Didn't like the ep? Tell us why. :biggrin:






This thread is for those that did NOT like the episode. If you liked the ep please visit the "Loved it!!!" thread. If you want to debate the episode (likes and dislikes), then please take your comments to the "Rate The Episode" thread or The "Discuss The Episode" thread. Any off topic posts will be deleted and possibly warned or given infraction points.

terrible ending. Season 1 finale still tops. But still a good epi/

But,

Still better than any other shows season finale.

I just always expect so much from LOST.

I hate that we have to wait months for new epi's!

So the stupid dynamite plan turned out to be, well, stupid.


When Friendly threatened to shoot Jin, why did Bernard tell the truth about the radio tower? Why not send them far away from the tower? They had no way of knowing what was true.


Just wondering, why is it these morons never bothered to follow the ocean cable when they found it in season 1? Desmond looked down from the raft and could see the station. That might have been something I would have checked out months eariler.


Charlie. Good riddance. Don't care. What an amazing(ly contrived) coincidence that the code was programmed by a musician and Charlie just happens to be, that's right, a musician!

Why didn't he go OUTSIDE the door and then close it? Watch it again. He had time and could have done it even with Desmond approaching. Furthermore, he didn't even try to escape through the porthole Mikhail blew open.

Also, why did Mikhail go outside in the water to pull the grenade? It makes no sense (other than to contrivingly set up Charlie for his big heroic death scene). Mikhail should have simply thrown the grenade into the room where Charlie was. Yet inexplicibly, Mikhail takes a harpoon to the chest and then somehow, and for some reason, manages to put on some gear and swim outside to pull the grenade? Yeah, OK.


Alex to Ben: Why do you have to stop them? Why don't you just let them leave?
Ben's typical non-answer: Because I can't Alex.


Jack tells Kate he loves her right after he lets Juliet look deep into his heroic eyes and kiss him on the lips. Yeah, OK.


Walt, I mean WAAAALLLLLT!, has "mysteriously aged" in a couple months. And what was with his voice? Uh. Also, his appearance wasn't much of a surprise considering his name was in the opening credits. Way to go TBTP!


Hurley playing Mad Max with the bus? Kind of silly looking. Did anyone think Hurley wasn't going to show up to save the day after the obvious set up with Sawyer putting him down and telling him not to come? Telling someone not to come on Lost is a sure sign that person will eventually show up.


Jack confronts Ben at the Radio Tower (that no one bothered to try and find for 3 seasons) and Kate, who must be part bloodhound, somehow deduces in a minute that there are only two sets of tracks. Incredible!


If it's SO IMPORTANT for Ben to stop Jack from contacting the ship, why doesn't he come clean with what's really going on with the island? If everyone is going to die and the island's purpose ruined, why doesn't he spill his guts to convince Jack what he's saying is true. Isn't that the time to put your cards on the table and quit being mysterious?

Furthermore, what was the big hurry to make a decision when Jack and Ben talked at the tower? Why didn't Jack suggest they confront Naomi with Ben's info? Why not TRY to manipulate or con her in some way to ATTEMPT to see if she is who she says she is? If there's a EVEN A CHANCE that she's lying and everyone's lives are in danger, why not make sure you're doing the right thing? Afterall, there was NO HURRY. Jack didn't suggest anything. Ben, the master manipulator, con-artist and evil genius, didn't suggest anything.


So we're flashing forward? Kind of like the other show JJ screwed up: Alias. Get an original idea JJ. Flashing forward is when you messed up Alias remember?

Jack and Kate are off the island? I'm not sure I really care. More importantly, I'm not sure enough viewers care enough to wait until February 2008 to get back into the show.

Lost won't make it another 3 years and 48 episodes. The ratings will continue to fall as they have since season 2. Now that some of the characters are off of the island, a big part of the show's mystery is GONE.

People who never watched Lost are going to hear that characters got off the island. Why would they be interested in jumping into Lost at this point? Lost can only lose viewers from here.

Didn't like the ending, not a big finale cliffhanger to me. Didn't like flash forward. Also had problems with the hatch events, Mikhail getting out, why Charlie didn't have Desmond put on his gear, then open the door & share oxygen like we see in so many movies. Eh, Eh, Eh. Predictable we saw Walt in the finale & that Locke was alive. We knew Danielle was her mother. Surprised Naomi was a spy & that's about it. I have never complained about this show, but there's not much to hang on to until January. Oh, except who was in the coffin. Does it really matter? I'm sure that future doesn't happen anyway. Sorry guys, a letdown for me. Or maybe I just didn't get it.

Only goos parts:

Rose; Jack if you say live together die alone to me im gunna punch you in your face <EXCELLENT>

Jacket Kiss = Skate

Hurley Kills Danny

Otherwise it was worst finale ever! im so disappointed and the fact that the spoiler from lostfan108 was right is mind boggling.'


Soo sucky

It was just a let down IMO

I'm not that excited about the return, not like i thought i would be.

I'm not antsy to see it, its like... Lame..

Im really disapointed..

2 hours of crying jack back and jack butt on island .. ARG and it just seemed to not have a real point

I enjoyed Danielle & Alex.. but their reunion even was lameish

I just feel let down.

Hahaha Colin, posting in this thread until the end. I'll look forward to seeing your posts next year.

Agreed on all your points, although perhaps Charlie just accepted that he had to die this time.

***Mod Edit For Off Topic***

***MOD EDIT FOR OFF TOPIC***

Agreed on all your points, although perhaps Charlie just accepted that he had to die this time.

In case you all missed the opening post with the rules about posting in this thread by our administrator...

This thread is for those that did NOT like the episode. If you liked the ep please visit the "Loved it!!!" thread. If you want to debate the episode (likes and dislikes), then please take your comments to the "Rate The Episode" thread or The "Discuss The Episode" thread. Any off topic posts will be deleted and possibly warned or given infraction points.

Stop the chit chat and let's get the thread on topic please..

It was just a let down IMO

I'm not that excited about the return, not like i thought i would be.

I'm not antsy to see it, its like... Lame..

Im really disapointed..

2 hours of crying jack back and jack butt on island .. ARG and it just seemed to not have a real point

I enjoyed Danielle & Alex.. but their reunion even was lameish

I just feel let down.

Perfect description.

Two hours of poor TV with far too many really bad ads.

I really didn't like the whole flashforward aspect. If this is the direction the show goes in, I'll be very disappointed. The cliffhanger was rather lame.

I really didn't like the whole flashforward aspect. If this is the direction the show goes in, I'll be very disappointed. The cliffhanger was rather lame.

You said it. And, you're right.

The more I think about this episode and it's moving forward to Jack and Kate being off the island, the more I don't like it and don't see it working.

The island is no longer mysterious. The outside world exists. People have left the island.



With this finale, Lost fast forwarded over the shark.

Why did Charlie basically commit suicide when he could just as easily have closed the door from the OTHER side? Duh! Just a minute before he was talking about noone having to die, then he up and offs himself. Plus, why did Cyclops dude shoot the grenade from OUTSIDE? And how lame was it that he came back to life after being shot? How old is that?

I really didn't like the future with Jack and Kate - soo depressing. If I want to watch something like that, I'll watch ER instead.

With this finale, Lost fast forwarded over the shark.


Brilliant! A nice Dharma shark would have helped things.

And, what about "smokey?"

Just wished the flash forward "WE HAVE TO GO BACK" a la "WAALLLTTT" didn't end the show.

I've been looking forward to the big pay off of a well deserved...well anything...including rescue...for the series - but now any sort of joyous anything on the island is going to be tainted by a drug addicted suicidal jack looming overhead.

way to ruin the momentum eh?

Two words; flash-forward and Charlie's death.

I actually liked everything in this episode except the flashforward. However, the flashforward brought this episode dangerously close to shark territory.

The ending was horribly depressing. Three years of Jack's character development were all for naught as he turns out to be a lonely, depressed, drug-addicted loser following his tragic father's footsteps. And he doesn't even get the girl in the end! What a letdown!

Even more depressing is that it killed some of my interest in the show. As someone said, the question of whether or not they would leave the island was one of the show's great mysteries. While I always figured that they would leave the island, I didn't think it would be revealed in Season 3 while we still have three more seasons to go. How am I supposed to maintain interest for another 48 episodes when a major mystery of the show is now gone? Especially given the knowledge that I spent three years following characters only to find out that they end up miserable? Why give us a glimpse of "The End" when the series is only halfway over? If I had seen this flashforward in Season 4 or Season 5, I wouldn't be so annoyed. Right now, I find that I have little reason at the moment to know or care what happens next on the show.

What a crappy note to end on before an 8 month hiatus.

I actually liked everything in this episode except the flashforward. However, the flashforward brought this episode dangerously close to shark territory.

The ending was horribly depressing. Three years of Jack's character development were all for naught as he turns out to be a lonely, depressed, drug-addicted loser following his tragic father's footsteps. And he doesn't even get the girl in the end! What a letdown!

Even more depressing is that it killed some of my interest in the show. As someone said, the question of whether or not they would leave the island was one of the show's great mysteries. While I always figured that they would leave the island, I didn't think it would be revealed in Season 3 while we still have three more seasons to go. How am I supposed to maintain interest for another 48 episodes when a major mystery of the show is now gone? Especially given the knowledge that I spent three years following characters only to find out that they end up miserable? Why give us a glimpse of "The End" when the series is only halfway over? If I had seen this flashforward in Season 4 or Season 5, I wouldn't be so annoyed. Right now, I find that I have little reason at the moment to know or care what happens next on the show.

What a crappy note to end on before an 8 month hiatus.


I agree....they could have done a million things differently. With all the unanswered questions and hype, they introduce something that was unnnessecary and a complete knock off of Alias. Why would we want to see them get off the Island? It was only dramatic because you have Jack desperate to go back, when all we've ever seen him do is want to get off...but that's where it stops being good. I have no interest in seeing the hero of the show reduced to a disgusting mess...the downfall of Jack was not facisnating. It was sad...kudos to Fox on the acting....cause Jack looked like an absolute loser. What's going to happen...Jack gets back to the Island, rights the wrong, and it's all good again? Was this worth it? Were they that desperate for a huge plot twist...it's sort of cheap.

Eyepatch getting SPEARED IN THE CHEST and not only surviving but sneaking out, SWIMMING AROUND THE STATION and releasing a grenade was so ridiculous it was painful. Could he not have just rolled the damn grenade into the room? He knew the signal would still be blocked even if the station flooded...what was he accomplishing? Did he not imagine that Charlie and Des could have just swam out when they saw him? Pulled themselves up with the rope? And why did Charlie commit SUICIDE? He didn't have to die. He could have easily went out the door...he beat Des to the door. What was the point? What does he accomplish by dying in that situation...there is no nobility in that. He already did the deed....what does his death preserve? Nothing....wow...that really made no sense....

I hated the flashforward. We are led to believe that Christian is alive in this supposed future. If Jack tried to fill a prescription written by his long dead father, he would be caught. He isn't stupid,maybe drugged out drunk, but not stupid. We all know Christian was dead in the current timeline, so what is going on? If Christian was dead, that Chief of Surgery would have had Jack put in the pysch ward. I found myself bored to death with each Jack flashforward.

Alex and Danielle meet. This is the most dramatic moment this season, and it gets little screen time.

Patchy is like Locke and can't die, but Pryce can die just by getting ran over by the Dharma VW bus.

How was Penny calling to the Looking Glass at the exact moment that Charlie was in the control room?

I didn't see "a rattlesnake in the mailbox." The whole flashforward was just seemed over the top. Season 1 and 2, had two shocking season ending moments (Season 2 had 3). We had Jack screaming at Kate. I was waiting for another scene, that never came. It is like they left out the big shocking moment.

this is the first time ever that I'm posting in this thread. I think there were no shocking moments in this episode, I know the end was supposed to be shocking but it just......
wasn't. I don't know how else to put it. I was prepared for Charlie's death since last week, but still didn't want it to actually happen. I also read in spoiler's previous to watching the finale that there would be a Locke and Jack showdown!! Where was it? If they mean towards the end with the little fight they had, that was a hardly a showdow! I've seen them fight much worse than that. Anyway, all in all I am happy that my favorite three characters are alright, Locke, Desmond and Sayid. ( which I nearly couldn't breath, when I thought Sayid was shot and killed) At least that was one thing I was happy about. I just wasn't happy with the finale as a whole. :broken_heart: :unhappy:

Typical Darlton episode. Lots of action, lots of twists, lots of butt-kicking…but very little emotional satisfaction. Say what you like about Eddie and Adam, but at least those guys have heart. Darlton just give us melodramas.

If they were real people, I would not like Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Locke, Juliet or Ben as human beings. They have also worn thin on me as characters. These characters leave me cold. I don’t relate to them. I don’t feel invested in them or endeared to them. I don’t even find them very believable (the writers fault, not the actors).

The tedious love triangle/quantrangle continues to drag the show down to a trashy expendable soap opera level. It truly saddens me that they chose to preserve this good guy/hot chick/bad boy crud and destroy the sweet purity of the Charlie/Claire/Aaron family unit. The writers really created something beautiful, sincere and sacred with their little CCA trinity. What a tragic waste.

Speaking of the death of innocence, Hurley is now a killer. Sorry but I did not enjoy seeing Hurley being heroic in that way, even if it was killing in defence of his friends. Hurley was the one pure-hearted character left. I didn’t want to see him resorting to violence and murder. I wanted our Hurley to stay soft and fuzzy through until the end. But how can we expect Hurley to remain upbeat when they have killed his girlfriend and his best mate? Seeing Hurley turn hard is not enjoyable but realistically that is how Hurley must be developed I suppose.

I guess you could say Claire is still pure. You could also say Claire is a limp vapid character who showed little concern for the man who went off to die for her. Claire is barely a presence on the show these days. I sincerely hope that Claire and Aaron are taken away to safety on a helicopter so Charlie didn’t die for nothing. Let Emilie go if you're not going to use her. Don’t keep her in the show if she is just a glorified extra. Sun and Jin are almost in the same bracket. It’s hard to care about these characters when they are so sidelined.

Sayid and Desmond are the only characters holding my interest now. If I ever watch Lost again I will just be tuning in for the Sayid and Desmond eppys. They're good guys. I want to root for these guys, but I fear that I will only get burned again. I’m sure Sayid will be killed off pretty soon and Desmond’s life just keeps getting grimmer.

Charlie’s death? HURTS.

Charlie, all Christ-like, lays down his life for the salvation of the Lostees. And he is beaten and taunted before he is killed. All the religious symbolism the writers have used tempted me to think Charlie might be spared like Isaac or resurrected like Jesus. But no. There is no salvation for the brave young man who sacrifices himself for the love of a mother and her baby. Salvation is instead gifted to the selfish old git who manipulates another man into murdering his father, stabs a girl in the back and has been systematically destroying all chances of a rescue.

Charlie’s death was cruel too. We thought Paulo and Nikki’s deaths were nasty. Charlie suffered the aqua equivalent of being buried alive. If that wasn’t harsh enough he wasn’t even allowed to spend his final moments feeling triumphant about bringing his friends rescue. He had to spend his final moments frantically telling Desmond that the rescue he was dying for might all be a big con. Or maybe not (?) It seems Jack and Kate got away at least. Instead of being grateful for Charlie’s sacrifice, Jack wants to squander it and go back to the island for more punishment. How insulting. If these characters have an opportunity to be safe in the real world, but go back to the island of their own choice I don’t see any reason why I should sympathise with them. FF Jack was just pathetic and whether set in the past or future Jack!flash eppys are still the most boring.

Guess what? We are all prisoners of fate! If there is no hope and redemption for Charlie then what hope is there for any of us? Charlie was the most human character of all. I loved him. He had the biggest heart. How are we supposed to follow Jack as our so-called hero for three more seasons when the true hero of Lost has been killed off?

:shesaid:

Wow, Cappy, I couldn't say it half as well so I'm not even going to try. I agree with everything you said.

Jack's flashforward apparently showed the consequences of defying fate. If you attempt to be rational and make your own choices you'll be punished. You have to do what you're "supposed" to do. I don't like that message.

:shesaid:

Wow, Cappy, I couldn't say it half as well so I'm not even going to try. I agree with everything you said.

Jack's flashforward apparently showed the consequences of defying fate. If you attempt to be rational and make your own choices you'll be punished. You have to do what you're "supposed" to do. I don't like that message.

:shesaid:I didn't like the let go perspective either.:mad: :redface: :confused:

:shesaid:I didn't like the let go perspective either.:mad: :redface: :confused: :shesaid: What a great post Cappy. ITA. What a depressing message the writers are telling us. They let a murderer escape his death but they couldn't bother finding a creative way to removed Charlie from his fate.

When we fist saw FBYE I sincerely believed that Charlie was the safest person on the island. The theme of free will seemed so obvious to be. Charlie had to live to demonstrate that free will would beat fate. I guess not.

Wow you burned 'em bad, Captain. You make valid points.

I also did not enjoy seeing Hurley turn into a killer like that.

It's hard for me not to like an episode where so many Others (and Charlie!) are killed, but there were still a lot of WTF moments that I didn't care for.

As mentioned already in this thread, WHY ON EARTH DIDN'T CHARLIE CLOSE THE DOOR FROM THE OTHER SIDE?! What the hell?

Way to completely waste Terry O'Quinn. Locke is so bleh now. Does anyone care about him at all? His intrigue has quickly wore off. Now he just seems crazy and pathetic. Walt? ZzzZzZzz.

Why kill Naomi?

Also, I kind of like the idea of flash forwards, but... how is Kate not in prison? How is Christian Shepherd alive? Eh...

Thing that I loved about the episode: Sayid telling Jack he is willing to give his life for the rest to be rescued. Sayid not talking. Sayid taking out the third Other!

Things that frustrated me.

Everything else, but especially...

Charlie committing suicide, and if he didn't it wasn't made very clear why that he HAD to die! The whole stupid musical code thing...

Mikiel coming back from the dead AGAIN...

Ben not coming clean on what was going on. If it was THAT important, then he should have shared. Why there is no explanation as to why all these people are following Ben and why they are the good guys when Ben will kill anyone and anything to keep the island happy??

Locke doesn't have ANY answers on the Island and he is willing to kill people...what a hero!

Bernard giving up his WIFE!!!!!!!'s location! He couldn't you know make up a lie to give his wife more time to get away!!!

Why no one went for the tower earlier in the show. Why no one followed the cable earlier in the show. Why no one built another raft earlier in the show. Why they didn't salvage everything from the hatch to build a boat, why they didn't do ANYTHING earlier in the show to get rescued, and then SUDDENLY in THIS episode, Jack HAS to get everyone rescued RIGHT NOW!!

No attempt to get Ben to talk, no attempt to check out Naomi, no attempt to have anyone else give an opinion. All the other Losties just watch the fight between Ben and Jack and Locke and Jack, and NO one says anything to back up Jack? So now it looks like Jack is the one being stubborn, especially with Ben's comments about "Why do you want to go back? What's there for you?"

Flash forward was confusing. Is Jack's dad now alive? Who's funeral was it? Interesting that all the dialogue conviently leaves out the sex of the dead person...adds to the mystery!?

I am getting sick of watching a show where they have to have another show "The Answers" to explain what we are seeing in the show they are doing!

Also, something that has bothered me from the start - If TPTB had a plan and knew how everything was going to start and end...why did they cast a kid that was just hitting puberty??? How stupid do you have to be to do that! Now they have this issue of Walt getting older and them having to disguise it with weird voices and distant shots to cover up their mistake. SO bothers me cause they keep saying they are going to address Walt's aging....soon...next season...next year....who's Walt...

I actually enjoyed the episode apart from the Jacket kiss

NOT JUST BECAUSE IM A JATER

I just think the whole Jacket relationship is pointless, the kiss came from no-where, again, not just because im a jater, although of course that does add to my reason, but i would find a Juliet / Sawyer connection much more appealing - there's a lot of storylines available there...

Just my opinion please don't feel the need to write an essay on why i am "wrong"...

they are forcing this quadrangle upon us when we don't need it... :(

I actually enjoyed the episode apart from the Jacket kiss

NOT JUST BECAUSE IM A JATER

I just think the whole Jacket relationship is pointless, the kiss came from no-where, again, not just because im a jater, although of course that does add to my reason, but i would find a Juliet / Sawyer connection much more appealing - there's a lot of storylines available there...

Just my opinion please don't feel the need to write an essay on why i am "wrong"...

they are forcing this quadrangle upon us when we don't need it... :(
I'm not a "shipper" at all, but the "Jacket" kiss felt out of place for me too. I agree that there is some interesting chemistry between Juliet and Sawyer. They make a fun team at least.

I might have been able to accept the Jacket kiss if it wasn't almost immediately followed by Jack telling Kate he loves her. I mean... does he also "love" Sun, Claire and Rose? Or does he just like kissing random women? It didn't make sense. When you truly love someone (enough to tell her not to come back for you in order to protect her), you DON'T kiss another woman right in front of her face!!!

Sometimes it makes me think the writers have never BEEN in love... :undecide:

I loved everything about the episode a LOT, expect for the flashfowards. They bug me. I didn't like that aspect. I hope they won't continue with them, ever. Bring the flashbacks back!

I loved everything about the episode a LOT, expect for the flashfowards. They bug me. I didn't like that aspect. I hope they won't continue with them, ever. Bring the flashbacks back!

A little while ago, I had proposed that they should do flash forwards, but at the very end of the series -- like the last few episodes of the SERIES. Last night, I had to think, "Wait... there are still THREE more seasons?"

BUT I have to say that in the end, I really liked the fact that it turned out to be a flash forward. Throughout the episode, the thing that was ruining it for me were the flat, boring flashbacks. I actually thought to myself, why do I care about this? I was disappointed that we didn't get more on-island flashbacks or a series of "Greatest Hits" which I think worked really well for Charlie. So when it turned out to be something different, I was happy enough, because if that was just another "boo hoo" Jack-back, it would have really ruined the show for me.

Thing that I loved about the episode: Sayid telling Jack he is willing to give his life for the rest to be rescued. Sayid not talking. Sayid taking out the third Other!

Things that frustrated me.

Everything else, but especially...

Charlie committing suicide, and if he didn't it wasn't made very clear why that he HAD to die! The whole stupid musical code thing...

Mikiel coming back from the dead AGAIN...

Ben not coming clean on what was going on. If it was THAT important, then he should have shared. Why there is no explanation as to why all these people are following Ben and why they are the good guys when Ben will kill anyone and anything to keep the island happy??

Locke doesn't have ANY answers on the Island and he is willing to kill people...what a hero!

Bernard giving up his WIFE!!!!!!!'s location! He couldn't you know make up a lie to give his wife more time to get away!!!

Why no one went for the tower earlier in the show. Why no one followed the cable earlier in the show. Why no one built another raft earlier in the show. Why they didn't salvage everything from the hatch to build a boat, why they didn't do ANYTHING earlier in the show to get rescued, and then SUDDENLY in THIS episode, Jack HAS to get everyone rescued RIGHT NOW!!

No attempt to get Ben to talk, no attempt to check out Naomi, no attempt to have anyone else give an opinion. All the other Losties just watch the fight between Ben and Jack and Locke and Jack, and NO one says anything to back up Jack? So now it looks like Jack is the one being stubborn, especially with Ben's comments about "Why do you want to go back? What's there for you?"

Flash forward was confusing. Is Jack's dad now alive? Who's funeral was it? Interesting that all the dialogue conviently leaves out the sex of the dead person...adds to the mystery!?

I am getting sick of watching a show where they have to have another show "The Answers" to explain what we are seeing in the show they are doing!

Also, something that has bothered me from the start - If TPTB had a plan and knew how everything was going to start and end...why did they cast a kid that was just hitting puberty??? How stupid do you have to be to do that! Now they have this issue of Walt getting older and them having to disguise it with weird voices and distant shots to cover up their mistake. SO bothers me cause they keep saying they are going to address Walt's aging....soon...next season...next year....who's Walt...

:shesaid:A long post filled with true observations.

For all the reasons stated previously, at the end I was left feeling sad, angry, and depressed. That's not what I watch television for. Did I say that I hated the drunk, addicted, suicidal Jack flash-forward, if that's what it was.

Oldwiz

I am not happy at how Hurley was portrayed in this ep. First, there was the "Ephialtes" set-up (a little "300" reference for you all... anyone gets it, they get a virtual chocolate chip cookie...) He keeps trying to help; he keeps getting rejected and put down, especially for his size! Those kinds of cheap "weight joke" shots are really irritating, and even more so when directed towards a character which up till now has mostly returned that kind of venom with love.

His running the bus into the Others was IMO a justifiable part of the "war" they were engaged in. However, that doesn't mean I liked it. Hurley is gentle, or has been, and not everyone has to fight. Some people have other talents.

Also, what was the worst part, for me, was when Hurley was on the walkie-talkie with Jack, and said something like, "I saved them." That was so OOC! Hurley would not brag about something like that. A realistic depiction of that scene - he would have gotten out of the bus, seen the body of the dead Other, and probably vomited. Even if it was justifiable for him to take a life, it would be something that would haunt him forever. The last thing he would do is brag like a gleeful child about it to Jack.

I am still convinced that up till now, Hurley has in many ways been the "soul" of the group. Why the writers would deliberately want to change or even destroy this, I don't know.

The flash forwards that we didn't know about until the end, the Jack, "Ilove you," the Hurley acting out of character, Charlie's useless death (HE DIDN'T DO ANYTHING IN THERE HE DIDN'T NEED TO DIE!), everyone being mean to Hurley, Bernard and Rose still being alive, and more Jack storyline (WE'VE HAD ENOUGH ALREADY!). Wow, didn't mean that to sound as angry as it does but that finale was a real disappointment.

ROFL.
First I read the spoiler online; I laughed out loud and like everyone though it crap.

But they did it; They actually did it. Did someone in the writer room say 'Hey, I read on the fora these flachbacks are not working so well anymore *points at newspaper* Look what we could do and is succesful nowadays: Flash forwards!

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Kate: Jack, you teleported us 5 years into the future!
Jack: We need to go back! Yatta!
Kate: You look badass!
Jack: It is my destiny to kill Ben!

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Jack: No...there is one...even worse than me, even worse than the bogeyman. He can see me. It's my own dad!

ROFL... I thought I was seeing a rerun of Heroes' 5 years later, with a couple of cheap beards and eyeshadow.

I just wasn't too happy with the flash forward, I thought that was pretty lame. And the whole Julet/Jack/Kate/Sawyer thing has been beaten to death. Just stop that.

This is the first time I've truly disliked an episode.I'm a Charlie fan so I'm a little biased, however, the whole thing came across as completely depressing.

Charlie dies -- depressing. Jack's life is a mess at the end -- depressing. Kate doesn't look very happy either -- depressing.

As for Charlie's sacrifice -- if it does lead to a true rescue in the end (perhaps through Penny) what difference will it make -- Jack doesn't appreciate it and wants back on the island. Lost has become too much like the real world -- television is more about escapism(at least to me). If I want to watch the depressing stuff I'd watch the news.

Even BSG (which can be a downer sometimes) at least offers hope. Lost made the future look bleak -- that the experience on the island ruined the lives of those who escaped.And as for killing off our favorite characters -- it's run it's course and I for one am tired of it.

I've heard that some Dom fans are dropping it but I think that the season finale itself may drive some people away whether they are Dom/Charlie fans or not. We already know that they get rescued and that their futures appear bleak. For those that are not into the mythology of the show the questions about the island(which are really the only things unanswered) may not be enough to keep them tuning in.

I could be wrong of course but the whole thing with the flash forward almost felt like an ending. And sometimes when things feel like endings they do -- end that is.

I am also so ... so ... so tired of Jack and Kate's peculiar middle-school-ish relationship. It has *nothing* to recommend it - no sex, no drama, no emotional depth, no good conversation. Nothing. I'm not sure even why it's there, except for fan service. And to see it dragged into the future three years ... oh, brother.

Also, it takes valuable screen time away from other potential relationships that *could* be more interesting. Why not reactivate a relationship for Sayid? For Hurley? Why not actually *develop* a Claire/Charlie/Aaron family relationship beyond the simple and superficial? (Because I don't for a minute believe Charlie is "really" dead.) But no - instead we have to watch more of Jack and Kate making moonie-eyes at each other, which is fine for 13 year olds, but I personally would like some *substantial* and *adult* relationshipping going on.

As for Charlie's sacrifice -- if it does lead to a true rescue in the end (perhaps through Penny) what difference will it make -- Jack doesn't appreciate it and wants back on the island. Lost has become too much like the real world -- television is more about escapism(at least to me). If I want to watch the depressing stuff I'd watch the news.

Even BSG (which can be a downer sometimes) at least offers hope. Lost made the future look bleak -- that the experience on the island ruined the lives of those who escaped.
Excellent post, Michelle! ITA. I don't necessarily need a happy ending, but I do need one that is satisfying and has a measure of hope. I didn't get it last night.

I assume that the writers aren't complete idiots and that the flashforward events that we saw will not come to pass the way we saw them. Somehow Jack will find a way to fix the past and change the future. But if that involves everyone being forced to remain on the island... Well, that wouldn't be very satisfying either. I really don't know how TPTB are going to write their way out of this one, but even if they can, they sure ended this season on a sour note.

1) To lead 40-odd people in various sstages of (un)fitness to an important errand such as finding a com tower in the middle of nowehere is totaly idiotic. Two orthree people would get there so much faster. That Moses thing was ridiculous.
2) Charlie's dead was absurd, He did not have to die. It would take the same time to close the door behind him as it took to close the same door in front of him. He had plenty of time to close the door. Obviously the authors could not come with a solution to keep desmond alive, so they chose to make Charlie commit suicide. But Mikhail's face, with grenade and eyepatch at the hatch, was fun.

Agree with you, Tirade.

I was also unhappy with Jack's character assassination. We weren't told anything about what brought about the misery and self-destruction so it was hard to feel sorry for him. Matthew Fox did a great job, but it made me uncomfortable to watch our erstwhile hero hitting the skids.

And I agree that the big mystery -- of whether the Losties finally get off the island -- has been diminished. Obviously they do. The destination has been revealed. The journey is yet to unfold, which is great for people who -- unlike me -- like the process of "getting there". I'm more of a "being there" person.

And I'm sick to death of Patchy. Die already.
100%
I assume that the writers aren't complete idiots and that the flashforward events that we saw will not come to pass the way we saw them. Somehow Jack will find a way to fix the past and change the future. But if that involves everyone being forced to remain on the island... Well, that wouldn't be very satisfying either. I really don't know how TPTB are going to write their way out of this one, but even if they can, they sure ended this season on a sour note.

I suspect you're right, but I'm not sure it's worth an eight-month wait to find out how Mr. Fix-it manages to ... erm, fix it. There wasn't much suspense in the finale, just a kind of blah morose feeling. I can't maintain that until January of next year. Don't even want to.

I absolutely hated this episode. I didn't hate it just because Charlie is my favorite character. I hate it because it was poorly written and was a significant waste of our time. We got only two vital pieces of information out of the episode: Naomi is not with Penny's group and only some of the castaways get off the island at some point in the future.

The entire episode was depressing. There was no message of hope, just one slap in the face after another.

Charlie's death was contrived. There is no way that Mikhail could have been capable of swimming to the porthole with a spear in his chest. If he didn't just bleed out from having a major artery or his heart pierced, one of his lungs would have collapsed and he wouldn't have been able to hold his breath. And Penny's transmission was just too coincidental. Charlie didn't have to die; he already succeeded in his mission.

Jack's flashforward was just one more crappy depressed/self-loathing Jack spectacle. They could have left out the bit with Kate at the end and it would have been just another Jackback. I really hope season 4 or season 5 doesn't revolve around Jack trying to get back to the island. I'd have to stop watching Lost right then and there.

I absolutely hated this episode. I didn't hate it just because Charlie is my favorite character. I hate it because it was poorly written and was a significant waste of our time. We got only two vital pieces of information out of the episode: Naomi is not with Penny's group and only some of the castaways get off the island at some point in the future.

The entire episode was depressing. There was no message of hope, just one slap in the face after another.

I totally agree. This finale sucked big time :drowsy:

edited to add that Charlie is not my favourite but he was good.

There is no way that Mikhail could have been capable of swimming to the porthole with a spear in his chest. If he didn't just bleed out from having a major artery or his heart pierced, one of his lungs would have collapsed and he wouldn't have been able to hold his breath.

Like his cat, this guy has 9 lives :rolleyes: or maybe the magic island cured him :rolleyes: :rolleyes: or maybe we're supposed to believe that his vital organs are in his abdomen, not in his chest *I just sprained my eyes from rolling them hard*



Jack's flashforward was just one more crappy depressed/self-loathing Jack spectacle. They could have left out the bit with Kate at the end and it would have been just another Jackback

Damn this woman and her accident from distracting him to jump.




I really hope season 4 or season 5 doesn't revolve around Jack trying to get back to the island. I'd have to stop watching Lost right then and there

I realize that Jack won't die, can't die, but I CAN stop watching this crap. That's why I don't give a damn about S4 or S5.
I'm done.

It's hard for me not to like an episode where so many Others (and Charlie!) are killed, but there were still a lot of WTF moments that I didn't care for.

As mentioned already in this thread, WHY ON EARTH DIDN'T CHARLIE CLOSE THE DOOR FROM THE OTHER SIDE?! What the hell?

Way to completely waste Terry O'Quinn. Locke is so bleh now. Does anyone care about him at all? His intrigue has quickly wore off. Now he just seems crazy and pathetic. Walt? ZzzZzZzz.

Why kill Naomi?

Also, I kind of like the idea of flash forwards, but... how is Kate not in prison? How is Christian Shepherd alive? Eh...

I felt the same about the Others-massacre, Bryce. :) Even though Mr.Friendly/Tom was the only dead Other of any real consequence (I don't believe Mikail the Unkillable is dead), TPTB made up for it in sheer numbers (at least a dozen dead Others by my count).

The rest was just a snooze.

I liked Ben's mention of "the temple", but of course we didn't see it, and judging by how long it took us to see the radio tower, we may not see it for years. So we get no real follow-up to that four-toed statue from Season TWO's finale, and all in all we learn next to nothing about Dharma, the island, the Others and anything else of any real interest on the show.

Other posters have pointed out the flaws in the episode, and my only two real impressions were that:

1. If preventing contact with Naomi's ship was so important why didn't Ben and/or Locke provide any details about who those people are and why they are so dangerous? The answer of course is that TPTB didn't want to reveal any of that info (for whatever stupefying reason), so we end up with a very dull cliff-hanger (the rescuers -- who we have not seen at all, and of whom we know almost nothing about -- might not be who they say they are!!!! SCARY!!! Not really. :rolleyes: ). Going down the hatch, this one ain't. Meh.

2. On the one-hand, the flash-forwards solve the problems of TPTB otherwise having to come up with two more seasons of boring, repetitive filler from the same cast of characters. On the other hand, so now we have to deal with mysteries that happen in the future??? After at least some of the survivors get off the island??? You mean to tell me, that this whole show has been building for three years to the climax of the survivors getting off the island, and now we have a flash-forward where they get off the island and their goal is going to be to get off the island? Ugh. It's worse than taking the air out of that particular pay-off. TPTB have created a whole new level of convoluted mess and literally made the whole idea of the survivors getting off the island irrelevant (almost incredible to believe). It doesn't matter if they get off the island, because the mysteries and unresolved issues follow them. (Not to mention that the whole idea that Jack turns into an alcoholic suicidal junkie when he gets off the island makes me not care anymore what he does.)

I mean when you actually connect these two points there really isn't any cliff-hanger at all, and you could almost end the series with last night's episode: Jack called Naomi's ship. They arrive and rescue the 815ers, but Jack now realizes he should have stayed on the island. Boo hoo for him.

As to lingering mysteries like ten-foot tall Walt apparitions and four-toed statutes, you could almost let them all go and say "so long, Lost, it was nice knowing ya!".

So, that's TPTB parting shot, and it was limp and ugh, I can't even bring myself to care enough to finish this post. At least we can thank TPTB for making the eight-month hiatus (and maybe longer for some) easy.

IM)O, the finale would have sucked much less had CHarlie's death been a LITTLE less rediculous. Honestly, two people aren't going to notice a guy who was just shot with a harpoon gun get up, put on diving equipment, find a miraculous grenade from nowhere, swim over to Charlie, decide to blow himself and Charlie up? Seriously, this is almost as stupid as the Michael double murder.

Bond

Well I love Lost and I will be back for season 4 most definitely and the finale has left us with lots of theories to toss about...but for a finale I just didn't like it for a number of reasons

I have no interest in seeing the hero of the show reduced to a disgusting mess...the downfall of Jack was not facisnating. It was sad...kudos to Fox on the acting....cause Jack looked like an absolute loser.

Eyepatch getting SPEARED IN THE CHEST and not only surviving but sneaking out, SWIMMING AROUND THE STATION and releasing a grenade was so ridiculous it was painful.

And why did Charlie commit SUICIDE? He didn't have to die. He could have easily went out the door...he beat Des to the door. What was the point? What does he accomplish by dying in that situation...there is no nobility in that. He already did the deed....what does his death preserve? Nothing....wow...that really made no sense....

I hated seeing Jack reduced to such a total dangerous wreck (great acting) but so draining and depressing to watch ...thought Patchy coming to life again silly.... and found Charlies death totally pointless now....

People have mentioned closing the door from the other side but I thought it must have been a one way closing door so he couldn't do it that way....however he and Des could have dived into the pool and swum back up to the surface or Charlie could have swum through the port hole....Charlies death could have meant something last week...this week it was reduced to "suspend your belief" status.....

Hurley the gentle care bear runs over and kills a guy....ok....it changed the dynamics.... but I found it horrible to see Hurley do that for some reason

Bernard giving up his WIFE!!!!!!!'s location! He couldn't you know make up a lie to give his wife more time to get away!!!


Bernard spilling his guts like this was yuk....what?...save Jin and let his wife and all the woman and little Aaron die?

And the whole Julet/Jack/Kate/Sawyer thing has been beaten to death

Watching this stuff is getting very lame....lets have Kate not care that Sawyer has gone off on a suicide mission ...lets have Juliet surprise Jack with a pointless kiss....then lets have Jack at this point finally tell Kate he loves her....whatever couple ends up together is being reduced to 'ho hum thats life and ain't it a shame'.......But to take away the burgeoning little family of Charlie and Claire and Aaron amongst all this stood out a mile and again was depressing

People have mentioned closing the door from the other side but it was a one way closing door so he couldn't do it that way....however he and Des could have dived into the pool and swum back up to the surface or Charlie could have swum through the port hole....Charlies death could have meant something last week...this week it was reduced to "suspend your belief" status.....


People mean that he could have gone outside the room and then closed the door. Instead of pushing the door closed from inside the room, he could have pulled the door shut from outside the room.

And yeah, you're right about the porthole.




Watching this stuff is getting very lame....lets have Kate not care that Sawyer has gone off on a suicide mission ...lets have Juliet surprise Jack with a pointless kiss....then lets have Jack at this point finally tell Kate he loves her....whatever couple ends up together is being reduced to 'ho hum thats life and ain't it a shame'.......


Agreed. They wasted the mini-season on this relationship mess and for some reason it continues.

People mean that he could have gone outside the room and then closed the door. Instead of pushing the door closed from inside the room, he could have pulled the door shut from outside the room.


I thought there was no way of closing it on Desmonds side i.e. only one way to close the door shut, from the inside (at least that would have given the whole scenario some credence)...and if there was a way to close it from Desmonds side its even more absurd (can't be bothered having a look)...but why did Charlie seal himself in?....plus he had some pretty important info to give Desmond and the rest of the losties....and Claire and Aarons rescue now must have looked to Charlie like a set-up, taking away from his sacrifice to save them and a pretty strong reason to fight for his life....again why not dive into the pool with Desmond

Another thing that irked was the "hot chicks" who are "tuff" in the Looking Glass Station....give me a break :rolleyes:

I thought there was no way of closing it on Desmonds side i.e. only one way to close the door shut, from the inside...and if there was a way to close it from Desmonds side its even more absurd...but why did Charlie seal himself in?....plus he had some pretty important info to give Desmond and the rest of the losties....and Claire and Aarons rescue now must have looked to Charlie like a set-up, taking away from his sacrifice to save them....again why not dive into the pool with Desmond


Yeah, I'm not into going back and rewatching the scene to have another look at the door either. Regardless, I agree with everything else you say above. Why sacrifice yourself when your actions just put everyone in danger? Charlie should want to live at that point.

Last year around this time I would have already re-watched the finale oh.... 2 or 3 times by now.. Just to catch the little exciting clues... To re-watch scenes that held promise of an answer... To slo-motion the fast scenes in hopes that viewing it slower will unveil a new twist. But mostly because I loved last season's finale. It left me breathless with questions and possibilities... And I couldn't wait to jump on these boards to theorize with everyone.

Flash-forward (pun intended) one year. I have not, and will not be, watching the finale over again. It was far too depressing a romp the first time around; one which I do not wish to repeat.

Jack-backs showed us a lovely, flawed, and completely human man. Jack-forwards showed us a pathetic, broadly-drawn caricature.

Charlie was yanked from us after all, after yanking our chains for four months. The "we're so cool 'cause we actually off our main characters" is becoming formulaic, annoying and immature.

Hurley is now a killer, albeit one that saves the day.. Luvs - I agree, he is now sadly changed somehow in my eyes.

Mikhail has evolved into Michael from Halloween.. I fully expect Jamie Lee Curtis to come on board next season to spend the day screaming while he chases her.

So we're going into an 8-month hiatus with no real cliffhanger... No real puzzles to try to solve.. And no real hope of a triumphant gang-buster return in the new season. No hope - period. We've flashed forward to a grim reality which I don't really care to revisit. I probably will be back, but the next 8 months won't be spent with baited breath, awaiting the return of Lost.

I usually spend the hiatus dusting off the prior season's DVDs and re-watching them in sequence so I can revisit the characters and wonderful stories. Sadly, I don't even think I'd like to do that now... It would be hard to watch Jack in his glory knowing what he turns into. Hard to watch Boone, Shannon and now Charlie, knowing they are gone. Hard to watch wonderful Locke interact with anyone.. Now he's been ripped from the ensemble and forced to play against a pit of skeltons and a ghost in a chair. Very sad.

Hard to watch wonderful Locke interact with anyone.. Now he's been ripped from the ensemble and forced to play against a pit of skeltons and a ghost in a chair. Very sad.

Well said. Locke has practically died in a way, too. He's evolved into a very different person from Season 1 to the present.

But mostly because I loved last season's finale. It left me breathless with questions and possibilities... And I couldn't wait to jump on these boards to theorize with everyone.

Jack-backs showed us a lovely, flawed, and completely human man. Jack-forwards showed us a pathetic, broadly-drawn caricature.

Mikhail has evolved into Jason from Halloween.. I fully expect Jamie Lee Curtis to come on board next season to spend the day screaming while he chases her.

We've flashed forward to a grim reality which I don't really care to revisit. I probably will be back, but the next 8 months won't be spent with baited breath, awaiting the return of Lost.



Well put as usual ame....I actually forced myself to watch the finale a second time in the hope that I would change my opinion of it (I was shocked by my first response as I too was thrilled by the season 1 and 2 finale's).....but the depressing image of future Jack and the poor eviction of the character Charlie just sits heavily...

However coming on here and seeing your post perked me up particularly the bit about Mikhail and Jamie Lee Curtis.....I am sure we can amuse ourselves on the fuse duing the 8 month hiatus :)

I really thought this finale sucked. Too much Jack. Too much drug addiction. Always a bummer when Charlie was doing it, but now we have to watch Jack do it too.. Lame.

I thought the characters behaved really unnaturally.

Why wasn't there a reunion between carl and the Alex. I thought they loved eachother?

Why didn't Alex express even the remotest sympathy for her father who was getting beat up. Yeah, I know he did some bad things, but he's her father. Or at least the only one she remembers. I don't think I could watch what Jack did to Ben without interfering.

Danielle knocks ben out with an elbow to the face, Come on, too cartoony.
Why didn't desmond shoot out the door unlock it and grab charlie? There would still bet plenty of time to swim out of the hatch. Heck, why didn't charlie run outside when he saw patchy with the grenade?

I really don't care for time travel as a plot device. I hope this is not a sign of worse things to come.

This episode really seemed padded to make it 2 hours. i guess I was expecting something awesome like season 2.

I really hated the flash forward. I maybe don't even want to watch Lost anymore because of it, maybe because I got such an empty feeling from it. The cliffhanger really sucked and I'm tired of never getting any complete answers. Charlie's death just sucked. I really wanted Desmond to talk to Penny. Jack is a retard. Rosseau and ALex's reunion was lame. Only good part I felt was the Naomi mystery.

From the last few shows, I didn't think this was going to be a very good finale', but it was worse than expected.

People dropping like flies, as though there are plenty more where they came from. No problem though, because they die and the island brings them right back. Ridiculous, because now, when we see someone get killed, it has no meaning at all.

Juliette and Ben's relentless lying.

The flash forwards were too awful. I don't care what is going to become of Kate or Jack after the island. I don't care who Kate ends up with or why it happens.

If Jack signaling the boat was going to spell doom for everyone on the island, what did Ben have to lose by TELLING JACK enough to make him understand some things?

I can't even bother listing all of the things I didn't like. The short list is what I did like. After seeing Hurly get his feelings hurt a second time, his heroic appearance was GREAT!

This is the first time I've truly disliked an episode.I'm a Charlie fan so I'm a little biased, however, the whole thing came across as completely depressing.

Charlie dies -- depressing. Jack's life is a mess at the end -- depressing. Kate doesn't look very happy either -- depressing.

As for Charlie's sacrifice -- if it does lead to a true rescue in the end (perhaps through Penny) what difference will it make -- Jack doesn't appreciate it and wants back on the island. Lost has become too much like the real world -- television is more about escapism(at least to me). If I want to watch the depressing stuff I'd watch the news.

Even BSG (which can be a downer sometimes) at least offers hope. Lost made the future look bleak -- that the experience on the island ruined the lives of those who escaped.And as for killing off our favorite characters -- it's run it's course and I for one am tired of it.

I've heard that some Dom fans are dropping it but I think that the season finale itself may drive some people away whether they are Dom/Charlie fans or not. We already know that they get rescued and that their futures appear bleak. For those that are not into the mythology of the show the questions about the island(which are really the only things unanswered) may not be enough to keep them tuning in.

I could be wrong of course but the whole thing with the flash forward almost felt like an ending. And sometimes when things feel like endings they do -- end that is.


I agree with everything you said. The show is simply ran its course.


...but why did Charlie seal himself in?....plus he had some pretty important info to give Desmond and the rest of the losties....


Welcome to the "WTF happened now?????" club. Even posters on imdb are asking the same question whom are partying that Charlie is dead. :undecide:

I thought this was like the worst episdoe of Lost simply because you see Jack's flash-foward thing. Which I thought was very upsetting and I think that hasn't gone down too well in the Lost community. I thought the bit that shocked me the most was Jack looking for the Island and that he was on drugs & drinking.

What did you think of this part of the episode??

I wanted the flash forward to turn out to be a flashback some how. Then after that I wanted it to go back to the island and show some big reveal to make it all worthwhile. But it just fizzled out there in the future. What is the big cliff hanger that this specific episode is meant to leave us with? Is it whether or not the boat is rescue or not? I can kind of see that... but I don't care so much personally. I'd prefer it if they showed more of John, show what Walt said to him, and the process of getting back on his feet, and why he didn't want Jack to use the phone. There were lots of good things about the episode, not all bad, but not to be discussed here. I was disappointed overall I think. I like it being dark and gloomy, but this ending wasn't brutal enough, or interesting enough. I don't know what the viewer is meant to get from seeing Jack and Kate off the island. Also, perhaps that is where the next series will pick up from, with Jack and Kate off the island... and whoever else got off. Maybe that could work out.

I am not happy at how Hurley was portrayed in this ep. First, there was the "Ephialtes" set-up (a little "300" reference for you all... anyone gets it, they get a virtual chocolate chip cookie...) He keeps trying to help; he keeps getting rejected and put down, especially for his size! Those kinds of cheap "weight joke" shots are really irritating, and even more so when directed towards a character which up till now has mostly returned that kind of venom with love.

His running the bus into the Others was IMO a justifiable part of the "war" they were engaged in. However, that doesn't mean I liked it. Hurley is gentle, or has been, and not everyone has to fight. Some people have other talents.

Haven't seen the film, and only have a single issue of the comic which I read years ago, but I'm assuming Ephialtes is the large, misshapen bloke?

The van has gone from 1) a symbol of Hurley's triumph over his own self-doubt and the doubts others held toward him to 2) a patricidal gas chamber to 3) Hurley's tool of death. What a sad degradation of symbol.

I share people's dismay at the writers' decision to make Charlie's death a contrived, unnecessary self-sacrifice, especially after such build-up. Having "Greatest Hits" conclude with Charlie's underwater, last-gasping struggle to throw the switch would've counted for much more in my book.

Mikhail is what I have always depised about those slasher flicks from the 80s - that Jason/Michael Myers/He's surely dead this time!/Oops! crud gets old quick. I'm guessing a grenade can't keep him down.

Yea, it wasn't really that good. I thought the finale was weak. Jack's fast foward was kinda disturbing considering he is a man that never gives up or would seem to be brought down to that level of a drug addict suicidal.

Charlie, I dunno what to say. I think they should at least bring his character back some how. I felt there was no real reason to kill him off. I think the finale would have been more exciting if Des actually found a way to save Charlie thus dodging fate... that would have made a much more intense scene as well something positive to come of a depressing epy.

Lock... Was my favorite character.. now turning into a full time A$$ Kisser to the island. What a wuss..If the island told Lock to have sex with the wild boars.. he would.


Booo on LOST. I own both Season 1 and 2 at home on DVD. This new release of Season 3 I can care less to pick up..

BOO BOO BOO.. that's three Boos. BRING BACK THE GREATNESS OF SEASON 1!

Haven't seen the film, and only have a single issue of the comic which I read years ago, but I'm assuming Ephialtes is the large, misshapen bloke?

Enjoy your virtual chocolate chip cookie, steaming-warm from the oven.

Yes, Ephialtes is the "traitor" in the 300 story. He's a hunchback who was saved from infanticide by his parents' affection for him. His father tried as best he could to raise him as a warrior. When Leonidas sets off for Thermopylae with his group of men, and they are joined by the other Greeks, Ephialtes sneaks behind, hoping to join up with them at some point.

Finally Ephialtes confronts Leonidas, and asks for a place in his army. Leonidas tells him, No, because you can't lift your shield above your head (to form the phalanx, the sheild-wall that protects the men as a unit.) He goes on to say that there are other things Ephialtes can do, carry water to the wounded, etc., but Ephialtes is crushed - and goes on to sell his services to the Persian enemy.

The van has gone from 1) a symbol of Hurley's triumph over his own self-doubt and the doubts others held toward him to 2) a patricidal gas chamber to 3) Hurley's tool of death. What a sad degradation of symbol.

That is an excellent point! The van had something magical about it when it first appeared - how else could it have started? It wasn't physically possible otherwise. Then to "tarnish" it with all that negativity (Roger's murder, and then using it as a tool of war) - that indeed was really sad.

I was so taken by the van that I even mused over a fan-fiction, where Hurley goes back to where he left the van, and the van is mysteriously gone. (That's why I don't write anything in an open canon!) I too think the van should have been left as something special for Hurley, the special place where it all came together for him. But no.

Seeing Hurley rejected that way, twice, really made me think of Ephialtes, and it also made me sick to my stomach that Hurley could have been "set up" by the writers as a potential traitor, or someone who would do something like turn to a hostile group out of despair.

Because Hurley and Sawyer as a team *can* run things, and probably run them well. Jack's return is *not* shown as a positive thing for Hurley, and story-wise, that seems to be a very dark path down which the story could go. I hate to see it, because IMO even in the darkest story there needs to be someone who's still mostly living "in the light," so to speak.

Disclaimer - I love the show as a whole and is one of 3 must see shows. I basically watch nothing else on TV.
That being said, this episode sucked.
This is the first sucky episode all season, although last weeks episode with Jacob the sometimes invisible superior being (who for some reason needs help), was already starting to show its suckiness for the sucky season finale.
I was getting annoyed that I had to wait 2 hours to find out who was in the coffin. Imagine my blood pressure when I realized that I would be waiting at least 8 months.
Aren't they starting to run out of Others yet? I mean they can't reproduce, so the supply must be getting low. Not only are the Losties killing them off, but Ben has them killing each other on top of that.
The underlying message was that Jack f'ed up and had to make some serious sacrifices to get off the island or ended up realizing Ben was right and there was some special purpose to the island and it should be kept from the rest of the world.
My only complaint about that is that why doesn't Ben speak up and quit talking in freakin riddles and circle talk and just say what is on your f'in mind. Because at this point, you've lied to and manipulated people so often, no one with 1/2 a brain is going to believe you at face value. You'd have to be a blithering idiot to think Jack would believe a word you say.
The only good thing to come put of the episode was that Charlie finally acted like a good little hobbit and died..
Even as thrilled as I was about that, he just had to be as dumb as a rock to get killed. Here's an idea Charlie, when the psycho with the grenade is about to make the ocean fill your confined space, be on the OTHER side of the door.
Overall I found the episode depressing and I'm not sure I want to see what happens to make Jack like that.
One note on consistency. At least Kate's still a self-centered A-hole in the future, too.
100%
So the stupid dynamite plan turned out to be, well, stupid.


When Friendly threatened to shoot Jin, why did Bernard tell the truth about the radio tower? Why not send them far away from the tower? They had no way of knowing what was true.


Just wondering, why is it these morons never bothered to follow the ocean cable when they found it in season 1? Desmond looked down from the raft and could see the station. That might have been something I would have checked out months eariler.


Charlie. Good riddance. Don't care. What an amazing(ly contrived) coincidence that the code was programmed by a musician and Charlie just happens to be, that's right, a musician!

Why didn't he go OUTSIDE the door and then close it? Watch it again. He had time and could have done it even with Desmond approaching. Furthermore, he didn't even try to escape through the porthole Mikhail blew open.

Also, why did Mikhail go outside in the water to pull the grenade? It makes no sense (other than to contrivingly set up Charlie for his big heroic death scene). Mikhail should have simply thrown the grenade into the room where Charlie was. Yet inexplicibly, Mikhail takes a harpoon to the chest and then somehow, and for some reason, manages to put on some gear and swim outside to pull the grenade? Yeah, OK.


Alex to Ben: Why do you have to stop them? Why don't you just let them leave?
Ben's typical non-answer: Because I can't Alex.


Jack tells Kate he loves her right after he lets Juliet look deep into his heroic eyes and kiss him on the lips. Yeah, OK.


Walt, I mean WAAAALLLLLT!, has "mysteriously aged" in a couple months. And what was with his voice? Uh. Also, his appearance wasn't much of a surprise considering his name was in the opening credits. Way to go TBTP!


Hurley playing Mad Max with the bus? Kind of silly looking. Did anyone think Hurley wasn't going to show up to save the day after the obvious set up with Sawyer putting him down and telling him not to come? Telling someone not to come on Lost is a sure sign that person will eventually show up.


Jack confronts Ben at the Radio Tower (that no one bothered to try and find for 3 seasons) and Kate, who must be part bloodhound, somehow deduces in a minute that there are only two sets of tracks. Incredible!


If it's SO IMPORTANT for Ben to stop Jack from contacting the ship, why doesn't he come clean with what's really going on with the island? If everyone is going to die and the island's purpose ruined, why doesn't he spill his guts to convince Jack what he's saying is true. Isn't that the time to put your cards on the table and quit being mysterious?

Furthermore, what was the big hurry to make a decision when Jack and Ben talked at the tower? Why didn't Jack suggest they confront Naomi with Ben's info? Why not TRY to manipulate or con her in some way to ATTEMPT to see if she is who she says she is? If there's a EVEN A CHANCE that she's lying and everyone's lives are in danger, why not make sure you're doing the right thing? Afterall, there was NO HURRY. Jack didn't suggest anything. Ben, the master manipulator, con-artist and evil genius, didn't suggest anything.


So we're flashing forward? Kind of like the other show JJ screwed up: Alias. Get an original idea JJ. Flashing forward is when you messed up Alias remember?

Jack and Kate are off the island? I'm not sure I really care. More importantly, I'm not sure enough viewers care enough to wait until February 2008 to get back into the show.

Lost won't make it another 3 years and 48 episodes. The ratings will continue to fall as they have since season 2. Now that some of the characters are off of the island, a big part of the show's mystery is GONE.

People who never watched Lost are going to hear that characters got off the island. Why would they be interested in jumping into Lost at this point? Lost can only lose viewers from here.

Colin72 - You have to stop using logic and suspend all reality for the writers sake. they will answer all these questions or pull some explanation out of their bunghole that negates all logic layed out before them.

Excellent post by the way. I agree with all your points.

I ranted and raved a couple of minutes ago, but just thought of one more thing. haven't these people ever seen a horror movie before. the second Mikhail was down with the harpoon in his chest, I'm saying to myself "Here we go, the old Michael Myers routine. For the love of God shoot him in the head". That scene was very disappointing.

Well, I liked when Sawyer shot Tom. 'Bout time. That's it for the positives.

They're making this stuff up as they go, and not even trying to make sense. That's been obvious to me since the season 2 finale, but interestingly enough Lindelhof has now admitted as much in a recent EW interview. I'm too lazy to link to it, but I'm sure it's available somewhere around here. He says they didn't want to kill off Desmond at the end of S2, but they knew there had to be some severe consequences to turning the fail-safe key - and they thought time-travel would be "cool." Now if they knew what the Swan Hatch was to start with, they'd already have known the result of turning the key, and that result would be pre-determined no matter who turned it. The Swan had no meaning other than to generate "cool" stuff in the show.

That mindset was in evidence all throughout this episode. Still wondering what's up with the island, the Others, Jacob, Smokey, et. al.? The answers don't exist. It's not that they're unknown, they simply don't exist in the minds of the writers. And when a few of them are eventually created out of whole cloth sometime next season, the same way the fail-safe "answer" was created, they'll undoubtedly be geared towards triggering more fights, explosions, romances, paranormal phenomena, inexplicable suicides and immortal Russian slashers, with complete disregard for internal consistency.

At this point watching monkeys flinging feces at each other would be every bit as entertaining as watching Lost. It's got everything Lost has. Action. Noise. Drama - I mean, those monkeys are really into it, look at the emotions. Mystery - why are they flinging their own poo? In all seriousness, I would probably enjoy watching a big monkey-poo fight. But geez, not for three years. Certainly not four. Especially if you told me it was King Lear.

They're making this stuff up as they go, and not even trying to make sense.


I've thought this since I saw Season 1 on DVD. Jack was supposed to die in the pilot episode. Now his flash forward is the grand finale of Season 3. :biggrin:

When Kate appeared at the end of the show off the island.. I was greatly disappointed. The whole flash forward was a great disappoinment to me. I cryed when Charlie sacrificed himself for nothing. Yeah, maybe they all got off the island.. but we didn't SEE it. I wanted for so long to actually see them leave!! Yet, I wanted the writers to wait for Season 4, or 5 or even 6.. for them to get rescued. Not now...

I know we just saw a few mins of Jack and Kate off the island. Jack tells Kate he wants to go back and Kate (with tons of makeup on.. liked the 'freshhlooked face, no makeup Kate')says "No , I'm not going back there!!" Why, did they end the show so depressing!!!?? Jack was a mess!! I hated it!! Didn't like seeing Jack that way.. and seeing it end that way either!!

I loved the first part of the episode.. and half of the 2nd part.. but not the last part.

Depressing episode it was. I actually went to bed a bit depressed!! LOL

So the stupid dynamite plan turned out to be, well, stupid.


When Friendly threatened to shoot Jin, why did Bernard tell the truth about the radio tower? Why not send them far away from the tower? They had no way of knowing what was true.


Just wondering, why is it these morons never bothered to follow the ocean cable when they found it in season 1? Desmond looked down from the raft and could see the station. That might have been something I would have checked out months eariler.


Charlie. Good riddance. Don't care. What an amazing(ly contrived) coincidence that the code was programmed by a musician and Charlie just happens to be, that's right, a musician!

Why didn't he go OUTSIDE the door and then close it? Watch it again. He had time and could have done it even with Desmond approaching. Furthermore, he didn't even try to escape through the porthole Mikhail blew open.

Also, why did Mikhail go outside in the water to pull the grenade? It makes no sense (other than to contrivingly set up Charlie for his big heroic death scene). Mikhail should have simply thrown the grenade into the room where Charlie was. Yet inexplicibly, Mikhail takes a harpoon to the chest and then somehow, and for some reason, manages to put on some gear and swim outside to pull the grenade? Yeah, OK.


Alex to Ben: Why do you have to stop them? Why don't you just let them leave?
Ben's typical non-answer: Because I can't Alex.


Jack tells Kate he loves her right after he lets Juliet look deep into his heroic eyes and kiss him on the lips. Yeah, OK.


Walt, I mean WAAAALLLLLT!, has "mysteriously aged" in a couple months. And what was with his voice? Uh. Also, his appearance wasn't much of a surprise considering his name was in the opening credits. Way to go TBTP!


Hurley playing Mad Max with the bus? Kind of silly looking. Did anyone think Hurley wasn't going to show up to save the day after the obvious set up with Sawyer putting him down and telling him not to come? Telling someone not to come on Lost is a sure sign that person will eventually show up.


Jack confronts Ben at the Radio Tower (that no one bothered to try and find for 3 seasons) and Kate, who must be part bloodhound, somehow deduces in a minute that there are only two sets of tracks. Incredible!


If it's SO IMPORTANT for Ben to stop Jack from contacting the ship, why doesn't he come clean with what's really going on with the island? If everyone is going to die and the island's purpose ruined, why doesn't he spill his guts to convince Jack what he's saying is true. Isn't that the time to put your cards on the table and quit being mysterious?

Furthermore, what was the big hurry to make a decision when Jack and Ben talked at the tower? Why didn't Jack suggest they confront Naomi with Ben's info? Why not TRY to manipulate or con her in some way to ATTEMPT to see if she is who she says she is? If there's a EVEN A CHANCE that she's lying and everyone's lives are in danger, why not make sure you're doing the right thing? Afterall, there was NO HURRY. Jack didn't suggest anything. Ben, the master manipulator, con-artist and evil genius, didn't suggest anything.


So we're flashing forward? Kind of like the other show JJ screwed up: Alias. Get an original idea JJ. Flashing forward is when you messed up Alias remember?

Jack and Kate are off the island? I'm not sure I really care. More importantly, I'm not sure enough viewers care enough to wait until February 2008 to get back into the show.

Lost won't make it another 3 years and 48 episodes. The ratings will continue to fall as they have since season 2. Now that some of the characters are off of the island, a big part of the show's mystery is GONE.

People who never watched Lost are going to hear that characters got off the island. Why would they be interested in jumping into Lost at this point? Lost can only lose viewers from here.

First off - I don't agree with this guy. I think this is the best Lost ever. However - this guys makes some damn good points and I respect his point of view. A really well thought out post. Good job dude.

A very average episode at best!

1. I wanted a more interesting reunion between Danielle and her daughter.
2. I disliked how cold Sawyer was to Kate.
3.I dislked the romantic repartee between Kate/Jack
4. disliked seeing Jack grovel and scrabble for drugs.
5. I disliked Jack's beard.
6. I disliked Alex standing around looking petulant and not doing anything.
7. I disliked the Carl/Alex lack of chemistry. These two are in love, but they seem blah about eachother. I don't see the spark.
8. I disliked seeing Bonnie and Gretta shot. I thought they were interesting chars.

Most of all, I loathed the long amount of time spent in the self-pitying jack-back. Jack had my respect in the last 2 episodes, but this one... Yuk

Enjoy your virtual chocolate chip cookie, steaming-warm from the oven.

Many thanks! I'll have to check out "300" sometime.

Fuyuko posted: 8. I disliked seeing Bonnie and Gretta shot. I thought they were interesting chars.

Alas, there's a high probability that attractive females will be shot to death on Lost with no discernible chance of resurrection. The Lazarus gene seems to be a guy thing (at least for Charlie, Mikhail, Locke? Christian? Jacob?).

Loved this finale until I learned it was a FLASH FORWARD!

FF? what the...?

A drug addict jack-back was a new twist. Wow Jack baby, so u have a dark secret eh!

No its the future. Huh? Thats ridiculous & lame. I m gonna post more but most of wht i want to say u guys have eloquently put forth.

Jack confronts Ben at the Radio Tower (that no one bothered to try and find for 3 seasons) and Kate, who must be part bloodhound, somehow deduces in a minute that there are only two sets of tracks. Incredible!


If it's SO IMPORTANT for Ben to stop Jack from contacting the ship, why doesn't he come clean with what's really going on with the island? If everyone is going to die and the island's purpose ruined, why doesn't he spill his guts to convince Jack what he's saying is true. Isn't that the time to put your cards on the table and quit being mysterious?

Furthermore, what was the big hurry to make a decision when Jack and Ben talked at the tower? Why didn't Jack suggest they confront Naomi with Ben's info? Why not TRY to manipulate or con her in some way to ATTEMPT to see if she is who she says she is? If there's a EVEN A CHANCE that she's lying and everyone's lives are in danger, why not make sure you're doing the right thing? Afterall, there was NO HURRY. Jack didn't suggest anything. Ben, the master manipulator, con-artist and evil genius, didn't suggest anything.


So we're flashing forward? Kind of like the other show JJ screwed up: Alias. Get an original idea JJ. Flashing forward is when you messed up Alias remember?


Dude colin72 what great points. I almost always look forward to readin your analysis! Where the hell were you for the last few eps?!

I didn't even know there was a "hated it" thread until now. I came looking for someplace to vent over what has to be the worst episode of the entire series. I was stunned that it was so awful, and that's coming from someone who's a complete Lost fanatic and hasn't disliked a single episode before.

It's as if the writers completely forgot that the island, along with its mysterious puzzle, is the main "character," with the cast coming-in second. That's been the premise from the beginning, and it's what made Lost so unique. But wow, this ep just killed that concept. Nobody's even talking about the puzzle or mysteries of the island, or Dharma, or anything cool, it's all about the future, and being saved, and character-driven sub-plots, which even I have to admit have started to get old and tiresome (ie. the flashbacks).

I so wanted to get a few new pieces to the island puzzle, and more history about Hanso/Dahrma/The Others, etc. But no, we really didn't get anything new, just vague double-talk that didn't actually mean anything, or at least couldn't be realistically applied to anything concrete that's come before to advance our knowledge, even slightly, in any positive degree.

I read above that supposedly they're making this up as they go along. I'd stop watching the show instantly if that proved to be true. Having them fill-in some blanks with new material that wasn't planned, if harmlessly layered over a planned story-arc, is fine, but if they really don't know the answers to questions before they pose them to us, that'd just be the ultimate deal-breaker. We can't piece together a puzzle if they're cutting each piece when they feel like it, with no foreknowledge of what the completed picture is. Dear Lord, say it ain't so.

I disliked Charlie's death. I could have accepted it, and simply felt saddened by the loss, had it had some sort of meaning. But apart from Charlie being convinced by Desmond's visions that he "had to die," there was nothing to actually support the idea. Flipping the darned switch was the catalyst. The vision simply showed him dying afterwards. Had he not effectively committed noble suicide, they could easily have gotten out together. That was a small port window. It would have taken awhile for the water to fill-in the room (which, if you'll notice, wasn't breached in the main pool area, so once the water levels rose above the hatch-level, they'd have had a good ten feet of air-filled space above to still breath in. Even worse, the raft was on the wrong side of the facility, and we saw them both (during their initial dives) come up under one side, see that the pool was on the other side, and still swim to it without drowning. Leaving was as simple as jumping back in the water, and swimming up from under the closer side, then straight up to the surface, knocking off at least a third of the initial journey. (And even then, with the air pockets in the pool room, they could have still taken time to gear-up and use the tanks.) No, this whole sub-plot felt horribly forced, and unrealistic, which took the emotion and meaning out of the death.

Regarding the whole Flash Forward thing (loved the funeral home anagram of that phrase), I find this incredibly ironic, because I was getting tired of the flashbacks, and had been hoping for more on-island "present" time. But instead of that, the flashbacks are dropped for Flash Forwards??? Argh!!! Not only does that take the steam out of the mystery/puzzle progression factor (ie. a forward momentum pattern of revelation via sequential clue), but now we know some basic facts from after it's all over. Does anyone else see the irony here? We've begged for information, been given very little of it, and now they're giving us info we didn't want to know about because it ruins various aspects of the mystery!

The biggest problem, --and this is slightly more general in nature, but had definite roots in this ep, among many others--, was the simple fact that, once again, nobody's asking any of the questions that any human being in their situation would, nor is anyone offering information that would make sense to tell someone that you wanted to co-exist with (if Ben doesn't want them to leave, he's certainly never done anything, --from day one--, to entice them to stay). "We don't want you near us, but we don't want you to leave, and oh, we're going to tell you to stay on your side of the island, but will repeatedly cross the line ourselves and slap you upside the head --but don't get upset and come after us! No, no!" What the hell??? Jack's entire stay with the "others" and he never once asked any of the obvious questions about them, Dahrma, the island, or most importanly, why they were treating them this way. Nor does anyone else seem to find answers important. None of it makes any sense! People just don't act that way. Someone walks up and points a gun at you, you don't shout "Hey, if you do that, my friends will counter-attack!" you say, "Hey, who are you, and why the hell are you pointing a gun at me? What'd I ever do to you?"

I keep thinking about why the others didn't simply make peaceful contact with the survivors from the beginning. Even if they'd wanted to remain a private, isolated community, all they'd have had to do was lend a little humanitarian aid, tell the survivors that they were isolationists, and that they couldn't come live with them on their patch, and agreed to simply keep some sort of mutual peace, occasionally interacting as needed. Hell, if I'd been in Ben's shoes, I'd have just let the survivors know about the possible "contagion," told them that a shot existed and that it'd be no trouble to give everyone a quick medical once-over (thus gaining the medical info on the mothers at the same time), and if I didn't want them on the island, but was afraid of being located, simply offered to ferry them to the mainland with the sub (they couldn't exactly find their way back or spill the beans about the island, by name or location). I get that there are secrets they don't want to disclose, but there's an awful lot of stuff that's being treated like state secrets that could only be useful to both parties. Very confusing, and with the finale making that frustrating aspect worse, I just want to shoot somebody. :)

And what of Michael? If they don't want anyone to leave, where did he and Walt go? They didn't seem to care of those two made it back to the mainland, so why act as if the rest of the survivors leaving the island would be a disaster?

Oh, and what the heck is up with Locke? Ok, I get it, he doesn't want to be rescued. No sweat. But sabotaging every possible method for everyone else to go home??? And then killing someone simply because they had a phone??? Unless a future flashback shows that he somehow discovered the girl was the anti-christ, about to start pounding sulphuric lava up everyone's posteriors with uninhibited glee, I now hate him. lol

Hurley killed a bad guy. No sweat. He was saving the lives of his friends, and did what was necessary. The "negative" comments diected at him earlier were, obviously, unfelt by those that said them, and meant simply to protect him. He's not stupid, I'm sure he eventually figured that out, if not immediately. I also think he did the gung-ho charge to prove himself a bit, but that's cool, too. Only part of that I found strange was his reaction afterwards. Didn't seem like him, acting so cheerful about it. He was probably still feeling the adrenalin, though, and elated that he'd done something useful and lifesaving, so I imagine that, if we'd had more screen time for him then, we'd have seen him start to clam-up as the full realization hit, and probably lose his cookies. Heh, don't forget the pilot ep, either. Just seeing blood makes him pass out. I guess he's gonna be bribing someone to wash his van for him. <Chuckle> "Dude, I'll give you ten coconuts if you make all that red stuff go away. I'll be over there on the other side of that hill. Just shout when you're done."

Overall I'd have to say this ep left me feeling hollow and depressed, for multiple reasons. Each season finale leaves me eager for more, chewing my nails off to find good summer clues, and waiting for the story to resume. This one, though, with the concept of "Flash Foward" segments floating in my noggin, and a further lack of tangible clues, leaves me depressed and dreading what we'll see next. I'm not excited and eager this time, I'm simply worried that my favorite show has just lost the element that keeps us watching and hoping for more.

Ok, I'll shut up now. :) One question, though. Do they really make hockey masks and machettes in Russia? lol As that dude looked through the port window with the grenade, you could almost hear the Colonel Klink voice shouting, "Hahahaha, I'm still aliiiive Charlie Hogan! Shultz, prepare my sub! Glub, glub, glub..."

Colin72 - You have to stop using logic and suspend all reality for the writers sake. they will answer all these questions or pull some explanation out of their bunghole that negates all logic layed out before them.

Excellent post by the way. I agree with all your points.



Thanks wickedsmat. One thing that amazes me about Lost is how so many people praise it for it's intelligence and mythology. The truth is that if you apply the slightest logic and rational thinking concerning many aspects of the show it completely falls apart. And I'm not talking about realism in the sense of time travel, ghostly Jacob, etc. Every TV show creates it's own world - BUT - the show has to play fair and be rational within that world. As many people have pointed out in this thread, many things on Lost simply fail the test of common sense and logic






They're making this stuff up as they go, and not even trying to make sense. .


I believe they did have a general plan from the beginning but they are absolutely making up much of this as they go (which David Fury, former Lost Executive Producer told Rolling Stone long ago).

Here's the plan they could have had from the beginning... A plane crashes on an island and people survive. The island is somehow cloaked by inhabitants so the survivors can't be rescued. There is also some device that keeps people from being able to navigate the ocean and escape. The inhabitants have been conducting experiments on the island because it has very special properties.

So from there they threw in "the numbers". Remember them? Remember when they were a central mysery and fans were debating their meaning and were anxious for answers? Well, it turns out there are no answers. We also saw A LOT of castways crossing paths and having some kind of connection in their flashbacks. Remember that? Well, it turns out that really doesn't matter either. Much of Lost is filler and smoke and mirros because they simply do that have much story to tell. The mysteries of Lost are not deep, they are just a wide, sprawling mess of misdirection and BS.

Lost is a brand new kind of storytelling where a mystery really isn't a mystery. We're given clue after clue, encouraged to play online games, look for clues on web sites, call phone numbers from special Hanso TV ads, watch for easter eggs, etc, etc, etc. And what does it all add up to? NOTHING. Because it's either meaningless or often it turns out that a mystery isn't a mystery because a character was lying or conning someone. The truth is, the real people being conned are the viewers.



First off - I don't agree with this guy. I think this is the best Lost ever. However - this guys makes some damn good points and I respect his point of view. A really well thought out post. Good job dude.


Thanks e-sp. It was nice of you to write and say that.




Dude colin72 what great points. I almost always look forward to readin your analysis! Where the hell were you for the last few eps?!


Thanks andy. I've been distracted with other things and thought I'd take some time off from posting to see how they wrapped up the season. I hoped that we would have gotten something better than this finale since Lost is gone until February 2008. By the way, I noticed they weren't "promoting" that. I wonder why? In fact, during one of the last episodes there was a voiceover that promoted an episode as one that "would have you talking all summer". I thought to myself. Hmm. They are being a little misleading since Lost won't be back in the Fall. They better hope they have people talking all Summer, all Fall, and into the Winter. Unfortunately, I think they failed to do that with this finale.
100%


It's as if the writers completely forgot that the island, along with its mysterious puzzle, is the main "character," with the cast coming-in second. That's been the premise from the beginning, and it's what made Lost so unique. But wow, this ep just killed that concept.


You make a lot of great points in your post Kurgan. As you said, they killed mysterious island concept. I guess viewers have more romance and love triangle episodes to look forward to in 08.

By colin72 (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/member.php?u=27131)
We also saw A LOT of castways crossing paths and having some kind of connection in their flashbacks. Remember that? Well, it turns out that really doesn't matter either.For me this is one of the worst things the writers have done to the viewers. 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon is one thing, but these connections have been only 1 or at the most 2 degrees of separations. That can NOT be a coincidence. It would be very rare to have one of these connection between 2 of the survivors, but in Lost there has been multiple connections between many of the survivors. My understanding is TPTB have said the connections are just random and just cool and not important to the story. :frown:

It's as if the writers completely forgot that the island, along with its mysterious puzzle, is the main "character," with the cast coming-in second.Wow, great post, Kurgan. I completely agree!

I remember when the island was the focus of the show. Now the setting could be any place, and the focus is more about tribal politics than anything else. And what's worse, one of those tribes, the once-mysterious natives, has been revealed to be merely well-armed suburbanites.

In this episode we finally get to see the mysterious Radio Tower, referrenced first way back in Season One, located deep within what has been called the Dark Territory. "They control it now," we are ominously told. But what happens when the Losties, en masse, finally decide to traverse that Dark Territory to reach the Tower? Nothing. No Smokey, no whispers, nothing mysterious at all. It's just a radio tower in a field.

It could just as well be anywhere on the planet. Anywhere except Mysterious Island...

The ending was horribly depressing. Three years of Jack's character development were all for naught as he turns out to be a lonely, depressed, drug-addicted loser following his tragic father's footsteps. And he doesn't even get the girl in the end! What a letdown!

Even more depressing is that it killed some of my interest in the show. As someone said, the question of whether or not they would leave the island was one of the show's great mysteries. While I always figured that they would leave the island, I didn't think it would be revealed in Season 3 while we still have three more seasons to go. How am I supposed to maintain interest for another 48 episodes when a major mystery of the show is now gone? Especially given the knowledge that I spent three years following characters only to find out that they end up miserable? Why give us a glimpse of "The End" when the series is only halfway over? If I had seen this flashforward in Season 4 or Season 5, I wouldn't be so annoyed. Right now, I find that I have little reason at the moment to know or care what happens next on the show.

What a crappy note to end on before an 8 month hiatus.

You stated my feelings exactly, Tirade.
I'm depressed, saddened, and suddenly disinterested. By the time February rolls around, my interest in Lost will be as dead as Charlie.

Last season's finale was so good. I was hoping this one would live up to it.
Did we see more Jacob ? No
Did Charlie have to die ? No
(Do regular old grenades work under water? - No)
Did Naomi have to die ? - No
Do you really believe that Penny sits in front of a video phone 24/7 - No

I didn't totally hate it but it wasn't my favorite episode for sure.

Danielle reuniting with Alex was sweet as was Danielle putting the shut up elbow to Ben.

I think a lot smaller complaints, specifically things like Penny being too quick to answer the call, are items we can safely scratch off the list as probably easily explainable, and we simply aren't privy at this time to the reasons.

However, let's hark back to a couple of sub-plots that were originated early-on that seem to have been completely dropped or ignored. Walt's apparent psi powers are one that I've been waiting to hear more about (now that we know the "others" aren't Darhma, I'm very interested as to why they were so keen on taking him in the first place, since it was the Dahrma people who were doing that sort of research). Highest on my list of "where the hell did that important subplot go?" items, though, is the whole Rosemary's Baby routine with Claire and her baby. Remember how everyone and their brother were trying to get the kid, and having world-shattering visions of doom if she took the flight and remained pregnant? Something like that (been awhile), but it boiled down to the baby pretty much causing the end of the world or something if it got born on the island (implied, not actually said, of course). I also seem to remember seeing some of the "others" or perhaps Dahrma people hovering around her, but I can't be certain now (ah, the memory is the first thing to go...) :)

In this episode we finally get to see the mysterious Radio Tower, referrenced first way back in Season One, located deep within what has been called the Dark Territory. "They control it now," we are ominously told. But what happens when the Losties, en masse, finally decide to traverse that Dark Territory to reach the Tower? Nothing. No Smokey, no whispers, nothing mysterious at all. It's just a radio tower in a field.

I noticed that...

I thought the same thing, too, in 'The Brig' when Locke and Sawyer went back to the Black Rock. I'm pretty sure the writers have forgotten that they put it, along with the radio tower, smack dab in the middle of 'The Dark Territory'.

In fact, I'd bet if you mentioned the Dark Territory to Lindelof or Cuse you'd just get a blank stare and a "what?".

I thought this was like the worst episdoe of Lost simply because you see Jack's flash-foward thing. Which I thought was very upsetting and I think that hasn't gone down too well in the Lost community. I thought the bit that shocked me the most was Jack looking for the Island and that he was on drugs & drinking.

What did you think of this part of the episode??While I was watching it, I was thinking, "Jeez, crashing on the island was the best thing that happened to this bloke". (A bit like The Island did a favour to Locke, Charlie and desmond).

Then, when it turned out to be his future, I thought, "Right, now even Jack realises the island was the best thing to happen to him"!

But by then I'd already given up on this finale.

Ben telling Mikhail to go and find out why Charlie had gone down to the Looking Glass. Hmmmm.
Well, the Losties have a radio phone, which they can't use because the signal is being jammed, and it's being jammed by the Looking Glass, and it seems like the only people who know that the Looking Glass is jamming transmissions are Ben, Bonnie, Greta, and ... Juliet. And Juliet, who is desperate to get off the island, is with the Losties.

FFS, I'm not very quick witted, but even I was thinking "Just tell Bonnie to kill Charlie!"

As if that wasn't enough.
Ben tells Mikhail to kill Charlie (fair enough, even though Mikhail hasn't yet found out why Charlie is down there, I suppose Ben has figured it out). Then tells Mikhail to kill Bonnie and Greta, to prevent them telling anyone about the jammed transmissions. Even though Juliet already knows. And now Mikhail knows. And Ben says all this right in front of Alex, the one he's handing over to the Losties, for the specific reason that she has already betrayed him once!

For the love of Jacob, if this is what got the Green Light, I'd hate to see what was rejected!

I was so sad to see Charlie go out the way he did. I understand the actor wanted out and wanted to go out in a certain way, but the way Charlie went out could have been so much better.

In fact, I'd bet if you mentioned the Dark Territory to Lindelof or Cuse you'd just get a blank stare and a "what?".

Well, they have that with most of what happened in season 1 anyway, but it's not impossible; It seems if you keep clubbing them over the head yelling they need to finish something for once, they sometimes bother to do it. Like the cable into the water.

Of course, it usually makes no sense whatsoever (season 1 simple rope >< Season 3 large electrical wire), but that's another point.

I believe they did have a general plan from the beginning but they are absolutely making up much of this as they go (which David Fury, former Lost Executive Producer told Rolling Stone long ago).

Here's the plan they could have had from the beginning... A plane crashes on an island and people survive. The island is somehow cloaked by inhabitants so the survivors can't be rescued. There is also some device that keeps people from being able to navigate the ocean and escape. The inhabitants have been conducting experiments on the island because it has very special properties.

So from there they threw in "the numbers". Remember them? Remember when they were a central mysery and fans were debating their meaning and were anxious for answers? Well, it turns out there are no answers. We also saw A LOT of castways crossing paths and having some kind of connection in their flashbacks. Remember that? Well, it turns out that really doesn't matter either. Much of Lost is filler and smoke and mirros because they simply do that have much story to tell. The mysteries of Lost are not deep, they are just a wide, sprawling mess of misdirection and BS.

Lost is a brand new kind of storytelling where a mystery really isn't a mystery. We're given clue after clue, encouraged to play online games, look for clues on web sites, call phone numbers from special Hanso TV ads, watch for easter eggs, etc, etc, etc. And what does it all add up to? NOTHING. Because it's either meaningless or often it turns out that a mystery isn't a mystery because a character was lying or conning someone. The truth is, the real people being conned are the viewers.


I share your sentiments; I feel conned too. Mysteries turns out to be non-mysteries, explanations are reversed at the last minute, the main characters ran out of stories suddenly and get killed, the main focus of the storyline (the island history, DHARMA, the numbers) are never to be mentioned again. It is as if writers don't know what they are doing, and making it up as they write as if to compensate their mistakes in their writings. If it is not purgatory, why is the mystery that everyone knows them dead? If the numbers and button were important as to save the world, shouldn't they be entering numbers and pushing buttons in another hatch? I am now inclined not to believe the official statements by writers because I am convinced that they do not know more than I know.

It was the worst out of the finales i hated the ending and the fact that it was a flash-forward was good but kinda weird the way it ended the only thing i liked was that hurley was hilaroius and saved jin,sayid and bernard and that desmond didnt die. The whole Walt thing was a lil stupid i thought.

I was so sad to see Charlie go out the way he did. I understand the actor wanted out and wanted to go out in a certain way, but the way Charlie went out could have been so much better.


Actually, he didn't want out.

TV Guide May 24, 2007 (http://www.tvguide.com/News-Views/Interviews-Features/Article/default.aspx?posting=%7B10F0A8C6-0C7C-49AF-BE6A-699645887B94%7D)


TVGuide.com: And Charlie will be back in some way again on Lost, right?
Monaghan: It's really not up to me. I think, to a certain extent, if I was writing the show, we may not be having this interview right now.



Well, they have that with most of what happened in season 1 anyway, but it's not impossible; It seems if you keep clubbing them over the head yelling they need to finish something for once, they sometimes bother to do it. Like the cable into the water.


There are so many things they've abandoned and failed to address it's mindboggling. I dare anyone to try and make it through this guy's list without becomingly extremely annoyed or passing out from exhaustion (http://www.xanga.com/murlough23/542224219/my-master-list-of-lost-mysteries.html).

There are so many things they've abandoned and failed to address it's mindboggling. I dare anyone to try and make it through this guy's list without becomingly extremely annoyed or passing out from exhaustion (http://www.xanga.com/murlough23/542224219/my-master-list-of-lost-mysteries.html).

Quite a list. Some people are intense.... :biggrin: :drowsy:

While I was watching it, I was thinking, "Jeez, crashing on the island was the best thing that happened to this bloke". (A bit like The Island did a favour to Locke, Charlie and desmond).

Then, when it turned out to be his future, I thought, "Right, now even Jack realises