Ok, Smart People of the Lage, I NEED your assistance.

After 3 amazingly crazy seasons - plus a few episodes, we have a Desmond episode that seems to be attempting to tie up some long awaited questions. I would absolutely love it if we could get some posters here to help me put together a time line for Desmond's activities.

I'll start by attempting to mention a very few pieces of this story.....

Desmond was in the army in 1996. This was after he was with the monks - which is when he met Penny.
He was jailed at some point after this, but before 2001 - when he set off on his boat race.
He met Jack in the stadium while he was training for that race - sometime in 2000 or 2001.

How much do we know about what happened between 1996 (The Constant) and 2001 (Boat Race)?

That's kinda all i gots :shrug: Which isn't much and i'm sure there is a whole bunch i'm forgetting.....for example, when was the famous picture taken (the one of Des and Penny) Before the army? After jail?
Have we ever been told how long Desmond and Penny knew each other? What year they first met?

As you can tell, i really could use some assistance :biggrin:

I'm going to be up all night trying to get a handle on when certain events happened to Desmond.

I am far too tired for this... more or less in your shoes of wishing people could help me figure it out.

But I have this to add-

The earliest point that I can think of is where he's with the monks, yes. After he runs off on the woman he was engaged to (can't remember her name). He meets Penny at the end of all that.

Then comes the part that was revealed to us when Desmond realizes he's "looping", if you will. That is, when he wakes up because he fell and spilled paint all over himself and the floor. At that time, he is living with Penny, in her flat. He then goes to Mr. Widmore, is rejected, learns about the boat race, etc.

I think this is right so far but I could easily be missing something. As I said I'm exhausted.

After that whole bit, they have that picture taken and he breaks up with her. We see him pass an army recruitment office directly after that, and I believe this leads to that.

So then his military experience. Eventually, he is put in prison. When he is released, Widmore meets him and gives him Penny's letters, etc. He decides to go on this race around the world, meets Libby, gets the boat.

Finally (before we see him in the storm and ultimately wash up on the Island), Penny finds him at the stadium where he meets Jack.

That's all I can think of, at least.

Well, before he was with the monks, he was with Ruth. They were together for six years. He broke up with her just a week before the wedding. He got sloshed in a pub and met a monk who gave him an out. After he fulfilled his vow of silence, the duration of which was left somewhat open, he then went to see Ruth, and she lambasted him. She told him it was a good thing there wasn't a shepherd standing over him or he'd have joined the sheep or something to that effect. He then got sloshed on the Moriah wine that the monks made. That's how he got fired from the brotherhood, and how he met Penny. (Catch-22)

Desmond had been with Penny for two years when he went to ask Widmore for permission to marry his daughter. However, when he went to buy the ring, Mrs. Hawking had this to say:

Well, I know your name as well as I know that you that don't ask Penny to marry you. In fact, you break her heart. Well, breaking her heart is, of course, what drives you in a few short years from now to enter that sailing race -- to prove her father wrong -- which brings you to the island where you spend the next 3 years of your life entering numbers into the computer until you are forced to turn that failsafe key. And if you don't do those things, Desmond David Hume, every single one of us is dead. So give me that sodding ring.

So, he was with Penny for 2 years prior to 1996, served in the military (1996) and then in prison. (2 years total?) He spent 8 months getting into shape for the solo race around the world. Since such races run around 3 to 4 months, that explains why he told Penny he would be back in 1 year. He was on the island for 3 years, which all adds up to 8 years. (Flashes Before Your Eyes and Live Together, Die Alone)

Hey guys......that info definitely helps put things into perspective.

But i'm still kinda fuzzy on a few things. Maybe if i jot it down in point form and see how it flows......

pre-1994 - with Ruth, calls off wedding, works with monks, banned from botherhood, meets Penny

1994 - 1996 - with Penny, asks Widmore for permission to marry her, gets rejected, finds out about the boat race, has that day with Penny when the picture is taken, breaks up with her and joins the army

1996 - 2000 (??) - in the army, ends up in jail, release from jail and dishonorable discharge, gets Penny's letters from Widmore (don't really remember that, lol), decides to do the boat race.

2000 - 2001 - trains for race, meets jack, sees Penny at the stadium, starts race

2001 - 2004 - sailing around the world, crashes on Island, 3ish years in the Hatch, 815 crashes.......

and so begins our story :)

so does that sound about right? What's missing in there?

ok, now question time......

It would have seemed, in The Constant, that Penny had kind of moved along with her life, but when Desmond was in prison, she was writing letters to him? Maybe he was writing to her while in there and that caused her to have a change of heart? I guess we still don't know what, exactly, landed him in prison?

i know i have more questions, but i've only had one cup of coffee this morning...... maybe after the second (and third) i'll be able to think of a few more, lol.

Thanks, Charlie and Shootfire....and anyone else who chimes in with some input :biggrin:

OK, so...

2001-2004=on the island
2000-2001=training boat race/ boat race
1998-2000=in prison
1996=in the army
1994-1996=dating Penny
1994=he was a monk
1988-1994=dating Ruth

1996-1998 has got me flummoxed. I only put him in the military for one year because last night made it look like he was in basic training, and if he is discharged for the army thinking that he is pretending to be crazy, it surely would have been around the time of his flashback.

So sometime btw the military and prison he finds Faraday at Oxford and Widmore at the auction? But doesnt remember til now?

As for his time in jail, I was waiting all night last night to learn that the reason he was in jail was because the 'looping' Desmond went AWOL to find Farraday and Penny. Would make sense. He said he had only 2 days of leave but between Oxford and finding her & her dad, he had to have been gone for longer. I really thought we would learn that because that would make the whole looping thing even more messed up because it would make it like the life he remembers is, and has always, been effected by the loops he is going through now.

Anyone see the movie Deja Vu? Same type thing

It would have seemed, in The Constant, that Penny had kind of moved along with her life, but when Desmond was in prison, she was writing letters to him? Maybe he was writing to her while in there and that caused her to have a change of heart? I guess we still don't know what, exactly, landed him in prison?

Did she write him letters when he was in prison? I thought when Desmond got out, Penny's father gave him all the letters he had written to her. I could be mistaken. As for the prison time, I agree with MatthewAbaddon that he was probably incarcerated for going AWOL during his visit to Oxford and to see Penny.

I thouhgt the letters were Desmond's letters to Penny that Widmore intercepted and didn't let Penny read.

Did she write him letters when he was in prison? I thought when Desmond got out, Penny's father gave him all the letters he had written to her. I could be mistaken. As for the prison time, I agree with MatthewAbaddon that he was probably incarcerated for going AWOL during his visit to Oxford and to see Penny.

I thouhgt the letters were Desmond's letters to Penny that Widmore intercepted and didn't let Penny read.

ok, sorry guys
my bad

i barely remembered the letters at all, let alone who sent them to who.

thanks for the correction :biggrin:

as for getting incarcerated for being AWOL, someone in another thread, who has military connections, is of the opinion that going AWOL for such a short period of time wouldn't be cause for jail time (assuming he wasn't gone for more than a day or so longer than his 2 day leave). It's definitely a possibility, but it wouldn't surprise me if there's more to it :undecide:

It seems that memory is affected by these loops. Desmond doesn't remember the loops until he goes through it. He remembers the future but in the future he does not remember the past. Maybe Faraday is going through the same thing. That's why he can't remember Des and he was trying to remember those cards.

as for getting incarcerated for being AWOL, someone in another thread, who has military connections, is of the opinion that going AWOL for such a short period of time wouldn't be cause for jail time (assuming he wasn't gone for more than a day or so longer than his 2 day leave). It's definitely a possibility, but it wouldn't surprise me if there's more to it :undecide:

Yeah, I have another couple of issues with it, too. First, Widmore said he went to prison because he couldn't "follow orders." Widmore called him a coward. Since cowardice is such a dominant theme in Desmond's story, I have to think he did something just ambiguous enough that even he believes there is something to the cowardice angle. I mean, what does cowardice have to do with not showing up for duty for a couple of days? Why would he be afraid of basic training, if that's what it was? Or any kind of training for that matter? Logically, the cowardice label wouldn't fit his AWOL status from training so much as irresponsibility. Mrs. Hawking said that turning the key would be the most heroic thing Desmond would ever do. I think there has to be an emotional beat to balance that. He "saved the world" by turning the key. I'm thinking he probably did something truly appalling the way he beats himself up all the time. Maybe he had some kind of experience/flashes at an inopportune moment? Maybe he froze up because he was seeing something nobody else could see?

Must have been before Des went to prison... but was it before or after their meeting in this episode? From the way the letter is written, I'd say this is a much more dedicated Penny than the "I would like to make a clean cut" one from this episode.

Yes that's a good question...i think after the "i would like to make a clean cut" she probably changed her mind...maybe they were dating again before he was put in prison that's why she left him the letter in our mutual friend and all the letters her father intercept, and was also there before he goes to the island in the stadium... when she said on the phone she was trying to find him since 3 years maybe it was because Desmond disappeared 3 years ago...how much time he spent on the island exactly? I don't remember...

>>edit: ok i just check on page 1 of this topic and he came on the island in 2001!