I found some sites about Sumba...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumba

But I can't find Membata which is where the O6 are said to have washed up upon after the plane went down.
Is it not a real Island?

I still dont get it. That is still way off from the real Flight 815's flight path. That is actually closer to where the 'fake' crash was found.....

So are Widmore and Oceanic working together?

I think that the O6 was leaving the island just as it was moving and was caught up in part of the move and crashed near the island they was found on.

I still dont get it. That is still way off from the real Flight 815's flight path. That is actually closer to where the 'fake' crash was found.....

So are Widmore and Oceanic working together?

I think though it is near Flight 815's scheduled flight path....
I believe Widmore is connnected to Oceanic....Abaddon was supposedly an Oceanic rep too. If you played the Flight 815 game, it seemed as though Oceanic was involved in the "conspiracy".

Anyways, still no explanation for why the freaking plane flew in the opposite direction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

Is it not a real Island?

I think they said it was an uncharted island, so it is probably not known.

Anyways, still no explanation for why the freaking plane flew in the opposite direction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It didn't. That's part of the lie.

I think they said it was an uncharted island, so it is probably not known.
Ahhhh! I didn't hear that part! Thanks!
Like your s/n! :smile:
100%
Anyways, still no explanation for why the freaking plane flew in the opposite direction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

:undecide: You're right! Guess that's one of those things we may never know.

It didn't. That's part of the lie.

Flight 815 was heading to LA. That is a fact. And that is East of Sidney.Yet the plane and the 'fake' island is located in the Sunda Trench. So the flight 815, according to the Oceanic Lie, must have flown WEST, in other words, not towards LA.
There is still no explanation for that.
100%
Ahhhh! I didn't hear that part! Thanks!
Like your s/n! :smile:
100%


:undecide: You're right! Guess that's one of those things we may never know.

NO WAY. They must be holding that info back for later on. But still makes no sense that not a single piece of news since the discovery of the Bali crash, and now the Oceanic Press Conference, have made any reference to that HUGE discrepancy.

Flight 815 was heading to LA. That is a fact. And that is East of Sidney.Yet the plane and the 'fake' island is located in the Sunda Trench. So the flight 815, according to the Oceanic Lie, must have flown WEST, in other words, not towards LA.
There is still no explanation for that.

The way that I read what you said was that the ACTUAL plane flew in the wrong direction. Sorry. Miscommunication.

Flight 815 was heading to LA. That is a fact. And that is East of Sidney.Yet the plane and the 'fake' island is located in the Sunda Trench. So the flight 815, according to the Oceanic Lie, must have flown WEST, in other words, not towards LA.


BINGO! A flight from YSSY [i.e. Sydney Int'l] to KLAX [Los Angeles Int'l] would have flown almost a direct path NE and would have NEVER flown anywhere REMOTELY near Sunda. They could have gotten away with saying an uncharted/undiscovered island ANYWHERE in Polynesia. Hell, even somewhere in Micronesia would have been more believable, though a bit of a real world stretch. But NO commercial airliner would fly west from Sydney to get to LA. Even the trip EAST is 13 long hours.

I mean what, will moving the Island actually ALSO move AUSTRALIA? because in that case, if it shuffled Australia and the entirety of Indonesia, then I'd be having this Sunda Trench crap. Until then, this goes right into the 'WTF were they thinking??' category.

My only guess for this is that the staged crash was off the coast of Bali, and so they placed the survivors in that general area as far as the Lie goes.

But the question DOES remain: WHY was the original staged crash far west of where it should have logically been? Even someone with NO aeronautical navigation knowledge can look at a globe and see that the flight would go east and never even CONSIDER passing Bali, which is Westnorthwest of Australia.

If you check out Sumba (available in high-res) on Google Earth you'll see there's no visible island (uninhabited or otherwise) in this area. Interestingly, though, all the satellite images of the area on GE date from shortly after the crash - early October 2004.

So are Widmore and Oceanic working together?

Honestly, at this stage I wouldn't be surprised if we find out next season that Oceanic Airlines is owned by Widmore. Or he'd be a shareholder with a controlling stake (like Sun with her dad's company) at the very least.

Honestly, at this stage I wouldn't be surprised if we find out next season that Oceanic Airlines is owned by Widmore. Or he'd be a shareholder with a controlling stake (like Sun with her dad's company) at the very least.
I'm almost positive Widmore and Oceanic are connected...Widmore may very well own it.
In the Lost Game,FIND 815.....It was strongly implied that whoever staged the crash was in cahoots with Oceanic to cover up the truth about Flight 815.

But the question DOES remain: WHY was the original staged crash far west of where it should have logically been? Even someone with NO aeronautical navigation knowledge can look at a globe and see that the flight would go east and never even CONSIDER passing Bali, which is Westnorthwest of Australia.

A hijacking attempt is the only possible reason I can come up with for the plane to be where it is. There was one confirmed Iraqi terrorist on board (Sayid in Australia), and Widmore could have easily made a story of his trying to take it to an Islamic country and caused it to crash at sea to the glory of Allah, or something like that. Will there be a staged recording on the black box incriminating him?

So there are two questions here:
1) Why stage the crash so far from a plausible location?
I think the only answer that makes sense is that they had to stage it somewhere that had the "unique geological properties" required to carry it off. In other words, an end of a wormhole, which probably leaves you with limited choices.
2) What is the lie that oceanic is telling to explain why the plane flew West instead of East? And when will we find out?
I can't think of anything other than a hijacking, but no one in the press seems to be mentioning that. Maybe an extreme equipment failure that prevented them from steering the plane? The onboard computer became self-aware and took control from the pilots, and was trying to make it back to Taiwan where he was manufactured?

HansoAir bought out Oceanic....
http://www.hansoair.org/

Do you think there is a connection between Widmore and Hanso??

It's logical, since we already believe Widmore to be involved in the DI.

.
But the question DOES remain: WHY was the original staged crash far west of where it should have logically been? .
Because it wasn't staged. It may be a good time to consider this.
So there are two questions here:
1) Why stage the crash so far from a plausible location?
.
2) What is the lie that oceanic is telling to explain why the plane flew West instead of East? And when will we find out?

1. Why stage a crash at all, has always been my question.
2. Since the black box is on the freighter,the Sunda wreckage is too deep to recover, and no one in the "real world" has any reason to suspect foul on the part of Oceanic....the explanation can be that they have no explanation.

this hansoair website is a phony...

fiy, membata means "uncertain" in indonesian...

So there are two questions here:
1) Why stage the crash so far from a plausible location?
I think the only answer that makes sense is that they had to stage it somewhere that had the "unique geological properties" required to carry it off. In other words, an end of a wormhole, which probably leaves you with limited choices.
2) What is the lie that oceanic is telling to explain why the plane flew West instead of East? And when will we find out?
I can't think of anything other than a hijacking, but no one in the press seems to be mentioning that. Maybe an extreme equipment failure that prevented them from steering the plane? The onboard computer became self-aware and took control from the pilots, and was trying to make it back to Taiwan where he was manufactured?

They might put the blame on the Pilot...since he's dead,he can't deny anything.
100%
It's logical, since we already believe Widmore to be involved in the DI.
Via the Lost Experience ARG from the summer before last.....Widmore was a financial contributor to the Hanso Foundation.

And,yep...KG, that HansoAir site is bogus.

So there are two questions here:
1) Why stage the crash so far from a plausible location?
I think the only answer that makes sense is that they had to stage it somewhere that had the "unique geological properties" required to carry it off. In other words, an end of a wormhole, which probably leaves you with limited choices.
2) What is the lie that oceanic is telling to explain why the plane flew West instead of East? And when will we find out?
I can't think of anything other than a hijacking, but no one in the press seems to be mentioning that. Maybe an extreme equipment failure that prevented them from steering the plane? The onboard computer became self-aware and took control from the pilots, and was trying to make it back to Taiwan where he was manufactured?

Well, for your first question, it's possible, i suppose, and maybe we'll get a real explanation. I'm still scratching my head, meanwhile. :p

For your second question.... I would think if they wanted to play the hijack card, they would have mentioned it. But Oceanic actually doesn't GIVE a reason for why 815 crashed, which is curious in and of itself. Usually the FIRST thing that happens is the airline finds someone to lay the blame on, THEN they get into the other details. A major intercontinental airliner like Oceanic is supposed to represent would be VERY interested in retrieving the black box and/or investigating the cause of the crash because if they can't explain WHAT happened, people will be less likely to fly with them for fear of a repeat accident.

A hijacking attempt is the only possible reason I can come up with for the plane to be where it is. There was one confirmed Iraqi terrorist on board (Sayid in Australia), and Widmore could have easily made a story of his trying to take it to an Islamic country and caused it to crash at sea to the glory of Allah, or something like that. Will there be a staged recording on the black box incriminating him?

There's two things I want to address with your post.

First, I don't recall Sayid being a confirmed Iraqi terrorist. :confused: I remember he pretended to be one for an ep, but he never actually WAS one.

Second, the thing with a hijack attempt is that people would KNOW about it, they would DISCUSS it, especially after 9/11. First of all, air traffic control would have either been directly told it was hijacked [by the 815 flight crew], or they would have figured something was up when the plane started veering off course. And in THAT case, 815 would have found itself being escorted by fighter jets.

However, we know with the ACTUAL 815, they lost communication with ATC and turned back for FIJI. [this would have never happened IRL, it's the Hollywood effect so those of us with insider knowledge just take it with a deep margarita, the same way a doctor might laugh off medical stretches of the show.] Now, that being the case, 815 STILL shouldn't have ended up in Indonesia, as there are a multitude of nice airports in Austalia, way before one gets to Indonesia.

So even if Oceanic uses half-truths to say there was lost comms and call the actual crash itself pilot error, there's still NO REASON for the plane to be on the wrong side of Australia, and I can guarantee that a plane NOT talking to ATC would not be flying around arbitrarily PAST Australia, with its plethora of suitable airports, WITHOUT getting some kind of military intercept.

So what's up with that?

Because it wasn't staged. It may be a good time to consider this.

Wait..... what? It WAS staged. Many characters have said it was staged.

1. Why stage a crash at all, has always been my question.
2. Since the black box is on the freighter,the Sunda wreckage is too deep to recover, and no one in the "real world" has any reason to suspect foul on the part of Oceanic....the explanation can be that they have no explanation.

1. That's a VERY good question, and one I can't even begin to answer, LOL.
2. See earlier in my post. And I can think of a very good, very OBVIOUS reason to suspect foul.... the fact that the plane was on the wrong side of the continent it departed from.

I'm probably wrong, since I would think someone else would have mentioned it already, plus my memory is a bit sketchy (but with so much stuff to try and keep up with, who's isn't) but in the first season when they crashed the pilot admitted that they wouldn't be found because they were way off course for whatever reason. Couldn't the losties use this same explanation to use if / when confronted by the press as to why the fake crash was off course?

I'm probably wrong, since I would think someone else would have mentioned it already, plus my memory is a bit sketchy (but with so much stuff to try and keep up with, who's isn't) but in the first season when they crashed the pilot admitted that they wouldn't be found because they were way off course for whatever reason. Couldn't the losties use this same explanation to use if / when confronted by the press as to why the fake crash was off course?
But he didn't say why they headed in the wrong direction from Sydney(from take off).

From Lostpedia.....
"The pilot tells Jack and Kate that the plane had lost radio contact before the crash and had changed course towards Fiji. They were, in his reckoning, 1000 miles off course and thus no one knows where they are."

By the way,The Black Rock began it's final voyage headed in the wrong direction too...it was stated by traders at a Papua New Guinea port that the ship set sail east instead of west.

Both headed in the wrong direction from the onset!

To answer the question as to why stage the crash, I thought I heard, read, saw, or made up completely, that the reason was to prevent anyone from searching near the island, less it be found...the island, not the real 815.

That';s the onyl reason to stage the crash.

I found some sites about Sumba...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumba

But I can't find Membata which is where the O6 are said to have washed up upon after the plane went down.
Is it not a real Island?
http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season4/4x12/4x13-cap-320.jpg

Hey, thanks for the map of Sumba. i had scaled it off my atlas, and was a little off. it is 133 x 70 miles (converted from km's) the point is that Lostia would look much bigger than Membata when seen next to it. Hydra Island, (no map of it that i recall) was said i think, to be about 3x1 miles, so very small, and closer to the likely size of Membata.

I gave you credit for this theory I summarized,i thought you were working up to here on Sat.:(but i don't see it now...wrong thread?)

"A current one i think Addie started (or was working up to when i last saw it) is that:

a. Just to be safe:the O6 escape the 'big island' by the chopper. It is going to crash, but they don't want to go back...sooo..

b. they get on or near to the Hydra Island. It is much closer in size and shape to Membata than the main island.

c. after the 'big move' happens (they see purple sky, the weird noises, etc.), the big island cannot be seen anymore. They have no idea what happened.

d. they take off in the zodiac that was on the chopper (assuming there was one.) or one they find on Hydra....the coord's that Mikie used?

e. they wash up on Sumba just like in the photo of it we saw. Begin the cover story.
Oceanic is owned by Widmore/Paik/Hanso, whatever. they have to keep to the story to get the $ and save the other Losties. (i think i remember the letter that says Hanso buys Oceanic after the crash happened...again to keep the cover up going.)

f. TPTB establish a "no fly zone" over Hydra/Membata until they can 'clean it up'. They could claim any # of reasons to do it. Happens all the time that info gets 'sequestered'. Not as much 'free press' as most seem to think.

g. Since it moved to there, good chance it could move again as the EM power wears off."

http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season4/4x12/4x13-cap-320.jpg

Hey, thanks for the map of Sumba. i had scaled it off my atlas, and was a little off. it is 133 x 70 miles (converted from km's) the point is that Lostia would look much bigger than Membata when seen next to it. Hydra Island, (no map of it that i recall) was said i think, to be about 3x1 miles, so very small, and closer to the likely size of Membata.

I gave you credit for this theory I summarized,i thought you were working up to here on Sat.:(but i don't see it now...wrong thread?)

"A current one i think Addie started (or was working up to when i last saw it) is that:

a. Just to be safe:the O6 escape the 'big island' by the chopper. It is going to crash, but they don't want to go back...sooo..

b. they get on or near to the Hydra Island. It is much closer in size and shape to Membata than the main island.

c. after the 'big move' happens (they see purple sky, the weird noises, etc.), the big island cannot be seen anymore. They have no idea what happened.

d. they take off in the zodiac that was on the chopper (assuming there was one.) or one they find on Hydra....the coord's that Mikie used?

e. they wash up on Sumba just like in the photo of it we saw. Begin the cover story.
Oceanic is owned by Widmore/Paik/Hanso, whatever. they have to keep to the story to get the $ and save the other Losties. (i think i remember the letter that says Hanso buys Oceanic after the crash happened...again to keep the cover up going.)

f. TPTB establish a "no fly zone" over Hydra/Membata until they can 'clean it up'. They could claim any # of reasons to do it. Happens all the time that info gets 'sequestered'. Not as much 'free press' as most seem to think.

g. Since it moved to there, good chance it could move again as the EM power wears off."

Thanks for the credit but it wasn't me. :confused:
I did say "C" somewhere but not the rest. Although I agree with most of it!
I do think the sky will torn purple,the Island will shake and it will disappear right as the O6 take off and or at the time the feighter blows. I think Sun and Aaron will be floating in debris or they will get on the chopper just as it blows up.
Then I do think the chopper crashes which maybe when they "wash ashore" at "Membata" OR even better Penny shows up to rescue them and tells Daddy which is when the coverup begins....

I really like your idea that the Hydra is Membata but I think the Hydra moves with the Island. I think it is all one land mass underneath.

Then I do think the chopper crashes which maybe when they "wash ashore" at "Membata" OR even better Penny shows up to rescue them and tells Daddy which is when the coverup begins....

I really like your idea that the Hydra is Membata but I think the Hydra moves with the Island. I think it is all one land mass underneath.

But then how does it move, float or fly? I want it to fly! Like Gulliver's "Laputa"!

I'm almost positive Widmore and Oceanic are connected...Widmore may very well own it.
In the Lost Game,FIND 815.....It was strongly implied that whoever staged the crash was in cahoots with Oceanic to cover up the truth about Flight 815.

I'd agree, if oceanic were innocent why would they sell widmore a plane that he could sink?

If it was plane bought after it was scrapped oceanic would have insisted that the decals be removed, I suppose the decals could have been faked. Seems more plausible that widmore is controlling oceanic somehow.

Well, the plane in the Sunda trench was found about a months earlier,
so I guess there was plenty of news conferences and press
when that happened.

Press conferences don't cover all subjects at large, they would
never end otherwise.

Well I saw a map of where the actual plane may have crashed, between Fiji and Samoa, and noticed an interesting geographical feature: the Tonga Trench. According to Wikipedia:

The Tonga Trench is located in the Pacific Ocean (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Ocean) and is 10,882 meters (35,702 ft) deep at its deepest point, known as the Horizon Deep

This means, according to my research, that the Tonga Trench is deeper than the Sunda Trench. If the conspirators just wanted to plant the plane wreckage so deep that it could not be brought up and examined, than why not this site? Of course that might run the risk of drawing attention to the general area. Also I found the fact that this deep point in the Tonga Trench is called Horizon Deep appealing. Sounds cool.

I said the same thing earlier, they could have dropped it in the mariana trench, which in the pacific and the deepest point on earth. There is no rhyme or reason for the Sunda trench plane unless its not faked, but its a plane at the endpoint of a wormhole.