If Jin died in the crash & they did manage to bring his body back, wouldn't the medical examiner realised that he would have only been dead by a few days/weeks rather than months as his body would be very decomposed on a hot island for 3 months +.
I imagine if he is dead or not then that is just a memorial for her to visit rather then an actual grave.

If Jin died in the crash & they did manage to bring his body back, wouldn't the medical examiner realised that he would have only been dead by a few days/weeks rather than months as his body would be very decomposed on a hot island for 3 months +.
I imagine if he is dead or not then that is just a memorial for her to visit rather then an actual grave.

I don't think any bodies were brought back. The plane is thought to be at the bottom of the Sunda Trench(unless that gets discredited to the public in the future) I have a feeling there will be some sort of fantastic tale or story about the 06 getting sucked out of the airplane and landing on a coral reef/floating garbage continent/moby dick/desert island(not Ben's). I bet there are close to 300 gravestones for all those on Oceanic 815 around the world- they may very well have been erected before the 06 make it back and are certainly empty graves(just for a memorial).

FIRST OF ALL PEOPLE...THIS THREAD IS ASSUMING...

***FIRST off it's getting off subject*** Here are the FACTS we should know...

TIMELINE with Jin's (& Sun's) Tombstone. THEY WERE BOTH PRESUMED DEAD! REMEMBER? Oceanic 815 was ASSUMED missing at Sea...THEN (VOILA!) months later they (Widmore & Assoc) "find" the remains of O815...to deep to surface the wreckage...

So...timeline follows...BOTH Jin & Sun were assumed DEAD...WHY? Because they (the Oceanic 815) were LOST as Sea...EVERYBODY was assumed dead...I am sure ALL the O6 had gravestones that were erected for them...

...So I still don't understand why we can't accept that Jin dies sometime in the next Episodes? Come on...not EVERYONE can make it of The Island...(...except Christian Shephard)...LOL...

FIRST OF ALL PEOPLE...THIS THREAD IS ASSUMING...

***FIRST off it's getting off subject*** Here are the FACTS we should know...

TIMELINE with Jin's (& Sun's) Tombstone. THEY WERE BOTH PRESUMED DEAD! REMEMBER? Oceanic 815 was ASSUMED missing at Sea...THEN (VOILA!) months later they (Widmore & Assoc) "find" the remains of O815...to deep to surface the wreckage...

So...timeline follows...BOTH Jin & Sun were assumed DEAD...WHY? Because they (the Oceanic 815) were LOST as Sea...EVERYBODY was assumed dead...I am sure ALL the O6 had gravestones that were erected for them...

...So I still don't understand why we can't accept that Jin dies sometime in the next Episodes? Come on...not EVERYONE can make it of The Island...(...except Christian Shephard)...LOL...

Actually there is one problem with that theory, that it's just a marker erected when the plane disappered/fake wreckage found... and that is the grave marker is a joint tombstone for both Jin & Sun, but Jin is the only one that has the 'death date'. If it were just erected as a memorial before the 06 got off the island then it would have one for Sun too. So at the very least the tombstone was erected post-06 rescue.

I personally do think that Jin does die on the island this season though, prob in some noble sacrifice to save Sun no doubt though.

Actually there is one problem with that theory, that it's just a marker erected when the plane disappered/fake wreckage found... and that is the grave marker is a joint tombstone for both Jin & Sun, but Jin is the only one that has the 'death date'. If it were just erected as a memorial before the 06 got off the island then it would have one for Sun too. So at the very least the tombstone was erected post-06 rescue.

I personally do think that Jin does die on the island this season though, prob in some noble sacrifice to save Sun no doubt though.

...RIGHT-O!...but idunno if I posted this here or not BUT...the baby is about a month or two old...RIGHT?...so that would be a good eight or so months out from the "rescue" of the O6...That is plenty of time to remove the lettering from Sun's side of the gravestone...

...AND if you would take a look at the gravestone picture...the lettering on the granite headstone is a raised lettering of some sort (I am assuming peweter) that has been attached to the face of the stone...the lettering is not carved into the headstone...check it out...;)

I think that Jin is still on the island. I just watched the enhanced version and they made it a point to tell us that his date of death was the day of the crash. she does have to keep up appearances. I'm sure everyone who had a loved one on that plane had a memorial with a stone and she of course had to add her name even if she knows he's still alive because he may never make it back. also, how many times during her delivery did she see someone and think it was jin or when she asked about her husband. the doctor obviously thought she was just grieving, which she is, but she probably really thought he was there because he's still alive.

I'm starting to think she is having visions of Jin, much like Hurley sees Charlie. I hate to say it but I think Jin is dead why would he leave, I don`t have the patience to look through all the posts to see if you`ve come up with a good answer to why Jin would stay on the Island while Sun leaves, so if you have could you re-post it for me thank you, obviously if there isn`t a good reason then I`d have to say he`s dead, don`t forget Widmores people are more than willing to kill people, plus I don`t think Locke blew up the sub and until we are told otherwise I`m sticken to that thought. Why was he soaking wet?

I'm starting to think she is having visions of Jin, much like Hurley sees Charlie. I hate to say it but I think Jin is dead why would he leave, I don`t have the patience to look through all the posts to see if you`ve come up with a good answer to why Jin would stay on the Island while Sun leaves, so if you have could you re-post it for me thank you, obviously if there isn`t a good reason then I`d have to say he`s dead, don`t forget Widmores people are more than willing to kill people, plus I don`t think Locke blew up the sub and until we are told otherwise I`m sticken to that thought. Why was he soaking wet?
Why would Aaron have gone and not Claire? Initially, everyone was saying she would have had to die, but I just read an article saying that Claire's story could span over the next few years. So if she dies, why would her story go on and on. I certainly hope she doesn't die. Juliet wanted to leave the island. Why didn't she? I don't think any of them had a choice. In the next 5 episodes, they promise to tell us why each of the oceanic 6 got off and how. The only reason why we think he's alive is because the enhanced episode stressed his date of death. If he got off the island and died afterwards, the date would be different. He could have died before she left the island, but I just don't think they would have made a big deal about it. Besides, in the flash forward we did not see jin and neither did she. She just saw a man looking like him in her delirium.

I think the reason Aaron leaves and not Claire is because of the "sickness" and is not related to this thread so I won't go into too mauch detail, but essentially I fell that Aaron can leave because Kate is his constant and he's only 3 or 4 months so his time shifting wouldn't be as bad as the others Losties, if you want to debate that click the Kate and Aaron link in my sig, this is about Jin.

Jin has said several times that he needs Sun, why would he let her leave and not leave with her, that is what I want to know.

I think the reason Aaron leaves and not Claire is because of the "sickness" and is not related to this thread so I won't go into too mauch detail, but essentially I fell that Aaron can leave because Kate is his constant and he's only 3 or 4 months so his time shifting wouldn't be as bad as the others Losties, if you want to debate that click the Kate and Aaron link in my sig, this is about Jin.

Jin has said several times that he needs Sun, why would he let her leave and not leave with her, that is what I want to know.
Whatever about Claire......I was just using an example. I also used the example of Juliet. Sayid and Desmond are on the freighter together, yet Sayid makes it off the island. I don't think that Sayid wants off the island more than Desmond. The point I'm trying to make is that I don't think they have a choice on who leaves the island. Maybe Jin dies before Sun leaves the island, I don't know. I just said that I thought it was interesting that the enhanced version of the episode pointed out that his date of death was the day of the crash as all the others left on the island would have the same date of death, right? I want to know what happens, just like you, and we will find out before the end of the season.

so then we agree he's dead, I think they were focusing on the date of his death because it was on the screen and if you, not you specifically just people in general, weren't quick enough you would have missed it, I did the first time, but yes I do want to know what happens.

Relating to Desmond, just because we haven't seen him off the Island doesn't mean he is still on the Island, he would not be a member of the O6 and could easily blend into boat crew without being noticed, no one but the crew would know who was on the boat, so they could continue to hide the Island by saying Desmond wasa just part of the crew, or he's dead, either way I can't wait to find out.

I'm not attacking your post I'm just saying.

How could Jin have died when we saw him give the teddy bear to the man that was standing in front of the door to the room in which Sun was with the baby? The question is how can he be dead when we saw him alive just a few minutes earlier and why does he say "don't rush me I've only been married two months" when the nurse asks him when he is going to have a child? What is going on here?

That was a flashback, the panda was for another person, Chinese ambassader's wife, the panda was a gift from Jin's boss, Sun's dad.

flashbacks for Jin and flashforwards for sun.

That was a flashback, the panda was for another person, Chinese ambassader's wife, the panda was a gift from Jin's boss, Sun's dad.

flashbacks for Jin and flashforwards for sun.

Oh okay. That makes more sense. I will have to rewatch the episode. Thanks for clearing that up a bit.

Jin has said several times that he needs Sun, why would he let her leave and not leave with her, that is what I want to know.

He would let Sun leave so that their baby will live.

If it becomes a constraint of "x" number of spaces left for rescue, Jin would INSIST Sun go without him if it guaranteed her being rescued.

He would let Sun leave so that their baby will live.

If it becomes a constraint of "x" number of spaces left for rescue, Jin would INSIST Sun go without him if it guaranteed her being rescued.

I actually just thought of that right before I read your post.

My guess:

Jin did not make it off the island. Sun presumes him dead along with everyone else left on the island ... and even if she doesn't presume Jin dead, she has to at least keep up that ruse because it is part of the bargain of the Oceanic 6 that they were the only survivors of the crash. Sun has to lie to herself and everyone around her and pretend that Jin died in the crash along with the other 316 victims (plus the two who initially survived but died before rescue). That means Jin's grave is really only a headstone.

That means that the O6 consists of: Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sun, and one of (Aaron, Michael, Walt) depending on how they want to spin the last member. Or, conversely, there is one additional member of the O6 who ends up being the person in the box but we haven't gotten to that point in the story yet. (Though we were supposed to know the full (O6 by this episode, per D&C).

This is where I think the writers messed up. I don't think the Airlines would allow Aaron to be considered a survivor. I'm sure their lawyers would have a field day with that, unless there was bad publicity and the airlines had to claim Aaron.
Kate would need to show that she was pregnant when she got onto the plane, which she wasn't. Kate had been in custody, and they would have taken her blood work already. HOWEVER, Claire would have a case for her baby and would have settled out of court with the Airlines for a settlement for her baby. So, if the airlines handled it correctly, the baby wouldn't be listed as one of the O6.
There is no reason Jin couldn't still be alive and they are trying to cover for him. The body in the grave could have been someone else from the freighter. However, the story would be better if he dies saving his wife and child.

What we don't know is what sort of story is being told about Aaron. If he's supposed to be the child of an eight-month's pregnant Oceanic passenger who died giving birth on the island, her estate would certainly be able to recover damages on his behalf; the families of all the dead would get big settlements too. If Kate is claiming him as her own but conceived on-island, he might be technically ineligible. But I'm seeing no way now unless the O6 leap ahead in time that Kate can claim to be the biological mother.

I don't, however, think they routinely do blood work or pregnancy tests on fugitives who've just been apprehended, so if she wants to claim to have been five months pregnant before the flight, she might have a chance of selling that story.

The name "Oceanic Six" is no doubt a media term, not a legal one, and since Aaron wouldn't exist except for his mother's surviving the crash of 815, he would certainly not be excluded from the designation. There's been way too much hair-splitting about this term, which to me pretty clearly means everyone who got rescued when these folks did.

Cardie

Jin has said several times that he needs Sun, why would he let her leave and not leave with her, that is what I want to know.

What ever happened Jin would have risked everything for his wife and child. Jin's sacrifice, whether alive on the Island or dead, allowed his wife and child to live! Jin is one of the good guys! :cool:

What ever happened Jin would have risked everything for his wife and child. Jin's sacrifice, whether alive on the Island or dead, allowed his wife and child to live! Jin is one of the good guys! :cool:
ABSOLUTELY!!!:)

I don't, however, think they routinely do blood work or pregnancy tests on fugitives who've just been apprehended, so if she wants to claim to have been five months pregnant before the flight, she might have a chance of selling that story.



They do, they have to for insurance reasons... (no diseases from other inmates, no inmate can claim to be raped/impregnated by a prison employee, got a disease from a prison employee, etc.).

They do, they have to for insurance reasons... (no diseases from other inmates, no inmate can claim to be raped/impregnated by a prison employee, got a disease from a prison employee, etc.).

Sure, they'd do that if she entered a prison, but the Marshal simply took her into custody and got on the plane with her. She'd have just been in her own cell while held in the Austrailian police station, not in general population.

Cardie

Sure, they'd do that if she entered a prison, but the Marshal simply took her into custody and got on the plane with her. She'd have just been in her own cell while held in the Austrailian police station, not in general population.

Cardie
Sorry, maybe I'm remembering wrong about Kate.

Yet, it really doesn't matter to this thread, so I'll stop there.

Jin could be in hiding! Another possible angle to this complex story. Jin was working for Sun's father and they were trying to escape the business. Perhaps Sun just went back to Korea to have the baby and will meet up with Jin later? How else can they avoid Paik?

I forgot about that. I'm sure they hope they can meet up again! Whatever it is, I totally think he's still alive. Only 5 episodes to find out!.

I read where Lost is negotiating with ABC to have one more episode added, probably for a 2-hour finale! That would be awesome.:biggrin:

I forgot about that. I'm sure they hope they can meet up again! Whatever it is, I totally think he's still alive. Only 5 episodes to find out!.

I read where Lost is negotiating with ABC to have one more episode added, probably for a 2-hour finale! That would be awesome.:biggrin:

It's already been confirmed as a 3hr finale, part I on the 15th, then a 2hr part II on the 29th.

It's already been confirmed as a 3hr finale, part I on the 15th, then a 2hr part II on the 29th.
So does that mean a total of six hours and not five?

Yes, it does, but please don't continue the discussion in this thread, it's pretty off topic. ;)

I'm going to hope the writers have Jin still alive and hiding from Paik. It would be so cool to see Jin and Sun meet up in one of the finale episodes! Love to see Desmond and Penny together, too.

I'm going to hope the writers have Jin still alive and hiding from Paik. It would be so cool to see Jin and Sun meet up in one of the finale episodes! Love to see Desmond and Penny together, too.
Me too, I would also like to see, if they are gonna kill him, him die doing something incredibly heroic to save his wife and daughter and perhaps the whole group of losties, ala Charlie. I do hope he isn't dead.

I'm going to hope the writers have Jin still alive and hiding from Paik. It would be so cool to see Jin and Sun meet up in one of the finale episodes! Love to see Desmond and Penny together, too.
Heh...my view of Lost is just soooo different. What will you think if Jin turns out to be alive and hiding with Mr. Paik's help? And if Jin & Sun are friends but were never sincerely lovers? And if Desmond & Penny never loved each other either and aren't even friends?

Robert

Heh...my view of Lost is just soooo different. What will you think if Jin turns out to be alive and hiding with Mr. Paik's help? And if Jin & Sun are friends but were never sincerely lovers? And if Desmond & Penny never loved each other either and aren't even friends?

Robert

This type of theory wouldn't hold my interest in the show... I would stop watching. HOWEVER, I do believe Penny could be using Desmond. Remember in 1996 Penny and Desmond broke up. What made her change her mind? Paik doesn't like Jin, he wouldn't help Jin.
Some new interesting characters coming up which may explain some more of this! I'm so excited! I'm so addicted. :redface:

This type of theory wouldn't hold my interest in the show... I would stop watching.
Too late. They're saving its revelation for the all-time conclusion, after which you'll stop watching anyway because there ain't no more. So it doesn't have to hold your interest.

Too late. They're saving its revelation for the all-time conclusion, after which you'll stop watching anyway because there ain't no more. So it doesn't have to hold your interest.

Okay, than I'll just cry!:frown: Gee, I would enjoy at least ONE happy ending. I vote for Hurley!

Okay, than I'll just cry!:frown: Gee, I would enjoy at least ONE happy ending. I vote for Hurley!
Is a happy ending one that leaves you happy or characters happy? Those may not go together! (For instance, Jin & Sun may be perfectly happy with other lovers.)

Is a happy ending one that leaves you happy or characters happy? Those may not go together! (For instance, Jin & Sun may be perfectly happy with other lovers.)

Okay, you're just sick in the head! Like some kind of mass O thing? I thought I was strange!:biggrin: (All in good fun, okay.. :biggrin: Feel free to throw it back!)

Too late. They're saving its revelation for the all-time conclusion, after which you'll stop watching anyway because there ain't no more. So it doesn't have to hold your interest.

* sigh *

Hiya peeps! I came by this thread late cuz someone just asked me something about Jin's headstone, and a search for a headstone screenshot brought me here. I've read a few pages of posts, but I don't have time to read all 29! Anyway, in case you don't have a translation of the headstone, here it is (I got my mom to translate it):

The date on the far right (9/22/2004) is the date of Jin's death.
The date to the immediate left of that (11/27/1974) is the date of Jin's birth.
The top two symbols of the main middle part is Nam Hae, which is apparently Jin's nickname & translates literally into "South Seas."
The rest of the main middle part means Jin Su Kwon's grave.
The left part lists Sun Hwa Baek as his wife and has her birthdate (3/20/1980).

As others have noted, Jin's death date on the headstone is the date of the crash. Given that it specifically lists the grave as Jin's, I don't think it's a double grave (as some have suggested). I'm guessing it was therefore erected after the Oceanic 6 got off the island. I'll leave the rest of the guessing to you all. :) Thanks for the screenshot!