In the 2nd 1/2 of the episode there is a moment when Des walks into someone's office. There is a brief change of angle, and on the desk there is a picuter of the man Des is talking to and a woman. To me, it looked like the same woman that sold Des his engagment ring. Can anyone confirm ?

i thought that too. i definately think it was bc it was positioned just so that we would see it.

In the 2nd 1/2 of the episode there is a moment when Des walks into someone's office. There is a brief change of angle, and on the desk there is a picuter of the man Des is talking to and a woman. To me, it looked like the same woman that sold Des his engagment ring. Can anyone confirm ?

Oh yes I can! I was gonna post a thread regarding this one. It's the same shop-keeping, future telling old lady indeed!!!

Desmond, it seems, is connected to people that know about his abilities or that he's "destined for something greater". Looks like the Brother who found him is the son of the old shopkeeping lady. Means Des has had "guides" for a few years prior to him leaving on that race and getting stranded.

Who the hell are THOSE people? We have Ben and co to think about, but who's that old lady and her son??? She knows about the Island, the computer, the numbers...Maybe she's Karen deGroots mother?

how do we know he's her son? he could have been her lover.

What is the "brother" and the "shopkeeper" have been guiding Desmond to his destiny. A destiny on the Island, on the side of "good"...to fight evil...ie...JACOB !!!

it sure is here :

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/4117/bscap0yu5.jpg

That picture looks so fake though!

Weird picture really.. Looks like the one des and penny took. Just standing infront of some fake background. And he does not look like a monk in it:P

Mrs hawking was in the pic on the Padre's desk.

I saw it too....I am so upset, my DVR isn't working so I had to watch it on regular TV, but that was definitely her in the picture!!!

Yes, I saw it too. Does that mean that the monk knew something about Desmond's future and that's how he knew that Des had to be fired just at that moment, in order to meet Penny?

yup... i just paused it on my dvr, it was her clear as day! woah!

LOL, they do looked photoshopped in, now don't they?

Clearly an easter egg meant to be noticed, and hopefully one of significance. Perhaps the monk "scouted" Desmond out, and thus began people who were watching him to confirm his destiny?

Now that I think about it, Libby could have been one of those people as well.

Yeah, I saw it on the DVR, too. Bad photoshop job.

I think it ties into the monk's answer when Desmond asked, "What do I do now?" - "What comes next."

Just re-watched that scene, and that is her.

Who was she pictured with--the head monk? She must be his sister. I hope someone pulls a screencap.

Of course, if they were doing freaky time travel, the head monk could be an aged Des who rejoined the monastery after wife Penny died. The two pictures are posed much the same way. But I don't think they're going that way.

Cardie

Yes, I saw it too. Does that mean that the monk knew something about Desmond's future and that's how he knew that Des had to be fired just at that moment, in order to meet Penny?


I think it means that the "monk" was steering Desmond through this portion of his life. He found Desmond in the street and directed him to Penny. It was all pre-arranged.

Who is Mrs Hawking?

Hmm, we seem to have 2 threads going on this right now.

Interesting thoughts Cardie, but you know how time travel scares me.

I'm also thinking that the monk could be a recruiter type for, you know, saving the world and such. Ms. Hawking and maybe Libby are part of the team of people whose jobs it is to keep Des on track.

:jawdrop:

kewl catch.....

so maybe his monk expereince was to go what he was supposed to do..he was supposed to become a monk to meet penny...he was supposed to come to the island....all of this is supposed to happen...reguardless of his seeing into the future???

Thanks for giving me her identity :).

I knew it was the woman Des met, who told him about his place in the universe,...but I couldn't remember her name.

I am beginning to see a pattern here, with all, if not most of the Losties,....in my humble opinion, they were all manipulated onto the flight that day. It was all prearranged.

If the head Monk is related to Mrs. Hawkings, then maybe he has the same kind on knowledge that she has. Maybe that's why his answer was do whatever comes next.

totally saw it, but i wasn't DVRing it so i couldn't rewind. can we get a screen cap so i can send it to my brother?

What a crappy picture. Look at the shadows. The background is in full sunlight--like the sun is full and behind you at 7 oclock. On her face the shadow is on her left cheek, like the sun is to her right. He has no distinct shadowing. Light marks of shading on his left--like the sun (or whatever light source is on his right). I don't mean to make a big deal of this but...a terrible computer job.

Bottom line-the pics of him and her were NOT taken together!

If the writers mean this to be an actual photo...please hire photoshop people who know a little about photography.

The apperance of Mrs. Hawking isn't a coincidence. My guess is someone/thing/group have a vested interest in Desmond taking a certain path:

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

What all of this ultimately means is beyond me right now, but it does appear that Desmond is supposed to be involved in "saving the world", probably by changing the values of the Valenzetti Equation.

What I think we're seeing is opposing forces at work, both in the outside world and on the Island. One group is represented by Ben and the arm of Mittelos, the other by individuals like Mrs. Hawking and the monk, who are probably affiliated with Hanso.

The apperance of Mrs. Hawking isn't a coincidence. My guess is someone/thing/group have a vested interest in Desmond taking a certain path:

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

What all of this ultimately means is beyond me right now, but it does appear that Desmond is supposed to be involved in "saving the world", probably by changing the values of the Valenzetti Equation.

What I think we're seeing is opposing forces at work, both in the outside world and on the Island. One group is represented by Ben and the arm of Mittelos, the other by individuals like Mrs. Hawking and the monk, who are probably affiliated with Hanso.
....and then there's the question of whether Desmond will assert his "free will" over his destiny. :biggrin:

totally saw it, but i wasn't DVRing it so i couldn't rewind. can we get a screen cap so i can send it to my brother?

I got this from a poster named PRL in another thread:

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/4117/bscap0yu5.jpg

So he is fired is told to follow the next path - goes to say goodbye - there is the woman from his flashback - flash off the island - and he is placed with Penny - sounds like a set up to me - BUT Penny's dad did NOT want them together so why set them up - unless Daddy was trying to get Penny away from someone else and thought he Des would walk out on her given his committment phobia!

But why in the world would the monk photoshop Mrs Hawkins into the photo??? I mean, c'mon, we're talking about Mrs Hawkins!

:confused:

I saw it when I watched it for the first time (even though it was on screen for like a millisecond).

I noticed the photo immediately, but wasn't quick enough to register the woman was in fact the ring lady. Now that I've seen the screenshot posted on this thread, it's confirmed. But, what bugs me isn't the fact that she's in it so much as the strong visual draw to the picture in the shot because it's so fake. Do TPTB really think they need to lead us that much? Those of us who analyze every obvious (and unobvious) detail in the show? Or are they purposefully drawing our eyes away from something else? Classic slight of hand magic trick.

The photo SCREAMS to the eyes.

That picture looks so fake though!

That's the first thing I thought as well, but it is definitely Ms. Hawking in the picture. They even made a point of doing a close up on the picture after the first shot of it. If that's not a clue, then what is?

how do we know he's her son? he could have been her lover.

we dont, but because monks take a vow of chastity- even if he had a past he wouldn't actually be advertising it at the monastery

I got this from a poster named PRL in another thread:

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/4117/bscap0yu5.jpg


thanks!!

So he was directed to meet Penny, which would inadvertanly send him on a race around the world which would crash him on the island to push the button, then eventually turn the failsafe.

There were events in his life he had no idea of - possible why he left his first engagement, how he joined the monks, his eventual set up with Penny, the reassurance from Mrs Hawkings on him not marrying Penny, getting sent on the race, crashing on the island - for what purpose?

Is there some elaborate process in motion directing Desmond to something greater? Is he actually someone who he doesn't even know he is? Weird stuff. Looking at how locked in he was to getting stuck on the island, to seeing tonight there might have been a serious hand in setting him up with Penny way before, it just seems odd that he is just some guy who crashed there.

Its the ring lady and the writers are weaving again. Has anyone seen any posts on the weaving of the Lost characters?

Here's a really good, higher resolution screen cap! It's from DarkUFO's site.

http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2007/04/desmonds-mystery-woman.html

That looks kind of creepy, like he has a crush on her and cut their pictures out and pasted them side by side.. :shock:

Interesting, when the monk was giving Des that speak just after he was fired I kept thinking that the monk sounded like a Ms. Hawking clone.

Maybe she was just popping into the picture like those ghosts do in Harry Potter, you know, just to make sure everything was going according to plan.:biggrin:

That picture looks so fake though!

Yes terrible photoshop :biggrin: but it was totally there for a reason.

The apperance of Mrs. Hawking isn't a coincidence. My guess is someone/thing/group have a vested interest in Desmond taking a certain path:

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

What all of this ultimately means is beyond me right now, but it does appear that Desmond is supposed to be involved in "saving the world", probably by changing the values of the Valenzetti Equation.

What I think we're seeing is opposing forces at work, both in the outside world and on the Island. One group is represented by Ben and the arm of Mittelos, the other by individuals like Mrs. Hawking and the monk, who are probably affiliated with Hanso.

You forgot to include Desmond's time in the Scottish Army, his time in military prison and his dishonorable discharge.

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Joins Scottish Army/Imprisonment/Dishonorable discharge.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

I totally missed that photo in the episode, but thanks to everyone who posted pics. So it seems like there has been someone guiding Desmond toward the island for a long time?

Geez...Photoshop much? That is horrible....But now comes the next obvious "mystery"...was the obvious "fakeness" of the picture a horrible job by the prop department?....or does it look fake on purpose for reasons to be explained later on the show?

My guess is it was a quickly thrown together prop malfunction. It looks like they had a hi-rez pic taken of the padre....but they used a low-rez screen cap or wardrobe continuity photo for Mrs. Hawking. And that background looks totally hokey.

In the production team's defense, the pic looked FINE on my TV screen...and I even kinda thought the woman looked like Mrs. Hawking...but that screen cap provided earlier def proves it. It's not til we get here...when these prop pics are blown up to enormous sizes does the illusion fall apart.

To support the 'it was all a plan' theory:

Desmond said that he went out and had a couple of pints, and maybe had too many and then woke up in the middle of the street? C'mon, Desmond is Scottish, he knows how to drink (no offense to any Scots out there) ;)

He would know if he got sloshed enough to pass out in the street - which is pretty trashed - and would admit as much if he was really confessing to Ruth (?). However, starting to drink and then passing out unexpectedly would be consistent with the Other's use of tranquilizers.

Just a thought.

That picture looks so fake though!


really..who did the photoshopping on that..its terrible

But there was a direct link to Desmond tryng to make the future he was seeing in the episode come true and hawkings and company making sure Desmonds future picture puzzle come true as well

It's Mrs. Hawkings, alright, but the picture was definitely photoshopped together -- the lighting on the faces is different. Looks like they are positioned in front of the Abbey, and the brother is wearing his robe. Don't know if that makes her his mother, though -- if they are "guides" it could just be that they share a destiny, too.

Like another poster said earlier that pic reminds me of the one of Desmond and Pen, fake background and all. This got me to thinking...and I know this is probably just looney but what if the padre and hawking are future Des and Pen going back to lead past Desmond (or Desmonds if you like) down the right path to eventually do something that "saves the world"(or some other important thing). I figured I'd throw that out there, what do you guys think?

I think the explanation for the lame (explicative here) photoshop job is they probably felt the need to up the weirdness of the ep, post production, fore it truely was lacking in the Lost 'weirdness' content until the pic popped up. Mrs. Spooky's pic is obviously a still from her ep, and padre's mug shot almost looks like it came off a photo id, or some screen test. :confused:
The only other explanation for this extrememly obvious lack of creativity is that it was meant to be exactly that, extremely obvious...like it's Des's umpteenth alternate reality and the 'Powers", whatever/whoever they/it is/are have attempted again, to smooth something over.:blink: :34853_huh: :shrug:

The picture does look so horrible. It's like the prop department contacted me, and got me to photoshop it 5 minutes before shooting the scene. Yes, I'm really bad at Photoshop.

When I watched I noticed the picture a little too late to see who was in it, I just remember thinking Oh my gosh that was a picture of him and somebody important and I missed who it was!! :blushing:

Okay no, this is too fake to be Photoshop...Photoshop is for people who are serious about it (the software is EXPENSIVE). This is like a kindergartner on Paint and took the faces from two separate pictures and pasted them on a fake background. Like what the HECK are they trying to tell us???

I think it means either the prop department put it together really quickly and sloppily just for a one second shot (which really, that's how quickly it was on the screen), or it means that the priest is creepy and likes to cut out people's pictures and paste them beside himself.

The apperance of Mrs. Hawking isn't a coincidence. My guess is someone/thing/group have a vested interest in Desmond taking a certain path:

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

What all of this ultimately means is beyond me right now, but it does appear that Desmond is supposed to be involved in "saving the world", probably by changing the values of the Valenzetti Equation.

What I think we're seeing is opposing forces at work, both in the outside world and on the Island. One group is represented by Ben and the arm of Mittelos, the other by individuals like Mrs. Hawking and the monk, who are probably affiliated with Hanso.

A very well stated theory. Quite brilliant actually. Two thumbs up, brothah! ;)

:hesaid: or:shesaid:

Hahaha, c'mon people, if every easter egg and random character connection had a "meaning", this show would take 9 seasons to explain them all. And we all know that's NOT happening. :rolleyes:

lost sucks at photo shopping, just like the group photo in the water. wtf?

It looked to be on purpose that we saw it. It was a horrible job with the photo shopping/ms paint. There's definately more to the story!

I still say he's a creepy guy and did it himself! He made a looovee collage.

While watching the scene, I saw that pic & said (I know, I am a dork) "woah!!" (just like keanu reeves...haha!). I knew it was her but had to come see screencaps for confirmation.

Yeah, sucks with photoshop. Maybe the issue was they just had "lost" the original pic they had planned to use & did throw this one together? :shrugs:

In the 2nd 1/2 of the episode there is a moment when Des walks into someone's office. There is a brief change of angle, and on the desk there is a picuter of the man Des is talking to and a woman. To me, it looked like the same woman that sold Des his engagment ring. Can anyone confirm ?Yep, it sure was! Here's a cap I took from my DVD. http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mrshawkingpixcatch22cy8.jpg

Maybe she was just popping into the picture like those ghosts do in Harry Potter, you know, just to make sure everything was going according to plan.:biggrin:

Okay no, this is too fake to be Photoshop...Photoshop is for people who are serious about it (the software is EXPENSIVE). This is like a kindergartner on Paint and took the faces from two separate pictures and pasted them on a fake background. Like what the HECK are they trying to tell us???

I was expecting Ms. Hawking to ;) or give a :thumbsup:. And I love MegletTX's comment about a kindergartner on Paint. No kidding.

Obviously we were meant to see it. Obviously it was fake. I think the picture was there merely to drive home the idea of the "universe course-correcting." Desmond HAS to end up on that island. (I'm still not ready to buy into that notion.)

At the same time, once I saw Ms.Hawking in the picture, it got me wondering about Des getting the boot from the padre. I think he came into the room knowing full well he was going to fire Des. But why? Because he got punched? Because he drank the wine? Weird. So maybe there is more to the picture.

But I'm going with simple easter egg to drive home course correcton.

Who cares if they are off in their expressions and positions. It's obviously supposed to be a genuine photo on the monk's desk. I'd guess she's his sister or maybe son.

Yeah, I noticed the pic of "the ring lady" right away. Hmm... Seems like there are definitely people who have been orchestrating his life for a long time now.
Poor Des... He's being so easily manipulated by these people (whomever they may be...)
I hope he finally realizes he can and should make his own destiny, no matter what the visions tell him. He's such a lost lostie! I want to see him finally assert his own freedom and believe in himself and find the strength to feel worthy of Penny. I hope that he will at some point...
Now I wonder if they'll give him a FB later on that tells us how on eath he became this self-loathing and scared of commitment?

Yeah, I noticed the pic of "the ring lady" right away. Hmm... Seems like there are definitely people who have been orchestrating his life for a long time now.
Poor Des... He's being so easily manipulated by these people (whomever they may be...)
I hope he finally realizes he can and should make his own destiny, no matter what the visions tell him. He's such a lost lostie! I want to see him finally assert his own freedom and believe in himself and find the strength to feel worthy of Penny. I hope that he will at some point...
Now I wonder if they'll give him a FB later on that tells us how on earth he became this self-loathing and scared of commitment?I hear you and want the same thing for him. I hope we get that flashback, too. Wonder if Mrs. Hawking will show up then, too. :rolleyes:

In line with this discussion, I thought the monk's response to Desmond after he kicks him out was very odd. Desmond asks "What do I do now?" and the monk responds "Whatever comes next."

Yeah, I just checked it out at Sledgeweb's. HERE (http://lost.cubit.net/forum/gallery/1_18_04_07_10_28_03.jpg) is the pic. It's definately her. I saw it in the episode, just a flash of white hair, and I instantly placed her. Found it funny that a lot of other people did too.

To those complaining about the photoshopping. I do it for a living and the reason I put forward for the shoddy photomash is that TPTB wanted the photo to look incongruous - oitherwise it wouldn't have got noticed. It's onscreen for about a second so you have to make it instantly obvious in terms of it being a clue, and you have to make the figures in the photo instantly recongisable.

Job done I say - I wouldn't read anything into it regarding photoshopping (in-show) or collaging.

Could be that chief monk had been "guided" by her and he had his photo taken with her because they became friends of a sort.

Or maybe Desmond's earlier flashback was a dream and, as someone he had met, she was elected by his subconscious to play the part of the explainer.

One thing seems clear....she's there to oversee that Desmond follows the path he's supposed to take.

The apperance of Mrs. Hawking isn't a coincidence. My guess is someone/thing/group have a vested interest in Desmond taking a certain path:

* End six year relationship with Ruth.
* Enter the monastary.
* Be introduced to Penny.
* Develop relationship-and then end it, at least temporarily.
* Sign up for Widmore's "race around the world".
* End up on the Island.
* Become the steward of the Swan.
* Turn the failsafe key.

What all of this ultimately means is beyond me right now, but it does appear that Desmond is supposed to be involved in "saving the world", probably by changing the values of the Valenzetti Equation.

What I think we're seeing is opposing forces at work, both in the outside world and on the Island. One group is represented by Ben and the arm of Mittelos, the other by individuals like Mrs. Hawking and the monk, who are probably affiliated with Hanso.

I agree with this concept. I think the name 'Ruth' and the telling of the story of 'Issac' supports this conflict as well.

The monk was 'testing' Des in the beginning. I think Des is being recruited by the original Hanso team, which also includes Jacob. I think Ben et al are ex-Hansos or next generation Hansos that bastardized the Dharma objective somehow.

I think the Penny/her dad thing is significant as well. Mr. Windmore is another one of the ex-Hansos who went awry. That's why setting Des with Penny, rejection by Windmore, leaving Penny, was crucial. If Des had married Penny he wouldn't be on the island to get the original Hanso folks back in power.

The Hanso folks USED what Mr. Windmore cared about most...ie Penny...to get this recruit. They are also obviously using Desmond.

Free Will needs to supercede fate for both these groups. That seems tied to the Valenzetti equation.

Des has been on the island 3 yrs longer than the Losties, so he is further along than the Losties. It seems like the Losties were recruited as well...just not sure which side recruited them.

I was going to start a thread myself. Clearly an Easter Egg meant to be seen...I was so proud of catching it onscreen then rewinding the DVR to confirm that was the ring lady (I never noticed and still have not really seen or understood the Dharma shark Easter Egg).

I also noticed that the perspective in the photo is off...it is as if she is looking at him fondly, watching over him. Could it be that the Monk was directed by the ring lady to be where he was, so to influence Desmond at the right time? The photo is mysterious but still intended to convey something...we now know there is another connection lurking.

As to the "free will" question/issue earlier in the thread, Des is strugging with the responsibility (or not) of having his visions. He has the same gift that the Ring Lady does...remember, she told him the Guy with the Red Shoes' death was "meant to be" so why stop it, because it will eventually happen anyway? Yet he has repeatedly tried to save Charlie, even when it might (in his mind) affect the future in a way adverse to his interests.

This question may be on another thread, but it is conceiveable that his saving Charlie resulted in a different person arriving at the island than he thought? My sense is not at all...but Des is so wrapped up in his gift and wanting to reunite with Penny that he can't make sense of how to handle it all. It is truly a "test" well beyond what he faced in the Monastery.

I'm one of the people that belive that there is a a third group onthe island. Who they are or what they are doing i'm not sure yet. My guess is Mrs Hawkins Is the Desmond of that group. She sees the future and knows Desmond plays a critial role in it. Just a Desmond contols the out come with requard to Charle she is controling Desmond. The regliouis udertones we keep seeing are more and more prevlent. the question is why?
1.
100%
I'm one of the people that believe that there is a third group on the island. Who they are or what they are doing I’m not sure yet. My guess is Mrs. Hawkins Is the Desmond of that group. She sees the future and knows Desmond plays a critical role in it. Just as Desmond controls the out come with regard to Charlie she is controlling Desmond. The religious undertones we keep seeing are more and more prevalent the question is why?
1. Is Desmond the savor?
2. Is Desmond there to protect Charlie who is the Savor?
If you think about it Both have lead similar lives. Both have experienced temptation and have fought that temptation. Desmonds Drinking, Charlie's Drugs. Both were self loathing people in need of guidance.

I was going to start a thread myself. Clearly an Easter Egg meant to be seen...I was so proud of catching it onscreen then rewinding the DVR to confirm that was the ring lady (I never noticed and still have not really seen or understood the Dharma shark Easter Egg).

.

Firstly, the Dharma Shark was probably a part of the Dharma tests on Hydra Island (remember the tank Jack was in?) And the Polar Bears and the Hurley Bird - same things.

I caught the pic too and was like omgwth. And how the brother found Des passed out in the street and he had no idea how he got there (could be drink, could be something else). "drowning" his sorrows and his inability to get in touch with his true desires - makes him sound a bit like Jack! to me.

So the Monk kicked him out so that he could meet Penny. I guess a door doesn't close without a window opening. I guess that's a course correction.

that's photo on the desk it's a bad montage..

abrams can you use photoshop? :p

I wonder if Desmond has ever seen the picture?

If he hasn't, it was there just for us...so that we know Brother Campbell and Ms. Hawking are connected somehow.

I'm beginning to get vibes of The Matrix with Desmond's flashbacks now. Like he's becoming lucid or something. Too much to think about.

I'm also thinking that "bad photoshop" job was done on purpose. Maybe just to mess with us, maybe because his FBs aren't normal.

Poor Desy was the victim of roofies in his drink - good thing nothing worse happened to him than being "saved" by a monk.

- Yes, it's her. His boss said something about a "higher calling" when he was firing Des, did he not? It's likely that, Mrs. Hawking had already gotten to the monk.

- In the flashback when Des goes to the ring store, I seem to recall she was surprised to see Des there talking to her directly and like Ben guided Juliet on what to do if Kate caught her in a lie, it's likely Mrs. Hawking was guided on what to do if Desmond should ever see her face to face.

Mrs. Hawking seems suspiciously like an agent of someone else.

It almost looks like the padre's mug shot

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u242/avi3000/untitled.jpg
If anyones interested, this is an exact screencap from "Flashes before your eyes". They really didn't do much of any editing at all to the pic. At the least I think this proves that it's just a bad photoshop job and not that the monk is creepy, otherwise they would have at least tried using a different picture, I think...

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u242/avi3000/untitled.jpg
If anyones interested, this is an exact screencap from "Flashes before your eyes". They really didn't do much of any editing at all to the pic. At the least I think this proves that it's just a bad photoshop job and not that the monk is creepy, otherwise they would have at least tried using a different picture, I think...

wow, good find. is there the possibility that it wasn't on the monk's desk when this event actually happened. Remember in FBYE, his flashback's are partly the true events of what happened, interspersed with things that occured after the flashback. Maybe this is the same thing. We are seeing the flashback through Desmond's eyes, but we have seen that his flashbacks are don't always make sense. OR, there is some really cool Desmond-must-follow-his-fate thing that proves that his destiny was laid out a long time ago.

Seeing that screencap definitely lead me to believe that the bad photoshopping was the result of the props guys.

But the question remains, the Abbott and Mrs. Hawking are in the picture together, and for a reason. I'm inclined to believe the "recruiting"/3rd group theories. I mean, c'mon. Everyone who was on that plane and has played an important part in the show was put on the plane by someone else.

The psychic put claire on it, jack was on it because of his dad, sun and jin were on it because they were headed to america on behest of sun's dad, kate was on it because of the marshal, sawyer was on it because he's coming home from killing the man he thought was the real sawyer. Locke was on it because he couldn't do the walkabout as a reslult of him being in the wheelchair.

No one got on that plane just because they wanted to. Something/someone made sure they were all on that specific flight. BUT it kind of seems like Hurley and Jack weren't going to make it onto the plane but someone intervened at the last minute. There's something or someone extremely influential who made sure they were on the plane.

And I'm kind of liking the whole "libby was a recruiter too" theory. Can anyone else think of someone who could have been recruiting people to get on the plane?

Ok, let's really consider how many of the viewing audience is going to screen cap the pix to see if it's a good photoshop job or not. I'd wager about 3% will do like we've done and cap it. Most will simply pause and look and then continue on. It wasn't made to be picked apart. It was made to be seen for the few split seconds it is seen and to, hopefully, be noticed by the viewers (those that watch it and then let it go - which make up the majority of the audience). Now, if it had been a 4 foot by 5 foot photo, bill board, life-sized painting hanging on the wall and it looked like that then I'd say ... yep, terrible job. But it's an 8x10 photo on a desk that's seen for a few moments. What it IS is what's important, not how well or poorly it was crafted.

My 2 cents. :biggrin:

wow, good find. is there the possibility that it wasn't on the monk's desk when this event actually happened. Remember in FBYE, his flashback's are partly the true events of what happened, interspersed with things that occured after the flashback. Maybe this is the same thing. We are seeing the flashback through Desmond's eyes, but we have seen that his flashbacks are don't always make sense. OR, there is some really cool Desmond-must-follow-his-fate thing that proves that his destiny was laid out a long time ago.

Yeah, his FBs aren't like everyone else's. They're giving me a headache.

He just needs to hurry up and use his free will to choose...red pill or blue :biggrin:

Firstly, the Dharma Shark was probably a part of the Dharma tests on Hydra Island (remember the tank Jack was in?) And the Polar Bears and the Hurley Bird - same things.

Or, as the Second Season extra features DVD shows, it was just a production joke that they didn't think anyone would actually see.
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OK, here's my theory. Maybe they are metaphysical beings of some sort. It would seem like a really strange way to take the show, but how else would Ms. Hawking have insight into what was going to happen and furthermore what SHOULD happen to keep the universe in order? How would the monk now that Desmond had a truly higher calling? Why would Ms. Hawking and the monk be in a picture together? I think the game changer is that the Others are nothing compared to the people/beings we're about to come in contact with. Think the Beings of Light from the original Galactica, but evil. Furthermore, I would have totally geeked out if it had been Starbuck when they took off the pilots helmet! :D

I hope we can drop the bad photoshop job issue soon (;)), but I agree that it's not intentionally bad. They decided late in the game to include it. And come on guys, the photoshopping isn't bad at all! It's just that the source material didn't blend well b/c of the shadows. All it tells me is that they decided to put Mrs Hawking in the shot, and didn't feel the need or have the time to hire her for a day of work just to get a still of her and the Monk.

So I agree with everyone who has contended that the point here is that THEY ARE IN A PHOTO TOGETHER.

Me, I think we've now got a clear indication that there are people out there actively guiding Desmond towards a certain path. My wild stab in the dark is that they represent either Dharma (not the Others) or another group in opposition to the Others and are trying to fix something in the Time/Space coninuum that has been damaged by the implosion of the hatch. Either someone is trying to rewrite history and they are preventing it, or Desmond himself is unwittingly rewriting history and they are trying to prevent it.

Hmm this is conjuring up a theory for me... Let me think and I will come back and link to it...

The monk and Mrs. Hawking are both manifestations of the Island in the world. Dharma is duck soup compared to the metaphysical properties of this omniscient force of nature our castaways have found themselves on! :thumbsup:

lol, they just took a still from that flashes before your eyes episode and stuck it on.

perhaps it was created poorly for the purpose of getting our attention in the half second it's onscreen.

-Or- perhaps the woman (Mrs Hawkings) in the photo is not really in the photo at all but is a version of herself checking in, making sure of what happens to Desmond at this critical moment in his life.

I hope we can drop the bad photoshop job issue soon (;)), but I agree that it's not intentionally bad. They decided late in the game to include it. And come on guys, the photoshopping isn't bad at all! It's just that the source material didn't blend well b/c of the shadows. All it tells me is that they decided to put Mrs Hawking in the shot, and didn't feel the need or have the time to hire her for a day of work just to get a still of her and the Monk.

Ok look - here are the reasons why the photoshop issue was, in my opinion, most definitely intentional:

1. Yes actually it is a horrible photoshop job. To the naked eye it's pretty damn obvious (this should really be reason enough) i laughed at it the minute i saw it. They look like cardboard cut-outs!

2. Even if it was a decision that was "added in at the last minute" there are a million ways to quickly and easily have made it look like a genuine photograph.

3. Photoshop is an extremely common program these days. Even non-professionals who simply play around with it could have done better. Maybe not perfect but certainly better.

4. I'm sure a show that no doubt has a graphics team on board has a number of people who are quite adept at photoshop. So there's no excuse other than "it was intentional" behind the look of the photo.

Now WHY it was intentional? Beats me. haha. :)

:hesaid::shesaid:



I use my husband as a litmus test on this stuff. He's not into finding the easter eggs. He couldn't care less what Sawyer's book of the week is. (Wait, what was it?) (Actually, I think my spouse wants to have me put away for spending so much time here. ;) )

But when I got home from work, he was all excited about catching the photo -- which I missed on my portable TV, so I had no idea what he was talking about -- AND he pointed out what a lousy photo it was.

It HAS to mean something.

OK, here's my theory. Maybe they are metaphysical beings of some sort. It would seem like a really strange way to take the show, but how else would Ms. Hawking have insight into what was going to happen and furthermore what SHOULD happen to keep the universe in order? I agree, TPTB sent the story into pure supernatural territory with that first Hawkings appearance. Magical beings? Hmm. :frown:

Ok, so i'm with everyone on it being her. Also, with it being such a shabby job, what does that say about the writing on the show? did they intend on their being a picture in this episode? Or had they already shot the sceen and need to go back in and add it in because they see/saw a new plot twist? I'm thinking that after FBYE, and also while in mid edit of 22, they realized they had a new plot line that was taking off and they wanted to reinforce it through an easter egg. I'd be watchful in future Desmond associated flashbacks of seeing her "pop" up.

I wonder if Desmond has ever seen the picture?
.

Even if he did, he hadnt met the shopkeeper then. That's why it looks like "Monk" guided Desmond to Penny, and Mrs Hawkings guided Desmond to the Island and the failsafe.

Since we are on the topic of Mrs hawkings, are there any threads regarding who or what she is? I mean...a future seeing old lady outside the Island? Why pick on Desmond? Why him? Who told Mrs Hawkings to "guide" him? If there isnt a thread, a more experienced fuser could perhaps start one?

Another interesting aspect of this lady and this Monk is that they could well be part of the third group of Others, part of the original Dharma personel that made it off the Island before the incident or shortly after...We dont know if the monk can see the future, but It could explain the abilities she shares with Des. And they seem to work outside the Island.

So the monk and Mrs H knew that in order to stop what's happening on Gilligan's Island, they'd have to find and send a loner, a guy willing to wait and sacrifice his life to play it out until the failsafe key would be turned...What for??? What we saw fall out of the sky? The Islands protective shield/dome being shut down before sending some kind of re-enforcements? And was that Penny, or are there other people to come???

And some people (me included) thought Lost was losing it's direction...:biggrin: What an eppy! Is it next wednesday yet?

Ok, this poor photoshop issue is too much for me. LOL ::head spinning:: This coming from a show that swapped out the original Penny for a different Penny & changed her clothes with no explanation and that photo was clear, bright and held on for some time so that we'd notice it ... both times. This one was on the screen for a split second. We are "trained" (conditioned?) to look for these things even if we don't know it because we know they're in there ... somewhere. So our eyes are much, much, much more able to nit pick than the average Lost viewer (about 97% of those that watch). I do not, will not, cannot, believe that they did a poor job on the photo just for 3% of their audience. I think that's giving us way too much credit. They did it, it wasn't the best, but the reason it was there was not because it's a poor job but because they want us to see that Mrs. Hawking and the monk are connected ... to each other and to Desmond. Sometimes it's just what it looks like. This, I believe, is one of those times. It's just a connection to all three people for us that noticed the pix.

I return you now to your regularly scheduled debate. :)

Ok, this poor photoshop issue is too much for me. LOL ::head spinning:: This coming from a show that swapped out the original Penny for a different Penny & changed her clothes with no explanation and that photo was clear, bright and held on for some time so that we'd notice it ... both times.
Actually they did explain the Penny swap.
Here's the answer from Gregg Nations. (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?p=1052087#post1052087)

You're welcome! :smile:

Even if he did, he hadnt met the shopkeeper then...

Yeah, that didn't hit me until after I posted. Now I can look back and ask "What's the lady from Brother Campbell's desk doing in the jewelry shop?" (silly, but it helps me keep the timeline straight)

Since we are on the topic of Mrs hawkings, are there any threads regarding who or what she is?

She's the Oracle, of course :)

I guess I don't remember FBYE well enough. Did we learn her name in that epi? Is it Hawking as in Stephen Hawking?

I guess I don't remember FBYE well enough. Did we learn her name in that epi? Is it Hawking as in Stephen Hawking?

It is Hawking; not sure if she told us as much in FBYE or we got that from the credits.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Ms._Hawking

I THOUGHT it was her! I just wasn't sure. It seemed to me like the camera panned over that picture frame for a few seconds... Clearly not a coincidence. That's awesome.

They did it, it wasn't the best, but the reason it was there was not because it's a poor job but because they want us to see that Mrs. Hawking and the monk are connected ... to each other and to Desmond. Sometimes it's just what it looks like. This, I believe, is one of those times. It's just a connection to all three people for us that noticed the pix.

I return you now to your regularly scheduled debate. :)

totally !

has anyone mentiond that the monk said ' i stand corrected' early in the episode when talking about desmond's attitude and the vow of silence. ?

don't forget that, as explained in the thread about the whispers, a voice can be heard while Desmond tosses the ring into the river (Episode FBYE).. and the voice almost clearly says THE FUTURE IS SETTLED..

here's the link with the audio files
http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showpost.php?p=1396477&postcount=1246

This was a very complex episode to film, with all that location work in the jungle and on the beach, plus hanging up the parachutist. They are going to spend the minimum amount of time putting together Mrs. Hawking--long gone from Hawaii and not available for any new shots--and Brother Andrew in a picture to be flashed on the screen. It reads perfectly fine there, sufficient that a large number of people recognized her. That's all they needed.

Only a few hundred of their 11.7 milliion viewers are going to pore over a screen cap to notice that it's lousy photoshopping--heck, ABC puts out group publicity photos that are done just as badly. This isn't ILM having months of post-production on a Lucas-Spielberg epic. I suppose some of you think the special effects on Smokey being so lousy are trying to tell us something too?

Cardie

That picture looks so fake though!

Poor Photoshop for sure, but the idea was probably to throw out the clue because if it was uber realistic then people probably wouldn't have picked up on it, or spent ages going 'that photo on the desk...you think it was....etc, etc' for about 12 pages, where as here, we know after a page ;)

Even if he did, he hadnt met the shopkeeper then. That's why it looks like "Monk" guided Desmond to Penny, and Mrs Hawkings guided Desmond to the Island and the failsafe.

There’s a lot more than just "guiding" going on here. Des knows Ruth for 6 years and just before the wedding the Brother takes Desmond's hand to help him to his feet. As soon as flesh meets flesh Des suddenly “knows” he is destined for something else and promptly dumps Ruth. Doesn’t that sound a bit fishy to you? After a while the Brother “fires” Des – apparently he is not destined to be a Brother after all and the day Des leaves the Brother arranges for him to meet Penny. Hawking then prevents Des from marrying Penny setting him up to go to the island and use the failsafe key.

And Des believes it is because he is a coward, because he keeps running away when in reality people or forces are playing with his mind and shaping his life so subtly that Des does not even realize he is being led to the island and the button. Des does not have free will.


But is this a test? Will the Universe course correct and bring Penny back to him? Is Widmore himself one of the Brother’s and Hawking’s cronies? On Widmore’s desk somewhere is there a picture of the Brother?

I think there are a huge number of people out there guiding the island inhabitants to the island, and shaping their lives well before that. Whether they are some huge international conspiracy or agents of a supernatural power remain to be seen.

Cardie

I think that it's def no coincidence that we are seeing all the people that have led Des to the island and his destiny with the key. So far the connects I can figure are Penny, Penny's dad, Libby, the monk, and possibly the ring lady. He ran into Jack, but I think that was actually more of a coincidence than anything -- I don't see anything in their meeting that would have led him to the island. What I'm curious about, is what part Penny has left to play.

I was really tipped off by the fact that the monk told Desmond,, "God has other plans for you..." is the ring lady God? Ben said in one episode something to effect of, God can't see this island... And someone mentioned something about Desmond not having free will -- but Desmond hasn't been forced into anything. He has always had to make a choice, and this is especially key regarding saving Charlie. Desmond was dead set against saving him this time, but couldn't follow through with it at the last second. He couldn't sacrifice Charlie (trust that whatever should be will be), and therefore, in my opinion, never recieves a blessing (reuniting with Penny).

it reminds me of the screen that gets pulled down behind des and penny the way its photoshopped.

All I can say is, how the heck did you guys pick up on that photo in the 2 seconds it was in the foreground?? That's amazing. Of course I watched the scene again and saw it now that I knew what to look for.

All I can say is, how the heck did you guys pick up on that photo in the 2 seconds it was in the foreground?? That's amazing. Of course I watched the scene again and saw it now that I knew what to look for.

I didn't notice until they showed it a 2nd time in a close up (when Desmond's laying his robes on Brother Campbell's desk). My first thought was "they want us to see that".

All I can say is, how the heck did you guys pick up on that photo in the 2 seconds it was in the foreground?? That's amazing. Of course I watched the scene again and saw it now that I knew what to look for.

I watch lost on a 112" screen. It kinds jumps out at you at that size. :)
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Man, I'm really disappointed that no one picked up on my geeky riffing on Lost and Battlestar Galactica. :)

totally !

has anyone mentiond that the monk said ' i stand corrected' early in the episode when talking about desmond's attitude and the vow of silence. ?

Please refresh my memory as to the significance of his remark. I had a feeling I'd heard something similar but I can't place it. The whole relationship between Des and the Monk really creeped me out to begin with - because he essentially kidnapped him off the street!

Looking at the picture closely through a few of the higher res photos I've seen it looks as though Mrs. Hawkins belongs in the picture, but our "brother" does not. It almost appears as if he has cut himself out of a photo and placed it accordingly into the original photo. What does this mean...I have no idea, but it could be worth noting.

All I can say is, how the heck did you guys pick up on that photo in the 2 seconds it was in the foreground?? That's amazing. Of course I watched the scene again and saw it now that I knew what to look for.

I have a 27 inch, low def and I saw it immediately! So many people knocked the Lost Photoshop artist, but if it wasnt for his obviously deliberate bad photoshopping, the 2 faces wouldnt have popped out to me like they did! I swear, I saw them in 3-D!!!

So if this "artist" ever reads this thread, thumbs up on the pic! :biggrin:
Keep up the bad work...:rotflmao2:

wow, great catch. I thought it looked curious when I saw it.

how do we know he's her son? he could have been her lover.

wouldnt that get him kicked out of the monestary? he should be an ex-monk by now!

I noticed that Brother Campbell had a sense of Desmond's future just as
Ms. Hawking did, but he was not as forthright.

I am betting that Brother Campbell and Ms. Hawking are mother and son
or are related in some way, or she is a very important benefactor of the
monastery. At least important enough to be in a photograph on his desk.

Yes terrible photoshop :biggrin: but it was totally there for a reason.

What is that reason? Is the obvious fakery a clue as to the true nature of the flashbacks? Are they actually false implanted memory and are these strange correlations that we see in them a glitch of some sort? Why would a monk in habit be photographed in the courtyard of his monastery with Mrs Hawking anyhow? Unless she's his mother maybe? There's a big unifying explanation to reconcile all this stuff but we are only offered fleeting clues to it. Tantalising,innit?

I was leaning towards her being his mother or an aunt.

I watch lost on a 112" screen. It kinds jumps out at you at that size. :)
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Man, I'm really disappointed that no one picked up on my geeky riffing on Lost and Battlestar Galactica. :)
Front Projection? I love how KATE jump out of the screen at that size!:biggrin:

hmmm? You know the way, Mrs Hawking told Desmond not to marry Penny and not to buy the ring. with me? yes well, The brother did the same thing. He fired Desmond as if it was what he had to do to meet penny because if Brother Campbell never fired Desmond he would have never lifted the crats into pennys car and he would never had met her. Libby also did the same thing. She gave a total stranger her dead husbands boat! All she did was buy him a coffee and then she gives her boat away!!

Anyway, Lets say, Desmond was to see another picture. Would Mrs Hawking, Brother Campbell and Libby be in that picture?? sorry if it doesnt make sence, I typed it pretty fast!!

does know one remember Libby in desmonds first flashback?! I think Mrs. Hawking, the monk AND Libby all had a hand in getting Desmond to the island. I wouldnt be surprised if all of them were working together to make sure Desmond was at the right places at the right times to go to the island. It will be interesting to see how they are all connected which they obviously all are.

I wish Lost could have let Libby and Desmond meet on the island:undecide: I'd love to see Desmond's face if he was to see her!!!!:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

That picture looks so fake though!

I know. I do photoshopping and they should fire whoever did that.

The courtyard background in the Ms. Hawkins photo looks just like the courtyard Charlie and his brother Liam walked through in the flashback from the episode The Moth.

He probably didn't have a legit photo about them two being together, so he created one himself by clipping two photos, and then added some background. It's clearly fake it's obvious that it's not legit.

The monk and the shop lady both guided desmond to find his way in life (to get to the island) and that is not a coincidence. I believe they are Des' parents.

So the monk and Mrs H knew that in order to stop what's happening on Gilligan's Island, they'd have to find and send a loner, a guy willing to wait and sacrifice his life to play it out until the failsafe key would be turned...What for??? What we saw fall out of the sky? The Islands protective shield/dome being shut down before sending some kind of re-enforcements? And was that Penny, or are there other people to come???


This made me think of something. Desmond does not have a commitment problem. If the monk was recruiting him (and that's a big if IMO), then the vow of silence might be a test to see if he could stick with something for a long time. When Desmond gets his robes the father makes it sound like Desmond broke a record with his test. Desmond was also very committed to entering the around the world race. On the island Desmond kept pushing the button for three years even though he had his doubts. I don't know the whole story behind Desmond and his first fiancée, but I wouldn't be surprised to learn that someone talked him into leaving that relationship as well.

I think that the posts are supposed to look like a bad photoshop job. That's the second image that they've shown us that have been obviously and poorly manipulated.

I'm not exactly sure why, but my thought is that these images are "out of step" with reality and the "bad photoshop" is not really meant to show off poor photoshop skills, but rather to draw attention to the fact that these images/mementos look altered and out of place.

I don't think that these are purposeful clues, but rather discordant notes in someone's memory where something is just below the surface and you can't quite grasp it...but its coming.

Geez...Photoshop much? That is horrible....But now comes the next obvious "mystery"...was the obvious "fakeness" of the picture a horrible job by the prop department?....or does it look fake on purpose for reasons to be explained later on the show?

My guess is it was a quickly thrown together prop malfunction. It looks like they had a hi-rez pic taken of the padre....but they used a low-rez screen cap or wardrobe continuity photo for Mrs. Hawking. And that background looks totally hokey.

In the production team's defense, the pic looked FINE on my TV screen...and I even kinda thought the woman looked like Mrs. Hawking...but that screen cap provided earlier def proves it. It's not til we get here...when these prop pics are blown up to enormous sizes does the illusion fall apart.

I really wonder if it was an intentional style decision by the prop department, because back in Not In Portland, when Alpert is showing Juliette the supposed pictures of the Mittelos Research Campus in his powerpoint presentation, the people that are shown to be happily employed walking around are also very obviously photoshopped in as well. Here's what I mean: http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x07-portland/2/3x08-portland435.jpg
At least they are consistent!

Man, I'm really disappointed that no one picked up on my geeky riffing on Lost and Battlestar Galactica. :)

Well, I just read this thread now and when I read your BSG post, all I could think was **OMFG Starbuck on Lost!!!** That would've made the wait until 2008 a little easier to bear!

This original post below is from a closed thread!


BY:Josette[/URL] (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/member.php?u=57410)
Not sure if this was mentioned anywhere else, but the background of the photo on the Monks desk with him & Ms. Hawkings in it is the same church yard where Charlie & his brother Liam have their fateful "if it gets to crazy" conversation in THE MOTH. If I'm wrong please correct me but, heres Charlie & Liam...

[URL]http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage-62-135.html

and heres the monks pic

http://gallery.lost-media.com/displa...-1284-786.html (http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage-1284-786.html)

I'd like to add that this is the same location where Desmond meets Penny.

Ooooo interesting reminder TK 421.....

I noticed this to, and its definatly her in the picture. Which means does the guy know whats going to happen to Desmond in the future and that he'll end up falling for Penny and end up on the island?

quite well, thank you.

hmmm? You know the way, Mrs Hawking told Desmond not to marry Penny and not to buy the ring. with me? yes well, The brother did the same thing. He fired Desmond as if it was what he had to do to meet penny because if Brother Campbell never fired Desmond he would have never lifted the crats into pennys car and he would never had met her. Libby also did the same thing. She gave a total stranger her dead husbands boat! All she did was buy him a coffee and then she gives her boat away!!

Anyway, Lets say, Desmond was to see another picture. Would Mrs Hawking, Brother Campbell and Libby be in that picture?? sorry if it doesnt make sence, I typed it pretty fast!!

I, too, thought it was interesting that Mrs. Hawking told Des not to buy the ring, and then we have Bro Campbell firing Des, which is how he ended up meeting Penny, or at least being able to take off with her. Since it seems that Bro Campbell is in cahoots with Mrs, Hawking somehow (because of the photo on the desk) it seems possible that he was meant to meet Penny, but maybe it wasn't part of the "plan" that they actually fall in love.

Also, (maybe someone has already meantioned this) I think that it's possible that Bro Campbell helped to cause Des to be in the street, so that he could be there when Des woke up. There's something fishy about that monk. I've never seen a Catholic cross like the one Bro Campbell was wearing...it was kind of freaky-looking. And the bible on the desk was not Catholic, but Protestant. Who knows, maybe it was an Episcopalian monastery.

I have a 27 inch, low def and I saw it immediately! So many people knocked the Lost Photoshop artist, but if it wasnt for his obviously deliberate bad photoshopping, the 2 faces wouldnt have popped out to me like they did! I swear, I saw them in 3-D!!!

So if this "artist" ever reads this thread, thumbs up on the pic! :biggrin:
Keep up the bad work...:rotflmao2:

I saw them move. :ermm: but then that's par for the course in Des flashes.

Des did glance at the desk photo (I think - I'll have to re-watch) so his other flash featuring Mrs Hawking may be a muddlement of his mind, rather than an indication of a possible alternate/parallel life.

Which would explain the Abbott taking a photo like a mug shot ...it is a mug shot. Des and his mentor may have met in prison - Des's room at the monastery would have been called his 'cell'.

I regocnised lady in the instant she appeared - I'd seen her in an episode of Murder She Wrote ...:blush: I was putting in some miles on the exercise bike and the tv was on for company ok? lol ;) only a few hours before, but would have recognised her anyway - she's beautiful.

Her pose, smiling, indulgent ...does look maternal - but sister works for me too - but what we're seeing here I think, is the Abbott's desire for warmth and approval.

That would be why it looks so obviously faked - so the hard core, freeze frame brigade, get to play silly buggers ...and the rest of LOST's viewers get the subliminal treatment and a sense of discomforture.

I look forward to being proved wrong on ALL counts. :D

~ ETA: Abbott, Brother Campbell ....I haven't even taken in his name :rolleyes: Duh! ~