Just talking with one of my friends about LOST theories and realized something, you know how "the island" wouldn't let Michael kill himslef? Does the same thing apply to Jack when he tried to jump off the bridge and the car accident behind him stopped him? Was that the island not letting him kill himself or just a freak accident? If it was the island, we can assume that means the island still has some use for Jack...

Any thoughts? Were there any other instances of the O6 experiencing events such as these?

Yes, it's the same type of course correction because Jack "has got work to do." And the most glaring example to me is the fact that Jack and Locke were both first prevented from killing themselves in TTLG and then killing each other. Locke mysteriously couldn't shoot Jack, even though he'd knifed a woman in the back thirty seconds earlier with the exact same purpose in mind and then when Jack wanted to shoot him in this season premiere, his gun had no bullets in it.

Desmond was about to kill himself as well when Locke started banging on the hatch door back in season one.

How about when Hurley was going to jump off the cliff when Dave showed up?

Yes, given what Tom said to Michael, and the failed attempts to kill himself it does show the bridge incident in TTLG in a new light, the car crash did prevent Jack from jumping, so it does seem like the island won't let him kill himself. I wonder if the island would prevent someone from being killed off island. I suppose will know if in a flashforward if someone fires a gun at one of the Oceanic 6 and it jams or they're hit by a car.

How about when Hurley was going to jump off the cliff when Dave showed up?

Dave was trying to get Hurley to jump. Libby showed up and saved Hurley.

I wonder if the island would prevent someone from being killed off island. I suppose will know if in a flashforward if someone fires a gun at one of the Oceanic 6 and it jams or they're hit by a car.

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but the answer given "Meet Kevin Johnson" seems pretty clearly YES, or at least that's what we're led to believe, right? Michael is OFF ISLAND (although not exactly in a flash forward, maybe that was your concern?) and the gun jams and he survives a car wreck that he shouldn't have.

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but the answer given "Meet Kevin Johnson" seems pretty clearly YES, or at least that's what we're led to believe, right? Michael is OFF ISLAND (although not exactly in a flash forward, maybe that was your concern?) and the gun jams and he survives a car wreck that he shouldn't have.
I suppose I should clarify, all the harm Michael incurred or could have incurred was self inflicted, and Tom said the island won't let you kill yourself so in terms of suicide yes they are protected. What I was wondering was if the island would protect them from being killed by other people, for instance if Sayid hadn't been able to get to his gun would Elsa's gun have jammed? So yes we have confirmation on the suicide and that might extend to protection from others trying to kill you. Like I said, I guess we'll know in a flash forward if someone is pointing a gun at one of the Oceanic 6 and something happens to prevent it from firing.

I suppose I should clarify, all the harm Michael incurred or could have incurred was self inflicted, and Tom said the island won't let you kill yourself so in terms of suicide yes they are protected. What I was wondering was if the island would protect them from being killed by other people, for instance if Sayid hadn't been able to get to his gun would Elsa's gun have jammed? So yes we have confirmation on the suicide and that might extend to protection from others trying to kill you. Like I said, I guess we'll know in a flash forward if someone is pointing a gun at one of the Oceanic 6 and something happens to prevent it from firing.

Okay, I see you were asking if the island would let you die by non-self-inflicted means? This is hard to support or refute as we've mainly only had instances of attempted suicides thus far to base theorizing on, although Elsa conveniently doesn't shoot Sayid to kill, which seems odd, since she had time to make a kill, no? OTOH, I don't see why it would prevent you from self-inflicted death but not other-inflicted, since the end result--death--is the same in both cases. Lastly, it seems to me a bit of a stretch to imagine Ben to be behind all this in terms of preventing Jack and Michael from committing suicide, esp in Jack's case as he would have had to have organized the woman's car crash at just the right moment to prevent Jack from jumping ... But given Ben's surveillance-taking abilities I guess it is not out of the realm of possibility. Also, Michael was driving mighty fast into that wall ... so I think there is genuinely something metaphysical going on here to explain their inability to die off island, the need to avoid time travel paradoxes perhaps.

Okay, I see you were asking if the island would let you die by non-self-inflicted means? This is hard to support or refute as we've mainly only had instances of attempted suicides thus far to base theorizing on, although Elsa conveniently doesn't shoot Sayid to kill, which seems odd, since she had time to make a kill, no? OTOH, I don't see why it would prevent you from self-inflicted death but not other-inflicted, since the end result--death--is the same in both cases. Lastly, it seems to me a bit of a stretch to imagine Ben to be behind all this in terms of preventing Jack and Michael from committing suicide, esp in Jack's case as he would have had to have organized the woman's car crash at just the right moment to prevent Jack from jumping ... But given Ben's surveillance-taking abilities I guess it is not out of the realm of possibility. Also, Michael was driving mighty fast into that wall ... so I think there is genuinely something metaphysical going on here to explain their inability to die off island, the need to avoid time travel paradoxes perhaps.
The thing with Sayid and Elsa is that it was just a case of Sayid firing first, if that is island metaphysics I don't know.

The thing with Sayid and Elsa is that it was just a case of Sayid firing first, if that is island metaphysics I don't know.
Elsa shot him, just not in the right place to kill him. Compare Ben shooting Locke where his kidney should have been.

Another way of looking at it goes back to the concept of "course correction" as opposed to "island metaphysics". If someone is not meant to die, they can't kill themselves or be killed. Just like if you are meant to die, there is nothing you can do to prevent it (e.g. Charlie). If you try to prevent, course correction kicks in and gets you a different way.

This is a device that the writers use to supposedly prevent paradoxes from occurring. In other words, knowledge of the future events can not change future events from occurring.

Another way of looking at it goes back to the concept of "course correction" as opposed to "island metaphysics". If someone is not meant to die, they can't kill themselves or be killed. Just like if you are meant to die, there is nothing you can do to prevent it (e.g. Charlie). If you try to prevent, course correction kicks in and gets you a different way.

This is a device that the writers use to supposedly prevent paradoxes from occurring. In other words, knowledge of the future events can not change future events from occurring.

Exactly Roger! Whether it be The Island or Course Correction and Fate...there are many times that the Losties should have or could have died but didn't.
Examples:
-Locke should have died when Cooper pushed him out the window of the high rise but he didn't.
- Hurley on the deck where I think 8 other people died
- Claire when she survived the car crash that put her mom in the coma
- Kate was involved in a couple car crashes but was basically unharmed
- Ana Lucia when she was attacked and shot by Jason
- maybe even Sarah's "miracle" when Jack "fixed" her so she could walk again.

And I'd say the Losties that survived the plane crash is an example as well.

I definetly think the island won't let Jack die. Which is why I think he knows he has to go back

It struck me that Locke's dad was dying in a car accident when -- "Whoosh" -- he woke up in the Black Rock. Isn't that how he explained it to Locke when he thought they were all dead and he was in hell? Did the Island do that? Could Ben have done that? And to what purpose would either of them have done that? Maybe to give Locke the ultimate test of faith, which we saw happening, to see if he's worthy of being the new Jacob or whatever?

If the island can keep people from dying, it seems to have some sort of criteria it follows as to whom to spare and whom to off.

I think I found the answer to my question as to whether the island will protect someone from harm inflicted by another person. Remember in TBOTE when Jack pulled the gun on Locke and squeezed the trigger twice and nothing happened. Just a few hours before in show time Locke fired two shots at Jack. The gun held 6-8 bullets, I can't remember the exact number, but there were and should have been bullets in that gun, and probably were but the island didn't want Locke to die. So I guess the island will protect someone from being killed by someone else.

That's what I thought as well...

Yes, it's the same type of course correction because Jack "has got work to do." And the most glaring example to me is the fact that Jack and Locke were both first prevented from killing themselves in TTLG and then killing each other. Locke mysteriously couldn't shoot Jack, even though he'd knifed a woman in the back thirty seconds earlier with the exact same purpose in mind and then when Jack wanted to shoot him in this season premiere, his gun had no bullets in it.

It struck me that Locke's dad was dying in a car accident when -- "Whoosh" -- he woke up in the Black Rock. Isn't that how he explained it to Locke when he thought they were all dead and he was in hell? Did the Island do that? Could Ben have done that? And to what purpose would either of them have done that? Maybe to give Locke the ultimate test of faith, which we saw happening, to see if he's worthy of being the new Jacob or whatever?

If the island can keep people from dying, it seems to have some sort of criteria it follows as to whom to spare and whom to off.


Well he didn't just Whoosh though..he saw one of the guys in the ambulance smile before he Whooshed...I figured that was probably one of Bens people..

Living through the car crash though....would it only apply if he was trying to kill himself Because if someone tries to kill you I wouldn't think that would be a good indicator it was your time....

Tom said the island wouldn't let him kill himself...not that he couldnt die.