Wondering if he knows that it will help Juliette get off the Island? (successful pregnancy = her work is done and Ben lets her go) Maybe Jack and Juliette are in on something together?

or, another thought...

What if it's not really Jack? Is an Other (ala a twin, clone etc) with bad motives?

P.S. Speaking of Jack....I wonder if we'll see him find out that Claire is his sister this season? And even better...if we'll see his dad show up on the island?

I think Jack is worried about Sun. That is why he asked. Not bad intentions, not bad twin nor a clone. He is a doctor, and he knows about the island not doing good to pregnant woman. I think he figured that out by now with all the stuff happend to Claire and Juliet's job, kidnapping children etc.

It's Jack, and he was curious because he doesn't want Sun to die. As Kate told Sun, only she and Jack know about the maternal casualties on the island.

I'll go along with the general consensus that he was asking because you know...he's a Doctor and stuff. :biggrin:

I'll go along with the general consensus that he was asking because you know...he's a Doctor and stuff. :biggrin:

Yup. For crying out loud, Sun, he's a doctor and is asking typical doctor check-up questions. The kind they ask at every prenatal visit and more.

Actually I think it speaks well of Jack that he sought out Sun without Juliet, who would be the logical choice to do a prenatal exam. It showed that same old Dr. Jack was back and hadn't been completely taken over by the Others. Unfortunately Sun is probably a little paranoid what with the previous baby-napping and let her imagination run wild.

As a doctor he should be asking about her pregnancy but he does seem off. There is something up with him. I don't trust him anymore.

I still trust Jack. I think he was asking in light of what he learned from Juliet in "One of Us." I think hes just concerned about Sun, and being a typical doctor.

I think the writers are trying to make Jack look suspicious, but it's absolutely normal to want to ask some questions about her pregnancy. the thing is, we are supposed to be wondering as to whether Jack is helping Juliet or not. My answer to this is always no, he doesn't know what she's up to.

I can understand why sun would be hesitant in trustin Jack. Michael spent a lot less time with the Others & look what he did when he came back.

At the same time tho, I don't think Jack's working with them/knows what Juliet is up to. I only say it b/c of the conversation Ben & Juliet had before they left their homes. somethin like "tell Jack you can save her & he'll let you help her". Obviously if Jack was involved, she wouldn't have had to convince him to help Claire.

Jack was just being typical Jack, he was concerned for Sun and the baby. I can't see how anyone would think that by him asking how she's been feeling could be a bad thing. He never once told her to trust or to go see Juliet instead.

Yup. For crying out loud, Sun, he's a doctor and is asking typical doctor check-up questions. The kind they ask at every prenatal visit and more.

Actually I think it speaks well of Jack that he sought out Sun without Juliet, who would be the logical choice to do a prenatal exam. It showed that same old Dr. Jack was back and hadn't been completely taken over by the Others. Unfortunately Sun is probably a little paranoid what with the previous baby-napping and let her imagination run wild.

I can certainly understand Sun's suspicions at the time. With the Others' history of baby-napping, and Jack's admission that he had made a deal with the Others to get off the island, she might pause and wonder if he's made any other deals he's not telling them about. And at the time Jack visited her garden, she didn't have the context of knowing about the risks to pregnant women on the island.

What I don't understand is why Jack and Kate both seemed to think they should keep Sun in the dark about those risks. I would think she had a right to knoe. So I'm a little mystified about their secrecy.

I think the writers are trying to make Jack look suspicious, but it's absolutely normal to want to ask some questions about her pregnancy. the thing is, we are supposed to be wondering as to whether Jack is helping Juliet or not. My answer to this is always no, he doesn't know what she's up to.

I agree with you.

Did anyone else flash back to Ethan when Jack came upon Sun in her garden? TPTB are trying to make it clear that Sun is suspicious of Jack. I don't think she has reason to be but I can understand why she would. I imagine everyone might have reason to be suspicious of anyone else who's spent a considerable amount of time with The Others (especially one who brought back an Other when he returned), especially after what happened with Michael.

What scares me most, however, is that, like when Ana Lucia killed Shannon, fear is a powerful motivator. I'm worried about the fate of some innocent bystanders coming up.

<<not Jack, not Jack, not Jack:fear3:>>

I see TPTB giving us lots of reasons to be paranoid every week. This is just another prime example. And I'm sure the actors and episode directors are in on it too. Mathew Fox is smart enough to understand if he plays the scene with a bit of ambiguity rather than super sweet season 1 jack, we the audience will have more to think about and simmer over. Juliet is probably the best at this so far, because of her dual loyalties at this point. Every look out of that damn woman can be re-analyzed for ages. The actress knows this because her character is supposed to be mysterious. It's not Hurley we're talking about, where he wears his emotions and motivations on his sleeve. I love Hurley to death, but he's a more simple character in terms of reading into his facial expressions, his readings of certain lines, etc. Jack, Juliet, Ben, Locke, these are all characters who are constantly on the fence and toeing the line as far as good and evil, right and wrong, etc. The actors are smartly portraying them in that light.

Jack is complicated, and Mathew played the scene that way. It would cheapen Jack's character if he was forever ubergood and cheery. And I'd be surprised to find out he had any negative motivations towards Sun in that scene.

Ofcourse only time will tell.

I too have felt suspicious of Jack's motives for the last few weeks, but I have this feeling that the general aura of mistrust of Jack will eventually prove to be entirely unwarranted, but not until after everyone has turned on him and we eventually find out he only had their best interests at heart this whole time.

Since Jack has returned to the beach, there seems to be a calmness to his personality. I am wondering if Ben turned Jack into an Other?

I think Jack has been mostly cordial to the beachies since his return, and it surprises me how many people think his acting wierd (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=76977) and suspicious. Maybe we're all grown use to Angry Dictator Jack of season 2.

I agree with Baby...
What convinced me that he's still on the Losties team is the way Juliet reacted to finding out Sun was preggos. She really looked surprised. If Jack was completely invested in Juliet he would have let her know earlier.

And for a quick side note, if they didn't know about Sun, does Ben know that Rose was cured?

Jack was being just Jack: concerned. However, his questions were numerous and pointed, as though he had something specific on his mind. This is what caused Sun's alarm. I don't blame her, since she knew about the Others' keen interest in pregnant women.

I think Jack is worried about Sun. That is why he asked. Not bad intentions, not bad twin nor a clone. He is a doctor, and he knows about the island not doing good to pregnant woman. I think he figured that out by now with all the stuff happend to Claire and Juliet's job, kidnapping children etc.

I agree.
I think the scenarists wants us to doubt about him...but i'm not so sure he's been compromised...i think he really likes Juliet but not completely trust her so he goes to Sun and ask her if it's ok...
Remember in Whatever the case maybe he liked kate a lot but she didn't fool him...with the key in his hand. Same with Juliet and claire sickness...he told her she's on her own if something bad happens to Claire...

my only problem with him is that in "left behind" he slept one more day than kate...and i remember Tom telling him there were cameras in the room where kate was...

I can certainly understand Sun's suspicions at the time. With the Others' history of baby-napping, and Jack's admission that he had made a deal with the Others to get off the island, she might pause and wonder if he's made any other deals he's not telling them about. And at the time Jack visited her garden, she didn't have the context of knowing about the risks to pregnant women on the island.

What I don't understand is why Jack and Kate both seemed to think they should keep Sun in the dark about those risks. I would think she had a right to knoe. So I'm a little mystified about their secrecy.

Not just Sun - but every other woman on the beach as well, and I mean, *before* they went to bed that night, not after. It seems to me that would have been a #1 priority as soon as that information came out.

It was extremely disturbing that Sun didn't know.

Also, re: "trusting Jack" - the way that scene was filmed, it seemed clear that something menacing was about to happen. I understand character love and character shields, but Jack's behavior with Sun was odd and intrusive. Nor did he feel any responsibility, apparently, to tell her at that time what was going on - instead, he just interrogated her. So something menacing *did* happen - the menace being in what he *didn't* say.

I think that Jack was just being a good friend/doctor.

However, the writers wanted to convey to us that Sun was doubting Jack.

period.

I love Hurley to death, but he's a more simple character in terms of reading into his facial expressions, his readings of certain lines, etc.

Yeah....just like Verbal Kint wore his emotions on his sleeve...until he revealed himself to be Keyser Soze at the end of The Usual Suspects....Not saying Hurley will turn out to be "evil"...or "Jacob"....for that matter....I'm just saying...with Lost...The truth is always in the last place you look.

Jack was being just Jack: concerned. However, his questions were numerous and pointed, as though he had something specific on his mind. This is what caused Sun's alarm. I don't blame her, since she knew about the Others' keen interest in pregnant women.

It was an obvious tip of the hat to us, the home viewers, to say what we're all thinkin..."Jack is not acting right". When the writers are hitting us over the head with something like this, expect a surprise. That's what I've learned watching the show.


And for a quick side note, if they didn't know about Sun, does Ben know that Rose was cured?


I'm goin with Ben Knows EVERYTHING...until I see/hear other-wise. We don't know what Ben said to Jack BEFORE the knock out gas cannisters hit the Losties back at Othersville.

Is it possible Jack was only pretending to be laying in that hallway KO'd a FULL DAY after Kate woke up? He could have made a deal with Ben...perhaps a conversation will be revealed, such as this...

"Look, Jack. We know Sun is pregnant...we need to send Juliette to check on her...her babies health is of utmost importance to us. Here's what yer gonna do....take Juliette back to camp with you."...Ben says hypothetically.

"They'll NEVER accept her...she's one of you"!!, Jack responds indignantly.

"Let me worry about that....they WILL accept her...I've rigged Claire with a time release drug...that only Juliette will be able to reverse. Once she "fixes" Claire...it will be less difficult for her to get close to Sun"...says hypothetical Ben.

"Fine...what do I get?" Jack sneers (hypothetically).

"There's another way off the island...a TOP SECRET way off....and if you do as I say...I give you my word, Jack, I will send you home"...yada yada yada.

BUT HERE'S THE KICKER...

Jack is only "pretending" to be going along with Ben's plan. "Keep your friends close...and your enemies closer..."...only Jack is takin it a step further....in appearing to alienate his friends, while he keeps his enemies closer. I firmly believe Jack IS involved in a plan with Ben...However, I think his "plan" is to double cross Ben the first chance he gets. The second Ben gets caught with his pants down...the Jack we know and love...will return....in a BIG way. Unfortunately, I think he will be forced into a huge battle with some of our favorite Losties (Sawyer, Locke, etc) BEFORE he can reveal his true intentions as to why he seems to be "cooperating" with the Others.

Look...it's a Lose/Lose for Jack...last time he told his "friends" he was only reason he was workin with the Others was to get a free sub ride home...and for that, he gets betrayed by Locke when he selfishly sabotages the sub by blowin it up. I think THIS time...Jack is keeping his Other "inside information" to himself...at the risk of alienating the rest of the Losties. Not unlike how Michael was used by the Others to free Ben from the Swan hatch.

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist. And poof. Just like that, he's gone.

"Look, Jack. We know Sun is pregnant...we need to send Juliette to check on her...her babies health is of utmost importance to us. Here's what yer gonna do....take Juliette back to camp with you."...Ben says hypothetically.

"They'll NEVER accept her...she's one of you"!!, Jack responds indignantly.

"Let me worry about that....they WILL accept her...I've rigged Claire with a time release drug...that only Juliette will be able to reverse. Once she "fixes" Claire...it will be less difficult for her to get close to Sun"...says hypothetical Ben.

"Fine...what do I get?" Jack sneers (hypothetically).

"There's another way off the island...a TOP SECRET way off....and if you do as I say...I give you my word, Jack, I will send you home"...yada yada yada.

Then why did Ben tell Juliet to con Jack with the Claire "crisis" and tell him she can save her? He even invoked Jack's trust in Juliet. Why tell her that if Jack already knows the Claire crisis is a sham?

That conversation among many, many other things makes me believe Jack is in no way involved in this plan to collect data on the women. It just doesn't make sense. If anything, I believe Ben thinks Juliet can use him as a pawn and Juliet feels bad about it. But just a tiny bit.

I firmly believe Jack IS involved in a plan with Ben...However, I think his "plan" is to double cross Ben the first chance he gets.

If you replace Jack with Juliet, I completely agree. :smile: I didn't need to hear her say she hates him... that scene where she almost kicks his *** in the kitchen told me all I need to know.

Jack has not been acting weird in any way. The weirdest thing he's done is ask them to trust Juliet unconditionally (aside from that... he hasn't done much at all, except be concerned about losties, be polite and even friendly with them, be happy to see Hurley, Charlie and his nephew... er... I mean Aaron) and I'm waiting to see the what exactly is behind that because he sure seemed confused as to WHY they left her behind. (He asks that outloud in LB). Maybe he still wants to know. Maybe his interest in Sun's pregnancy is twofold: to make sure she's OK and to crossreference what Juliet told him about Claire's "symptoms" and why they did what they did to her.

I'm just going to quote a friend again:

"Everyone keeps saying how Jack is being weird. But really - apart from bringing Juliet back, what has he done? He's been nice to everyone, is already taking care of everyone (Claire, Sun, asking about Hurley when he was acting strange), is being kind to Kate and to Sawyer even after what they did, and asserted his opinions in the same way he always has. How is he being unlike himself? Even the way he is hanging out with Juliet is the exact same way he hung out with Ana Lucia when she first arrived."

Now granted, Ana Lucia wasn't an Other (though she still killed one of them), but aside from Jack asking them to trust Juliet, I have to agree there and say I don't understand what's so "different" about Jack.

I agree that the only way this story is going to make sense and be a continuation of mindcluck fiesta is if they turn their back on Jack and he lets it happen for a reason. I don't believe for a moment that he trusts Juliet unconditionally, but I don't think he has a master plan either. He had about two minutes to figure out what to do from the moment he was totally confused about Juliet being left behind to the moment he said "Because they left her behind too." Maybe that's just it. He wants to know why. If it turns out she's truly one of them, excellent. If not, what better way to find out? They're sitting ducks for the Others anyway, not bringing one into camp won't change the power dynamics in any significant way, except it gives them an opportunity to find out what they're after. When has an Other ever answered a question truthfully and unequivocally? So perhaps this is the best way to find out what they're after.

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist. And poof. Just like that, he's gone.

Hehe. Now that was a great, great movie.

Then why did Ben tell Juliet to con Jack with the Claire "crisis" and tell him she can save her? He even invoked Jack's trust in Juliet. Why tell her that if Jack already knows the Claire crisis is a sham?


Cuz Ben is playing them both? I'm just saying...is it possible Ben had a "secret" meeting with Jack...right after his secret meeting with Juliette where they "went over her plan"? perhaps Ben said he no longer trusts Juliette...and Jack is watching her closely to make sure she does EXACTLY what he wants her to do...that is...save Sun AND her baby.

That conversation among many, many other things makes me believe Jack is in no way involved in this plan to collect data on the women.

I never said he was. I think he was askin Sun all those questions in her garden as a doctor and friend concerned about her safety. Period. It just came off as "awkward" because Sun (along with us) has her suspicions about Jacks intentions. The writers WANT that suspicion there...for a reason.

If you replace Jack with Juliet, I completely agree. :smile: I didn't need to hear her say she hates him... that scene where she almost kicks his *** in the kitchen told me all I need to know.


All true...which is EXACTLY why Ben needs Jack to make sure Juliette is carrying out his plan. But I think Jack is only doing so...so he can doublecross Ben when the time is right...and get, not only himself...but also Juliette and the rest of the Losties off the island.

Jack has not been acting weird in any way. The weirdest thing he's done is ask them to trust Juliet unconditionally

Ok...walking back to the beach...Jack verbally chastizes Sayid..."Enough with the questions...Let her be...She's under MY protection!"...Like he's Tony frickin' Soprano or something. That was the clue phone ringing the first time that Jack is acting "out of character"...Sure, Sayid & Jack haven't always seen eye to eye, disagreeing somewhat on how to handle Ben, back when he was Henry Gale in the hatch. But that line of dialoge...especially to Sayid, whom he trusted when trying to get Michael to admit he had a hand in Ben's escape...was overtly hostile, and seemed to conotate to me that Jack has ulterior motives with regard to keeping harmony between Juliette and the other Losties...allowing her to be accepted into the group more freely. Using the "trust" they have in him as their long, lost leader to his advantage....something the OLD Jack would never do.

Some would say his ambivilance towards Kate...both back at the house when he "woke up"...and again when they stumbled across each other awkwardly back at the beach kitchen was another good indication that he was acting "weird". Not because he knows that she & Sawyer hooked up...and he was "moving on"...I think Jack is torn up by that fact...but part of the ruse (con) he's keeping up with Ben has to do with him appearing "available" to Juliette...and Juliette alone. (Remember her "He's hot" line to Ben in Expose as they watched Jack from the Pearl?). Also, it allows him to be even closer to the enemy, by shunning Kate, to have oatmeal with Juliette.

Maybe that's just it. He wants to know why. If it turns out she's truly one of them, excellent. If not, what better way to find out? They're sitting ducks for the Others anyway, not bringing one into camp won't change the power dynamics in any significant way, except it gives them an opportunity to find out what they're after. When has an Other ever answered a question truthfully and unequivocally? So perhaps this is the best way to find out what they're after.


You just summed up my theory beautifully.

You think you can catch Keyser Soze? You think a guy like that comes this close to getting caught, and sticks his head out? If he comes up for anything it'll be to get rid of me. After that... my guess is you'll never hear from him again.