of sight.Jack is the best of a bunch of single minded,murderers.Has anybody done abody count of dead others caused by our losties vs dead losties by others.

I think we have a pretty good sampling so far for our poll. As of this writing there were 134 people who voted. The results clearly show Jack (with 53%) as the favorite, with Hurley (25%) as the very clear second choice, and Sayid (10%) as third. After that the results are pretty mixed. It is interesting to me that Charlie and Kate each tied for the lowest scores, with just one vote each. Even Jin and Sawyer got more votes than Charlie, which is surprising to me. But since the difference was just a single vote, it shouldn't count for that much. Locke also was a surprise, only receiving 6% of the vote; I expected him to do better than that.

It would have been interesting to have done this survey also earlier on - say at the beginning of Season Three - to compare the difference in the outcome of the vote. Perhaps I'll re-post another such poll at the end of the season to see if things have changed at all. Thanks everyone for voting, and since the poll is still open, feel free to vote if you haven't done so yet. :)

I think the reason why Jack got the most votes was because the writers made him leader for a bit. I mean he's a doctor so I have to give Jack credit, but look how many mistakes he made? I truly believe that if the writer's hadn't chosen him as leader, the voters wouldn't have.

I think it's hard to say who the leader is because it's so much in flux. Jack once was unquestionably the leader, but his captivity changed everything, including him. I don't think Jack truly has everyone's best interests at heart anymore or he would have a few more reservations about bringing Juliet back. Sure, she got branded and wants to leave, but she has been with them for three years. To be a good leader to his people back at the beach, Jack would be smart to find out what all she knows, and if she won't tell, don't bring her.

Now Juliet aside, I think Hurley is blossoming into a leader. He leads by example. He treats others with respect and kindness, he tries to keep people's spirits high, and he tries to keep them all united and therefore strong.

I think Jack being a doctor (and a very good one at that) has the quality of making rational decisions in a split secind, which is sometimes needed in a dangerous/difficult situation. Most people have a hard time doing that... I also think Jack's heart is in the right place, no matter if he makes bad choices sometimes or not.

Hurley is definitely worthy of second place and almost would make a better leader than Jack, if he only believed in himself a bit more. Everybody loves Hurley. ;)

What, no Vincent?

He'd have my vote any day!

Whoah, Maxum I won't quote your whole post but that is the exact reason I think Jack is without a doubt the best leader among the Losties.

voted for Sayid,hes made to be a leader.Got the coolness,patience,insight needed..everything.hes cut from leader mold.Although,the leader on the island is obviously Mr Shephard snr

Well my vote was for Hurley but after reading Maxum I would have to say you make a very good point for Jack.
Funny how the popular vote Hurley may not be the right vote - Jack -

Never looked at it that way ~ thanks for sharing

Maxum: I think you make a great point for Jack, but I was disappointed in your back-up for the others. Why not explain why Sawyer and Locke aren't leaders? Aslo, isn't Sayid like always right about things? Doesn't that make a good leader?

I think that this comes down to a real seperation of powers. At the risk of sounding like US History professor I believe tht each of the originals guides he remaining 45 or so. I break it down like this:

Jack: President - Commander of the Forces, Although he makes the fundamental decisions his aren't always the best and his friends do sway his ideas
Locke: Vice President - Secondary to Jack however guides his own legion
Hurley: Presidential Advisor/Lostie Representative, Hurley seems to have the ability to sway the thoughts of the people and the leader at the time, HOWEVER he seemingly falls passive in areas that need him to maintain control. Which detract from his role as a leader.
Sayid: Leader of the (Un)Armed Forces - While Sayid is intelligent he lacks the ability to make "on the fly" decisions. Which is key to being a leader.
Sawyer: Law Enforcement - I had a hard time finding Sawyer's role, He is a reminder however, that the outside world is much more two-sided than just that of easy trade and bartering. He can be selfish at times, but he attempts to maintain control which is the key role of law enforcement.

The Woman of the Island such as Kate, Clair and Sun are perhaps most important. They maintain a balance between the adventure and war-like mindsets and the need for a balanced common sense society.

Jack IMO is the "leader" but he's hardly a leader without his advisors and crew.
100%
Ummm, The Writers make the Show.... So you're debating the integrity of what the show is about?

I think Maxum's post should be leader....way to go Maxum

BTW I voted Jack for all of Maxum's reasons

Maxum: I think you make a great point for Jack, but I was disappointed in your back-up for the others. Why not explain why Sawyer and Locke aren't leaders?

Hi Freckles,

Locke is not leader material at all because he is way too self-centered. He has proven that over and over again on the island. He will sacrifice anyone and everyone to protect the island. That is his God right now. Locke sacrificed Boone, and he admitted it. He didn't go back to rescue Jack, and he admitted this too. He had his own agenda. He also left Kate behind after pretty much telling her that she didn't measure up the way he thought she did. Locke is also EXTREMELY easy to manipulate. None of these qualities make Locke a good candidate for leader. On top of all of this, Jack and Locke were constantly butting heads. Now, you might think that Jack was the problem, except that the minute Jack was out of the picture and Locke was with Sayid, within hours, Sayid was also butting heads with John.

Locke does not inspire at all. He tends to make you question his every motive. Not a good sign.

Saywer: He is not leader material either because he inspires no one to trust him. Quite the opposite. He also is far too selfish, and everyone has also witnessed this about him. He has hoarded vital supplies for himself, and spends much of his time lounging and reading, rather than helping, and he won't help out unless there's something in it for him. I mean, there's a reason why Hurley wanted to banish him, right? There's a reason why Sun won't give him the time of day.

Sawyer has the potential of becoming a much better man, and maybe we saw shades of that this past episode. However, he has a long way to go before anyone will pick him over Jack or even Sayid.

Aslo, isn't Sayid like always right about things? Doesn't that make a good leader?

No, I don't think so. First, Sayid isn't always right about things. He makes mistakes too. The problem with Sayid as a leader is that he doesn't lead. He's very much a loner. More importantly, Sayid is a bit of hot head - a dangerous hot head. He and Sawyer came to blows in the first episode. Later, his first impulse was to torture Sawyer when it came to the inhalers, and then afterwards, he abandoned the Losties for quite a while to get over it. When he had his hands on Ben, he almost beat him to death. After Jack, Kate, and Sawyer were kidnapped, Sayid made no attempt to fill the vacumn left behind, and he seemed more than willing to allow Locke to lead. That alone is cause for concern.

Sayid is an excellent soldier and strategist, but he is not a leader, at least not with the other options on the island.

(Btw: Thanks for everyone's responses. These, of course, are just my opinions based on what I've seen from each character.)

Thanks Maxum. I totally see your points.

Then again, Jack has his faults much like the other characters. He is sometimes a bit overprotective especially with females. He would never willingly let Kate (and I'm sure other women) be involved in the same danger as he would let men. I actually think Jack can be too selfish sometimes. Of course, not to the extreme of Sawyer, but still Jack pretty much dropped everything when he saw the aspiration of his father in that one episode. He sort of abandoned the people for that short time. Jack also displays a lot of weakness when he overdoes himself causing other people to have to take care of him when as a leader, it should be the opposite. He tends to not take care of himself sometimes.

I see everyone's point, but I still don't think there is one 'best' leader. Like I stated before, each character has their own leadership qualities. I also think that many viewers have their minds set on Jack being leader since the writer's made him leader. I did too until I started to really think about the characters and realize there is not perfect leader and most likely, there will never be.

I see everyone's point, but I still don't think there is one 'best' leader. Like I stated before, each character has their own leadership qualities. I also think that many viewers have their minds set on Jack being leader since the writer's made him leader. I did too until I started to really think about the characters and realize there is not perfect leader and most likely, there will never be.

I agree with you Freckles. I think that Jack has done some things lately that might indicate he is not working for the best interests of the Survivors. I would not really call that as being a good leader, if that's what he's supposed to be... On the other hand, I might be wrong about Jack. Maybe he IS doing everything for the benefit of his fellow castaways.

As I was reading the new posts I started to wonder -

WHO'S THE REAL LEADER ???

Ben or Jack --

We are focusing on the leader of the Losties - but in reality I think the leader is the ultimate leader - the leader of both the Losties and the Others --
Jack fits the bill for both -- THOUGHTS?

I don't think the Losties have a strong leader, and that is the source of a lot of their problems. Jack became the de facto leader, but he often makes rash decisions, and I do not find his passive-aggressive tactics inspiring. He is also their only doctor, a precious commodity given their circumstances, but he seldom keeps that in mind. A true leader would not have made a deal with Ben to leave the island himself, but would instead have made the deal for Claire and Aaron to leave (if possible, Sun and Jin also as they are expecting a child). Jack, as a true leader and the Losties doctor, would be the last to leave, doing his best to keep everyone still there in good health. This is simply not Jack's MO.

The Losties did not make good use of the shelter of the Swan when it was available, still have not built any decent shelter on the beach and do not have an SOS signal. A decent leader should have pushed them towards these things at the very least.

Sayid certainly has his own issues, but I would push for him as a better leader (with Hurley in a VP type role). Sayid would certainly need to be convinced to step up and take control, and he would have a lot of trouble with Jack, Sawyer and Locke, but I think the Losties would be much better off with Sayid making the decisions.

I love Sayid to death and I think he's incredibly intelligent and perecptive, but I wouldn't want him as leader. Like Maxum said, Sayid can be way too easily hot headed and I think he's just now starting to deal with his anger problems. He also is too much of a loner, probly due to being in such a secretive position while in the military.

Jack may be flawed but he is the best the Losties have and I personally would follow him if in their situation. I would question him at times, like I do of any leader in this world, but I would believe from his actions that he has the Losties' best interest in mind when it comes to his decision making. No one is without flaw, but some people are better than others at taking charge. Jack is the only one we've seen who's really good at that. Locke could be, but he's waaayyyyy into his own motives and practically obsessed with the island. I'm hoping Locke turns out to be a good guy who fights the good fight, but he'll never really be the leader type. He thinks too much about himself for that position. And as others have said, Sawyer is just.. well, he's Sawyer. ;) Although, I kinda liked watching him try to be selfless for a change. I hope they continue that transformation for him, although no one wants to see him lose his "edge" - but I like Sawyer being the softie we all know he is deep down inside.

And I actually think Sun could be a leader if the situation called for it. I like Sun a lot. I look forward to watching her become more and more of an important character as time goes on (I hope!)

Like Maxum said, Sayid can be way too easily hot headed and I think he's just now starting to deal with his anger problems.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that Jack is more level-headed than Sayid.

Sayid goes to extreme measures at times, but his actions are planned out in advance, and his instincts are flawless. His problem is not with anger... it's with guilt.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that Jack is more level-headed than Sayid.

Sayid goes to extreme measures at times, but his actions are planned out in advance, and his instincts are flawless. His problem is not with anger... it's with guilt.
Well, anger and guilt so often go hand in hand, don't they? And even though Sayid can be leavel headed at times, he also has been known to go to those extreme measures in a way that I don't think Jack would dare dream of. Now that can be very helpful and I'm actually glad Sayid is the way he is, but for a leader who is supposed to calm people and help them feel guided when they're lost - I just see Jack as that man and not Sayid.

Hurley, because he's the puppet master.

Hurley, because he's the puppet master.

This post could come back two years from now as I TOLD YOU SO!:eek2:

I had to pick Hurley. He's the easiest one to spot ;). But, no, seriously, he's perhaps one of the nicest guys on the island. He doesn't have much a temper, even though once in a while he might get in a fight (e.g.: in "Dave" he beat up Sawyer).

But of course, being leader is not about being nice. However, it's about looking for the well-being of others.

- Who's the one who goes around and socializes and cheer people up? Hurley
- Who finds fun on the Island in the midst of stress (golf course and getting the Bus to work)? Hurley
- Who passes out the food and makes sure people partake it (including himself)? Hurley
- Who put together the manifest? Hurley
- Who helped to unintentionally kill Nikki and Paulo? Hurley
- Who influences the visible leaders (Jack and Sawyer)? Hurley

Without Hurley, there would be no enjoyment on the Island, Without Hurley, the visible leaders wouldn't be influenced.

Jack is the real leader of the people.

Locke will eventually become leader of the others and the savior of the losties.

Jack is only "the leader" because when they all crashed and were scared and injured he was the doctor. He knew how to treat everyone and after a severly traumatic and life threatening experience I myself would probably attach myself to a doctor.
However I don't think he's a great leader. He does things his way all the time, he decides his own outcome regardless of what other people say.

Sayid could be a great leader but I don't think he ever will be. Revenge can sometimes blind him from whats really important.

Locke could be a great leader but he kinda makes big decisions to suit himself.

Hurley could be a good leader. He interacts with everybody on the island and he knows whats going on with everyone.

As for the rest..

Kate follows Jack, Sawyer follows Kate. Charlie follows Claire. Desmond doesn't want to be leader. Jin takes care of Sun. Sun gives Sawyer evil looks. Vincent can't talk and Rose and Bernard have vanished.

I voted Claire anyways. I'd love to see her be the leader :biggrin:

I think that Jack is the real leader by way of Lockes guideance, therefore Locke is the real leader of the survivors

This post could come back two years from now as I TOLD YOU SO!:eek2:

I think there are hints being given along the way. For one thing, his name is Reyes - Old French for "king." For another, he wore a yellow shirt a few eps back with a crown embroidered into the pocket.

So who knows ... maybe there is something there?

I had to pick Hurley. He's the easiest one to spot ;). But, no, seriously, he's perhaps one of the nicest guys on the island. He doesn't have much a temper, even though once in a while he might get in a fight (e.g.: in "Dave" he beat up Sawyer).

But of course, being leader is not about being nice. However, it's about looking for the well-being of others.

Jack had a kind of leadership that was appropriate to the early days. He looked for water; looked out for the medical care of the survivors; delegated jobs, etc.

But as time has progressed, his role has changed. One thing I noticed is that in his absence *he hasn't been missed.* Oh, people did miss him, worry about him, etc., but what I mean is, his "leadership skills" weren't missed. No one got sick and died because of his absence. The beach camp didn't fall apart.

In fact, things have been pretty downright peaceful.

The psychodrama between Kate, Jack, and Sawyer (the "cool kids at school") overshadows the other story - that most people on the beach are not heavily invested in that love affair, and that rescue seems to be an ever-diminishing possibility.

So the question arises, is Jack a leader for a post-rescue "society?"

I would say no. For one thing, as I said above, his skills haven't been missed. For another, he was willing to forsake his own leadership and go off on some kind of "war" against the Others, without even knowing what kind of opponents they were. Also, he was ready to leave the island entirely and "send help." Never mind that even finding the place again, much less getting a ship to it, might have been almost impossible. Never mind that rescue *may not even be the point anymore.* Can Jack lead in that world?

I'm surprised Sayid did so well. He is invaluable for his various skills, but not really a natural leader. Hurley is sort of the leader, as he's kind of the King Maker -- like Karl Rove. But Jack is the actual executive. As annoying as I find Jack, he has the assertiveness and selflessness to fill that role well. Locke is too obsessed with his own path to be an effective leader of the group -- but he would effectively lead anyone who wanted to follow the path he was taking.

I'm surprised Sayid did so well. He is invaluable for his various skills, but not really a natural leader. Hurley is sort of the leader, as he's kind of the King Maker -- like Karl Rove. But Jack is the actual executive. As annoying as I find Jack, he has the assertiveness and selflessness to fill that role well. Locke is too obsessed with his own path to be an effective leader of the group -- but he would effectively lead anyone who wanted to follow the path he was taking.

Hurley as Karl Rove??? Now that's a mind-boggling idea!

That would mean Jack is George W. Bush? And Sayid is--Dick Cheney? (Yet Alberto Gonzalez is the one they call "torture guy.") And then Locke would have to be--Donald Rumsfeld? (You know, man of faith type of thing.)

I originally voted for Hurley -
Then changed my mind based on all the good reasons Sawyer should be the Leader - I think we need a new poll - one for if you have changed your mind - then another if you changed it back -

Each week I bounce back and forth as to who should be in charge!